Anti-trust lawsuit against NCAA

[zincfinger]

I was a GTA at that other UC, Cincinnati. I received tuition and a monthly stipend. I monitored student teachers in a practicum, not their final "student teaching." I was also receiving GI Bill ed funds. I don't recall either being taxed - but then I was driving a 1950 Chevy and eating a lot of Ramman noodles. You can't take tax blood from a turnip.

GTA's and GRA's (Graduate Research Associates) in Ohio pay state and federal income tax on their stipends/salaries. Or at least did 15 years ago, and I doubt it's changed. They do not pay income tax on their tuition waivers. You damn well can squeeze blood from a turnip, at least a bit.

 

[ORD_Buckeye]

GTA's and GRA's (Graduate Research Associates) in Ohio pay state and federal income tax on their stipends/salaries. Or at least did 15 years ago, and I doubt it's changed. They do not pay income tax on their tuition waivers. You damn well can squeeze blood from a turnip, at least a bit.

So, there has been a long standing taxation divide between pay for conducting TA/RA duties (i.e. doing a job) and a scholarship/fellowship for going to class (i.e. being a student). It would seem as though the NLRB has definitively assigned athletic scholarships into the former group.

 

[zincfinger]

So, there has been a long standing taxation divide between pay for conducting TA/RA duties (i.e. doing a job) and a scholarship/fellowship for going to class (i.e. being a student).

Yep, and that holds even when the scholarship doesn't involve going to class (unless you define conducting independent lab research as "going to class").

It would seem as though the NLRB has definitively assigned athletic scholarships into the former group.

My guess is that the tuition waivers won't be affected. As for the stipends/salaries currently paid to athletic scholarship recipients, are we sure that they aren't subject to income tax already?

 

[ORD_Buckeye]

The whole football minor league would probably take a No Fucks Given Badass like Cuban to get off the ground.

Start up a league that is somewhat regionally based (to constrain travel costs) and in an area without a lot of NFL and major college football teams, say the Intermountain West. Eight teams (Reno, Vegas, SLC, Alburquerque, Boise, etc.). Offer a standard 40K/year contract for kids either out of high school or who've bounced out of a college program. Eight teams with 60 man rosters is 480 spots for kids who don't want to go the college route. You might not lure a Saban or Meyer to coach in it, but I'd bet you'd get plenty of decent position coaches sick of recruiting, university politics, athletic department bullshit and dealing with the hassles of keeping their "student-athletes" eligible and out of trouble.

From a business standpoint, his ROI could be seen as either making the league profitable or just not losing too much money before the NFL takes him to lunch and slides the big check across the table to buy the league from him.

Now, the NFL--in all their legendary arrogance--could refuse to draft these kids when they reach their third year out of high school, but that's not going to happen. You think teams are really going to pass on first round talent? And if they all curiously--and in lockstep fashion--did, then it's a pretty easy case of collusion and anti-trust for any ambitious Assistant Attorney General.

 

[Fungo Squiggly]

Yep, and that holds even when the scholarship doesn't involve going to class (unless you define conducting independent lab research as "going to class").

My guess is that the tuition waivers won't be affected. As for the stipends/salaries currently paid to athletic scholarship recipients, are we sure that they aren't subject to income tax already?

I believe that it should be, as should the portion of the scholarship that exceeds the tuition and fees. Everyone one of these scholarship athletes should be paying tax on a pretty good chunk of their scholarship. I am sure that they all are......

Topic 421 - Scholarship and Fellowship Grants
A scholarship is generally an amount paid or allowed to a student at an educational institution for the purpose of study. A fellowship is generally an amount paid to an individual for the purpose of research.

.

You must include in gross income amounts used for incidental expenses, such as room and board, travel, and optional equipment, and generally, amounts received as payments for teaching, research, or other services required as a condition for receiving the scholarship or fellowship grant. Also, you must include in income any part of the scholarship or fellowship that represents payments for services. Generally, when reporting scholarship income on your tax return, you will include the amounts on the same line as "Wages, salaries, tips, etc." Review the instructions of your tax form to determine how to report any income from scholarships.

However, you do not need to include in gross income any amounts you receive for services that are required by the National Health Service Corps Scholarship Program or the Armed Forces Health Professions Scholarship and Financial Assistance Program.

