Cavs 09-10 Season (official thread)

[Piney]

Mike Brown is a mediocre (to be kind) coach blessed with a great player and a good supporting cast. if anything will be this team's downfall this season, it'll be him.

That's what I am afraid of.

I know this is WAAAAAAAAAY premature, but if this season is a disappointment because Mike Brown can't handle it and he gets fired, it will be a very interesting coaching seach/off-season. Cuz if I was a name head coach I want to make sure LeBron is staying before I come here, and if I am LeBron I want to make sure I like/approve the new head coach before I sign. A chicken and egg situation that could get ugly.

But things will get sorted out as everyone gets use to the new rotations and new bodies.

 

[Piney]

Z and Shaq together worked against boston.

It worked until Boston countered by bringing in Rasheed forcing Z & Shaq to play outside.

Really Z & Shaq on the floor together can ONLY work when the opposing team's frontcourt cannot stretch the floor. ie Sheed & Garnett and Bosh & Bargnani. While more conventional type frontcourts like Garnett & Perkins we can get away with it. But if both the C & PF are quick and can play away from the paint, it is a HORRIBLE mismatch.

 

[DubCoffman62]

Did you watch the playoffs? This team NEEDED a big man in the middle. They went out and got one. Shaq is not even close to the reason for this start.


Um, 2 games in. A lot of new personnel getting key minutes. Naturally it's gonna take time to develop a rhythm. They miss DWest badly. Once he gets back, Mo Williams can go back to playing the game the way it best suits him and Parker will be much more effective coming off the bench. The first two games were dissapointing, but we still have (arguably) the best basketball player on the planet, a big man in the middle and what should be very deep bench. They'll come around. And take that "last year in a Cavs uniform" garbage somewhere else. There hasn't even been the slightest hint that he's going anywhere. That [censored] is beyond tired...I now have a standing order to ding anybody that mentions that sht in this thread from here on out.

Snaq may have been a good acquisition 5 years ago but I'd have passed on him. Not only is he a shell of his former self his ego still doesn't realize it. I hope it works out but I remain skeptical. Besides it was Hedo that hurt us most against Orlando. That's why I think Rasheed Wallace would've been a better pick up, he's an inside-outside threat and he makes his free throws.
As far as LeBron staying or going I'm just putting myself in his shoes. He's young, wealthy and one of the top 5 athletes in the world I would argue. Why would he want to play in a dump like Cleveland when he could go to say New York, Los Angeles, Chicago or Miami? With the exception of Detriot and possibly Oklahoma City, Cleveland has to be one of the least desirable places to play. I'd love for him to stay but if he leaves I wouldn't blame him one bit.

 

[tsteele316]

Snaq may have been a good acquisition 5 years ago but I'd have passed on him. Not only is he a shell of his former self his ego still doesn't realize it. I hope it works out but I remain skeptical. Besides it was Hedo that hurt us most against Orlando. That's why I think Rasheed Wallace would've been a better pick up, he's an inside-outside threat and he makes his free throws.
As far as LeBron staying or going I'm just putting myself in his shoes. He's young, wealthy and one of the top 5 athletes in the world I would argue. Why would he want to play in a dump like Cleveland when he could go to say New York, Los Angeles, Chicago or Miami? With the exception of Detriot and possibly Oklahoma City, Cleveland has to be one of the least desirable places to play. I'd love for him to stay but if he leaves I wouldn't blame him one bit.

this entire post is straight up dumb.

1. first, apparently you didn't bother watching the first 2 games against the magic when their entire offense was spread the court and dump it to an isolated Howard. it wasn't until cleveland would just mass collapse on howard that they really started running the pick and roll with Hedu to get Howard isolated one on one. that's why they needed a center to bang down low.

2. lebron is an ohio boy that loves his hometown, and cleveland can pay him more than anyone else. his entire family and all of his friends are here. this argument is also dumb.

 

[NFBuck]

Snaq may have been a good acquisition 5 years ago but I'd have passed on him. Not only is he a shell of his former self his ego still doesn't realize it.

