Anti-trust lawsuit against NCAA

[zincfinger]

This is what happens when you take kids who shouldn't be in a university setting and put them in one. That doesn't change the fact that these advertised quality educational experiences aren't happening and everyone knows it. I enjoy college sports, but I'm not going to shed any tears for Mr. Five Star Linebacker who can't dick around in Staying Eligible 101 anymore or the universities that do whatever they can to perpetuate the bull[Mark May].

I agree with you that the "student/athlete" notion is in many instances a facade. And, like you, I'm not especially concerned about the guy, who from an academic standpoint probably has no business being at a University, being denied his opportunity to a free "education".

But, I suspect if the Jeff Kessler's have their way, and college football formally becomes a semi-pro league with "student/athletes" replaced by hired University employees, unionized or not, it will be to CFB what the '94 strike was to MLB.

Except major league baseball and college football are different, and are marketable for different reasons. And while MLB was eventually able to recover from its '94 strike, I'm not sure CFB will be able to.

 

[Mike80]

Is what on the student? Failing to do anything useful when they're put into a situation that they were never qualified to be in in the first place just to satiate peoples' love of watching other people play games? I find having unrealistic expectations to be a fruitless exercise, doesn't have anything to do with hand holding.

We'll just have to agree to disagree. I think the NLRB's ruling is in line with the hand-holding crap that is pervasive in our country these days and I think this ruling will ruin the opportunities for the non-jock athletes who actually care about their education while also playing sports. You clearly don't. So be it.

Tell me about walking to school up hill both ways, Johnny Carson, and how your father beating the [Mark May] out of you made you a better person.

I'll take over-stating your position and making personal attacks for no reason for $400 Alex.

 

[TampaBuckeyes]

So, I guess this is limited to private schools at the moment. So, now private schools will have a competitive advantage. I agree that this spells the end of college sports as we've known it. It was great while it lasted. I find myself more in favor of ORD's D-League idea now. If they're paid players, then quit pretending to be students.

Do you mean a competitive advantage when the players vote to unionize and then be forced to be paid because they are employees? How about when the NCAA suspends Northwestern from said sport because it violates their amateur rules. Let's remember the NCAA is a private organization and has the right to allow and disallow schools at it's will. The NLRB ruled that the students are employees of the university, not that they are employees of the NCAA. They have rights with the University, the NCAA can throw them out on their asses. I hope they enjoy flipping burgers, or they can get a scholarship based on academics or can pay for their education.

This is what happens when you take kids who shouldn't be in a university setting and put them in one. That doesn't change the fact that these advertised quality educational experiences aren't happening and everyone knows it. I enjoy college sports, but I'm not going to shed any tears for Mr. Five Star Linebacker who can't dick around in Staying Eligible 101 anymore or the universities that do whatever they can to perpetuate the bull[Mark May].

I've been saying this for years, I guess no one is listening. These kids (the ones that play and plan on going pro) are not majoring in anything academic. They are majoring in football. They are studying (practicing), taking tests (playing games), their teachers (coaches) are getting paid a lot, and they are learning everything they need to learn to go into their field of choice. It they have good enough grades (talent) they get a scholarship to pay their way. Just like every other student. The academic classes they are forced to go through are about as useless in their career path as my humanities and diversity credits are to me. I can say, though, they did help me become a better more rounded adult. Don't give me this money crap, many of the best academic universities (Ivy league) bring in just as much money through grants and academics as the best football schools (Texas) do in athletics. Should the grad students helping to do the research get to unionize? Do they get paid? They get the same damn thing, a scholarship and a stipend. Can't we just accept that they are majoring in football?

 

[Mike80]

I've been saying this for years, I guess no one is listening. These kids (the ones that play and plan on going pro) are not majoring in anything academic. They are majoring in football. They are studying (practicing), taking tests (playing games), their teachers (coaches) are getting paid a lot, and they are learning everything they need to learn to go into their field of choice. It they have good enough grades (talent) they get a scholarship to pay their way. Just like every other student. The academic classes they are forced to go through are about as useless in their career path as my humanities and diversity credits are to me. I can say, though, they did help me become a better more rounded adult. Don't give me this money crap, many of the best academic universities (Ivy league) bring in just as much money through grants and academics as the best football schools (Texas) do in athletics. Should the grad students helping to do the research get to unionize? Do they get paid? They get the same damn thing, a scholarship and a stipend. Can't we just accept that they are majoring in football?

Paid to study?!?! ZOMG! I like this ruling more and more!

 

[TampaBuckeyes]

Paid to study?!?! ZOMG! I like this ruling more and more!

I would have taken just a scholarship. I came out of college almost 6 figures in debt just for the tuition on my masters. Working another 20-25 hours a week trying to pay my living expenses. Huh, and I didn't even get a signing bonus when I started working. I think I'll start that petition to unionize, because I know I worked on several research projects earning grant money FOR NOTHING. I think I deserve to get some back-pay.

 

[zincfinger]

Should the grad students helping to do the research get to unionize? Do they get paid? They get the same damn thing, a scholarship and a stipend.

Graduate students do get to unionize and do get paid (at least in the hard sciences).

 

[TampaBuckeyes]

Graduate students do get to unionize and do get paid (at least in the hard sciences).