If any part of your scholarship or fellowship grant is taxable, you may have to make estimated tax payments. For more information, refer to Publication 970, Tax Benefits for Education.

http://www.irs.gov/taxtopics/tc421.html

 

[scarletmike]

I believe that it should be, as should the portion of the scholarship that exceeds the tuition and fees. Everyone one of these scholarship athletes should be paying tax on a pretty good chunk of their scholarship. I am sure that they all are......




http://www.irs.gov/taxtopics/tc421.html

If I were a betting man (I'm generally not), I would venture a guess that any stipends the students are given are post-tax, with the school taking out the required amount on the front end such that come tax time, students don't need to worry about owing tax on University-related funds, but also not receiving any excess withheld taxes either. I would guess the same thing with any other funds like scholarships. The student is told both the pre-tax and post-tax amount and given the post-tax amount with the school managing the tax situation on their behalf.

 

[zincfinger]

I believe that [stipends/salaries paid to athletes] should be [taxable], as should the portion of the scholarship that exceeds the tuition and fees.

I was equating these two things, meaning I was considering everything beyond the tuition waiver to be part of the stipend/salary. I don't know if that's how it works for athletes, though because in my case we didn't have funds earmarked for books or anything else explicitly, as I understand they do. We just got a tuition waiver which meant we never received a tuition bill, and a monthly payment to be used for books, food, pitchers at the Out-R-Inn, or whatever else we wanted to spend it on.

If I were a betting man (I'm generally not), I would venture a guess that any stipends the students are given are post-tax, with the school taking out the required amount on the front end such that come tax time, students don't need to worry about owing tax on University-related funds, but also not receiving any excess withheld taxes either. I would guess the same thing with any other funds like scholarships. The student is told both the pre-tax and post-tax amount and given the post-tax amount with the school managing the tax situation on their behalf.

For grad students at least, stipend/salary payments are subject to FICA, federal, and state withholdings just the same as anyone else's paycheck.

 

[Jaxbuck]

I find it highly amusing that people feel threatened by college athletes organizing together to bargain for anything just because they're concerned they may bargain for too much, eventually. As if that isn't the American way.

Everyone should have the right to organize for bargaining if they feel it is in the group's collective interests. Simply because that group (just like any ordinary person or institution) may eventually overplay their hand shouldn't exclude them from that right. So, yeah, I think all of the visceral opposition to this union is laughable (and, quite frankly, selfish).

You were laughing at everyone for being afraid of the benign list of 11 "concerns", implying there was nothing to worry about because pay for play wasn't on the list.

You now acknowledge they will eventually ask for more than that original list.

Which is it?

 

[ORD_Buckeye]

My guess is that the tuition waivers won't be affected. As for the stipends/salaries currently paid to athletic scholarship recipients, are we sure that they aren't subject to income tax already?

But the NLRB definitively declared that the students are "doing a job" for the university and that their entire scholarship is "pay" for doing that job. They've opened up the can of worms to make the entire scholarship taxable.

 

[zincfinger]

But the NLRB definitively declared that the students are "doing a job" for the university and that their entire scholarship is "pay" for doing that job. They've opened up the can of worms to make the entire scholarship taxable.

Maybe. I'm largely relying on my experience as a "professional student" here, as it seems the NLRB decision moves athletes further in that direction. In my department, every grad student received a tuition waiver and it was generally regarded as part of the compensation for doing a job. And no one paid tax on it. And that seems consistent with the portion of the tax code somebody cited above.

 

[buckeyebri]

Is it possible for those who don't want to go to college to go directly to the UFL or are their rules the same as the NFL?

 

[zincfinger]

Is it possible for those who don't want to go to college to go directly to the UFL or are their rules the same as the NFL?

I think it was possible while the UFL was in operation. But it's gone out of business.

 

[jlb1705]

If I were a betting man (I'm generally not), I would venture a guess that any stipends the students are given are post-tax, with the school taking out the required amount on the front end such that come tax time, students don't need to worry about owing tax on University-related funds, but also not receiving any excess withheld taxes either. I would guess the same thing with any other funds like scholarships. The student is told both the pre-tax and post-tax amount and given the post-tax amount with the school managing the tax situation on their behalf.

Suppose that were the case... what would be the incentive for institutions to continue such a practice?

This is why I believe that this union idea is not going to work out as these student-athletes anticipate. They don't seem to realize they when it comes time to negotiate, they won't be the only ones putting stuff on the table. All of the benefits that they receive now that they take for granted like grants-in-aid, training tables, new clothing and equipment, and specialized academic services? Those go back on the table. Do they really think they're going to come out of this process keeping access to everything they already receive?

 

[buckeyebri]

I think it was possible while the UFL was in operation. But it's gone out of business.

Oh man, where have I been . Seems like this would be something that would make sense for the NFL and UFL to team up.

 

[zincfinger]

Oh man, where have I been . Seems like this would be something that would make sense for the NFL and UFL to team up.

I tend to agree with ORD on that point. As long as CFB provides a comprehensive farm system for the NFL that the NFL doesn't need to spend any money on, the NFL doesn't have much incentive to spend money setting up an alternative.