Really? What's your basis for this statement? Because from everything he's said (and shown thus far), he seems to understand the role he was brought in for. Really, if your going to come in and make ridiculous claims like this, show some justification, because that is completely off base. And, Rasheed Wallace? Really? You clearly have little-to-no understanding of what this team's needs were. Did you see Howard abuse the Cavs last May? That's why Shaq is needed. He's not gonna go out and put up 25 points a night anymore, but that's not needed. What he's needed for is 25 minutes of defense against guys that have feasted on the Cavs for years, about 12 points and 8 rebounds a game. Wallace is a more athletic/shorter version of Z that shoots more threes. As for your LeBron stance, I'm tired of going round and round about it, I'll leave it at "I disagree".

 

[OH10]

Really? What's your basis for this statement? Because from everything he's said (and shown thus far), he seems to understand the role he was brought in for. Really, if your going to come in and make ridiculous claims like this, show some justification, because that is completely off base. And, Rasheed Wallace? Really? You clearly have little-to-no understanding of what this team's needs were. Did you see Howard abuse the Cavs last May? That's why Shaq is needed. He's not gonna go out and put up 25 points a night anymore, but that's not needed. What he's needed for is 25 minutes of defense against guys that have feasted on the Cavs for years, about 12 points and 8 rebounds a game. Wallace is a more athletic/shorter version of Z that shoots more threes. As for your LeBron stance, I'm tired of going round and round about it, I'll leave it at "I disagree".

'Sheed did cause serious problems for Howard while in Detroit. The Pistons had their number if you recall.

And I heard Shaq was -25 last night. Ouch.

 

[DubCoffman62]

Really? What's your basis for this statement? Because from everything he's said (and shown thus far), he seems to understand the role he was brought in for. Really, if your going to come in and make ridiculous claims like this, show some justification, because that is completely off base. And, Rasheed Wallace? Really? You clearly have little-to-no understanding of what this team's needs were. Did you see Howard abuse the Cavs last May? That's why Shaq is needed. He's not gonna go out and put up 25 points a night anymore, but that's not needed. What he's needed for is 25 minutes of defense against guys that have feasted on the Cavs for years, about 12 points and 8 rebounds a game. Wallace is a more athletic/shorter version of Z that shoots more threes. As for your LeBron stance, I'm tired of going round and round about it, I'll leave it at "I disagree".

Well we're talking about Dwight Howard here, he's a special player and I'm inclined to think that all Snaq will be able to do is send him to the line. Howard is much too quick.
Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't the Lakers beat Orlando without having a Snaq like big man? They had Gasol and Odom who, like Rasheed Wallace can play both inside and outside. Just saying.

 

[exhawg]

Snaq may have been a good acquisition 5 years ago but I'd have passed on him. Not only is he a shell of his former self his ego still doesn't realize it. I hope it works out but I remain skeptical. Besides it was Hedo that hurt us most against Orlando. That's why I think Rasheed Wallace would've been a better pick up, he's an inside-outside threat and he makes his free throws.
As far as LeBron staying or going I'm just putting myself in his shoes. He's young, wealthy and one of the top 5 athletes in the world I would argue. Why would he want to play in a dump like Cleveland when he could go to say New York, Los Angeles, Chicago or Miami? With the exception of Detriot and possibly Oklahoma City, Cleveland has to be one of the least desirable places to play. I'd love for him to stay but if he leaves I wouldn't blame him one bit.

So you think that the Cavs would be better off with Ben and Pavs than Shaq? When this team is playing great in the spring please don't come on this thread and talk about how great this team is. If you are going to melt down after 2 games against teams that are a bad matchup for the Cavs as they stand now we don't want you in this thread. Go find an ESPN board. The NBA didn't do the Cavs any favors with the first 2 games.

I agree with the above posts about Brown needing to figure out his rotations. If it were up to me I'd start Lebron at the 4 and then bring in Andy and Z with 6 minutes left in the first quarter. Andy and Z compliment each other since one is an inside player and one is an outside player. With Shaq and Andy you don't have enough shooters to pull guys out of the paint. The starting lineup would be better with Shaq in the middle, Lebron, and 3 guys who can hit open shots.
West can't come back soon enough. He was a huge factor why they couldn't play with the Lakers in both games last season and would have probably made a difference in the past 2 games. It is much easier to swap Z and Shaq in the starting lineup if the other 4 stay the same. They traded for Shaq for 2 very important reasons: Orlando and LA. If we get anything else out of him it's gravy. Perhaps once West get's back Brown will go with more Lebron at the 4 lineups, which should open everything up as well as make them look a step quicker.
Please oh please somebody tell Anthony Parker that if he puts the ball on the floor he can drive to the hoop or pass. I don't think his has made a shot off the dribble so far this season unless he was finishing at the rim. Just stand in the corner and wait for the pass.