Here they received scholarship plus a 2000/semester stipend for living expenses. Payment for working between 15-20 hours a week. Same as the football players (probably different stipend amount) who live off campus. There was no option to live on campus for free. You could choose to be an employee, forgo the stipend and scholarship, get paid between 12-16 and hour and be part of the teachers association, pay into the state workers retirement crap, etc. My girlfriend is just switched from the former to the latter because she is only taking two classes and the paycheck amounts to more. I'm very familiar with this. USF is one of the larger universities in Florida, so it can't be all that out of sync. My buddies that got GA jobs at UF had a similar deal, though I think the stipend was 2500/semester. We really just do it for the experience and free tuition.

 

[zincfinger]

Here they received scholarship plus a 2000/semester stipend for living expenses. Payment for working between 15-20 hours a week. Same as the football players (probably different stipend amount) who live off campus. There was no option to live on campus for free. You could choose to be an employee, forgo the stipend and scholarship, get paid between 12-16 and hour and be part of the teachers association, pay into the state workers retirement crap, etc. My girlfriend is just switched from the former to the latter because she is only taking two classes and the paycheck amounts to more. I'm very familiar with this. USF is one of the larger universities in Florida, so it can't be all that out of sync. My buddies that got GA jobs at UF had a similar deal, though I think the stipend was 2500/semester. We really just do it for the experience and free tuition.

We're getting well off-topic, but grad students at OSU Chemistry got $15K/year plus tuition 15 years ago. I'm pretty sure that other hard science departments were comparable. I think it's in the 20-25 range now.

 

[Buckeye513]

I've been saying this for years, I guess no one is listening. These kids (the ones that play and plan on going pro) are not majoring in anything academic. They are majoring in football. They are studying (practicing), taking tests (playing games), their teachers (coaches) are getting paid a lot, and they are learning everything they need to learn to go into their field of choice. It they have good enough grades (talent) they get a scholarship to pay their way. Just like every other student. The academic classes they are forced to go through are about as useless in their career path as my humanities and diversity credits are to me. I can say, though, they did help me become a better more rounded adult. Don't give me this money crap, many of the best academic universities (Ivy league) bring in just as much money through grants and academics as the best football schools (Texas) do in athletics. Should the grad students helping to do the research get to unionize? Do they get paid? They get the same damn thing, a scholarship and a stipend. Can't we just accept that they are majoring in football?

Then they're not just like every other student.

Why do you think academic institutions should be catering to people who don't care about academics, if not for money? If this is the end of big time college athletics, the universities will go on just fine. The NFL can start a D-League and they can major in football there.

I'll take over-stating your position and making personal attacks for no reason for $400 Alex.

I didn't say anything personal. It just amuses me when the old fucks on this forum go on their little curmudgeon rants about those meddling kids.

 

[jwinslow]

As for these ivy league examples, does Harvard merchandise and exploit their likenesses for big profits and avoid lawsuits under the ruse of amateurism and bold faced lies about generic jerseys?

 

[Onebuckfan]

I guess this changes recruitng ..Jabari Duke is offering 1 Million, Will give you 1.2 million and by the way Player X your fired.

 

[Dryden]

At least Braxton will be off the books after this year and OSU will have enough cap space to sign Danny Clark to an 8 semester deal.

 

[Mike80]

Then they're not just like every other student.

Why do you think academic institutions should be catering to people who don't care about academics, if not for money? If this is the end of big time college athletics, the universities will go on just fine. The NFL can start a D-League and they can major in football there.

So we can have a system similar to the NBA-Dleague? Awesome, because that's working out so well...

I didn't say anything personal. It just amuses me when the old fucks on this forum go on their little curmudgeon rants about those meddling kids.

I'm 33 therefore I'm an old fuck? Ok....FWIW I'm part of the playstation generation too....hell they were calling us that when I enlisted in the Army in 1998...that's not a new saying.

As I said, college football (and college sports) as we know it is in its last days. Hope you enjoyed the ride.

 

[TampaBuckeyes]

We're getting well off-topic, but grad students at OSU Chemistry got $15K/year plus tuition 15 years ago. I'm pretty sure that other hard science departments were comparable. I think it's in the 20-25 range now.

Holy crap! Majoring in architecture is not the most profitable.

As for these ivy league examples, does Harvard merchandise and exploit their likenesses for big profits and avoid lawsuits under the ruse of amateurism and bold faced lies about generic jerseys?

I'm not saying that the NCAA doesn't need to change somethings. A 'full' scholarships should cover the full cost of attendance, not just for football but for everyone. They shouldn't be able to use the kids' names, but they do have a right to make a video game. You could say they exploit their likeness, but that kind of thing happens all over the commercial world (Did anyone get a Wal-Mart feel when watching Wall-E? Wal-mart attempted to sue Disney and it was tossed out). Kids better get used to being exploited when a good chunk of NFL athletes are paying some dope 6 figures to 'watch their finances' and end up broke just the same when they retire/get injured (A claim from Mr Dave Ramsey). Anyhow I'm getting sidetracked, if the NCAA wants to be a true and fair governing body then they should probably be a nonprofit organization. This doesn't mean that they can't pay their emperor a shit load of money, just something along the lines of all profits going to worthy causes. (the CEOs of organizations such as the United Way and Red Cross typically make over 500k/year). They should also make some changes to help protect these kids.

 

[buckeyebri]

Colter on Mike & Mike says it is not about pay to play, but a seat at the table. Medical coverage needs for injuries, graduating players and potentially dollars down the road to help. Not to affect non revenue sports at this time, only intended for football and basketball at this point. Talked a lot about the money being generated. Talked about having to schedule classes around football. Next step is Anti-Trust lawsuit to allow players to negotiate for other items that the NCAA rules keep them from. Argued that getting a scholarship was pay and that is what made them an employee. He believes that the NW players will vote to unionize. He also talked about "working conditions".