 

[Bucks21]

Well we're talking about Dwight Howard here, he's a special player and I'm inclined to think that all Snaq will be able to do is send him to the line. Howard is much too quick.
Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't the Lakers beat Orlando without having a Snaq like big man? They had Gasol and Odom who, like Rasheed Wallace can play both inside and outside. Just saying.

Bynum?

 

[aurorabuckeye13]

Once we get West back and the team figures out how to play together with their new personnel, they are going to be straight up scary... that's all that needs to be said. The talent is there people, they just have to have time to put it together.

 

[Bucks21]

On paper this is a great team, but things like this take time, players were sick in the preseason. The rotation isn't set, guys are still trying to get comfortable with each other and most importantly they are still working on learning the defensive rotations. On top of all that, your best on ball defender and your second best guy at point guard hasn't played a minute yet( Delonte West).

Then Mike Brown, I have hated him, I have loved him. He is a defensive coach and I'm going to give him a chance to get his defense together. Not all the pieces are here yet ( Delonte, Powe) and there are lots of new pieces( Shaq, Parker, Moon). Its only the second game of the season, both were bad matches up for the Cavs, especially early in the season. So to almost everyone take a deep breathe and step back ( which I think most on this board already have), to that one guy go ahead and please jump already and get out of here.

 

[Merih]

Once we get West backand the team figures out how to play together with their new personnel, they are going to be straight up scary... that's all that needs to be said. The talent is there people, they just have to have time to put it together.

Even once things are smoothed out the personnel still won't be better than the Laker's

Once we get West back

Is that a possibility? He's not gonna do time?

 

[buckeyesin07]

Besides it was Hedo that hurt us most against Orlando.

Apparently you missed just about the entire series, in which the Cavs had absolutely no answer for Howard.

 

[exhawg]

Even once things are smoothed out the personnel still won't be better than the Laker's



Is that a possibility? He's not gonna do time?

I don't think there is jail time. Just whatever Stern gives him.

 

[aurorabuckeye13]

Even once things are smoothed out the personnel still won't be better than the Laker's



Is that a possibility? He's not gonna do time?

He probably won't do time, right now he's just being held out for personal reasons apparently. I don't think those issues have anything to do with the incident from this summer.

As far as matching up personnel wise with the Lakers, I think the Cavs have the deeper team right now, despite LA having an advantage in the starting 5. When Gasol comes back, the lakers have Odom, Farmar, Josh Powell, DJ Mbenga, Shannon Brown, Sasha Vujacic, and Luke Walton coming off their bench. The Cavs with West back probably have Delonte, Z, Jamario Moon, JJ Hickson, Leon Powe (when he comes back), Boobie Gibson, and maybe eventually Danny Green.

Odom and West each bring something special off the bench (Odom with good athleticism and length, and West with shooting and defense), with Odom probably getting the slight edge there. Then the Cavs have Z, a guy who's older but still had multiple all-star appearances and can still be effective shooting the ball and getting offensive rebounds. They have an energy guy in Moon who can defend taller wing players on the other team like a Rashard Lewis or a Lamar Odom. Hickson is a high ceiling guy who impressed in the preseason and has the potential to do some good things, given consistent playing time. Leon Powe is a solid contributer when he comes back, and Boobie showed last night he may have gotten some of his shooting touch back. With the Lakers, Farmar is solid in reserve of Fisher, Vujacic can shoot, and Shannon Brown was good for them last year in the playoffs off the bench, but the rest of their bench is mostly energy hustle guys.

Talent wise the Lakers clearly have the advantage in the starting 5 IMO, but the Cavs bench will be better this year with all their guys back and I think they definitly have more talent.