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2023 tOSU Defense

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Jaxbuck said:
allowing 4.5 YPA isn't exactly elite run defense

Of the many things that will haunt Freeman and ND fans about that game, the 13 carriers in the first half has got to sting. They doubled down on the run in the second half and put up 123 yards in a half.
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And also went away from it in the 4th Q.
They had 1 really good Q where they just pounded our defense, throwing selectively... and then went back to trying to throw it.


sg86 said:
I'm not even sure how much of that I put on the actual defenders, tbh.

Johnson was barely rotating any of the DL, so these guys were out there for 3:30, we score in 11 seconds, then we give up a 7+ minute drive for a TD. Offense comes back out and is moving until Fryar's penalty screws us and the defense has to come back on the field after a 3 minute drive and gives up 96 yards over 6:28.

The runs that were 2-3 yards were turning into 6-8 yards because the DL was gassed.

If Fryar doesn't commit that penalty, we've got a first down inside the 30. We're probably burning 2-3 more minutes of game clock and possibly score the way we were moving.

It's easy to look at the numbers and say the defense isn't that great but in the context of the game, there were several factors that left them in a really bad spot.
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Some of that was on Offense imo. They hung the D out to dry and left them gassed facing an elite and big RB.
Anyone else would have gone Pete Carroll w/Sean Alexander for the rest of the fame. But Freeman blinked.
Maybe he had Hartman's heisman options in mind. But he messed up either way.

At least one positive is that our pass D is much improved. Iggy and Proctor can be liabilities occasionally, but play with intensity and anger.
 
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kujirakira said:
Some of that was on Offense imo. They hung the D out to dry and left them gassed facing an elite and big RB.
Anyone else would have gone Pete Carroll w/Sean Alexander for the rest of the fame. But Freeman blinked.
Maybe he had Hartman's heisman options in mind. But he messed up either way.
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That's the whole "How Ryan Day loses big games" playbook right there though isn't it?

If his offense can't explode, from distance (because they stall in short yardage and the red zone), and get up by multiple scores early, then his defense is exposed to the run threat from the other team (which we cannot stop if a qualified and determined opponent just sticks with it). This further weakens his offense because of the TOP and now his new nemesis, the running clock, only makes it worse.

Day's identity is to lead with his offense. Specifically his passing offense. This is going to put his defense under certain pressures just by the nature of that philosophy. He also, like every other coach (for whatever subconscious reason), builds his own defense to stop his offense. Knowles's light in the pants 4-2-5 defense can probably do a good enough job in a league full of pass first teams (like say the B12). It is at a fundamental disadvantage in a run first league like the B1G.

Notre Dame exposed all the same old issues. They just weren't well coached enough to finish the deal. If any of Maryland, Penn State, Wisky and tsun have good enough defense, or bad enough weather, to slow down Day's passing attack, they can run the same formula and just might not be dumb enough to go away from the running game when it's getting 4.5 yards per carry.
 
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kujirakira said:
And also went away from it in the 4th Q.
They had 1 really good Q where they just pounded our defense, throwing selectively... and then went back to trying to throw it.




Some of that was on Offense imo. They hung the D out to dry and left them gassed facing an elite and big RB.
Anyone else would have gone Pete Carroll w/Sean Alexander for the rest of the fame. But Freeman blinked.
Maybe he had Hartman's heisman options in mind. But he messed up either way.

At least one positive is that our pass D is much improved. Iggy and Proctor can be liabilities occasionally, but play with intensity and anger.
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Those two were never on the same team. Do you mean Carroll/Lynch or Holmgren/Alexander?
 
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Jaxbuck said:
That's the whole "How Ryan Day loses big games" playbook right there though isn't it?

If his offense can't explode, from distance (because they stall in short yardage and the red zone), and get up by multiple scores early, then his defense is exposed to the run threat from the other team (which we cannot stop if a qualified and determined opponent just sticks with it). This further weakens his offense because of the TOP and now his new nemesis, the running clock, only makes it worse.

Day's identity is to lead with his offense. Specifically his passing offense. This is going to put his defense under certain pressures just by the nature of that philosophy. He also, like every other coach (for whatever subconscious reason), builds his own defense to stop his offense. Knowles's light in the pants 4-2-5 defense can probably do a good enough job in a league full of pass first teams (like say the B12). It is at a fundamental disadvantage in a run first league like the B1G.

Notre Dame exposed all the same old issues. They just weren't well coached enough to finish the deal. If any of Maryland, Penn State, Wisky and tsun have good enough defense, or bad enough weather, to slow down Day's passing attack, they can run the same formula and just might not be dumb enough to go away from the running game when it's getting 4.5 yards per carry.
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Just FYI, the majority of teams in the B1G are deploying a base 4-2-5, at the moment.
 
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OregonBuckeye said:
This D feels very 2007ish to me
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It definitely reminds me of that era in style, and while those safeties were better, I think the '23 CBs have improved to the point of being able to play man better than most Tressel teams. Safeties aren't as good though.

Some of those names bring me back. I remember Lawrence Wilson getting a lot of hype and Robert Rose looking like he was going to take CFB by storm. Then Rose got unlucky and had to have both shoulders operated on at least once. Outside of Gholston, only two DL had more than 1 sack (Heyward, Lawrence).
 
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I think a big thing to watch this year is gonna be whether or not these guys can force more turnovers. As a few people have pointed out, a good team that's committed to running the ball will absolutely pose a threat, especially in regards to clock control. If the defense continues to make teams drive and keep big plays to a minimum, they're gonna have to force mistakes.
 
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Jaxbuck said:
. Knowles's light in the pants 4-2-5 defense can probably do a good enough job in a league full of pass first teams (like say the B12). It is at a fundamental disadvantage in a run first league like the B1G.
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Interesting take. Especially considering this team has been nickel/big nickel 60%+ of their snaps dating back to the early days of Heacock. Probably even more depending on how you view Cie Grant, or Carp being used as 2pt edge rusher, Thad as a weakside 2pt edge, Brandon Mitchell as a dime backer, Tyler Moeller as a WILL backer, etc etc.

The best defenses of the last 20 years, 02, 03', 05, 07, 09, 10, 19.... all heavy nickel and even 33, again dependent on how you view a position group vs assignment.
 
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Onebuckfan said:
I hate the crashing down technique by the DEs . Wouldn’t JTT be more effective in the wide 9 technique by containing the QB and edge runs and let Tommy and Steele tackle between the tackles with the Dts
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I don't like it either, but Eich and Chambers flow out knowing it is coming, so at least there is communication on where players are supposed to be so far this year. So theoretically that can work, but I would advocate for containing an edge with JTT and Sawyer over that....especially next game, we have a QB that needs bracketed and spied by a LB.
 
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Buckeneye said:
Interesting take. Especially considering this team has been nickel/big nickel 60%+ of their snaps dating back to the early days of Heacock. Probably even more depending on how you view Cie Grant, or Carp being used as 2pt edge rusher, Thad as a weakside 2pt edge, Brandon Mitchell as a dime backer, Tyler Moeller as a WILL backer, etc etc.

The best defenses of the last 20 years, 02, 03', 05, 07, 09, 10, 19.... all heavy nickel and even 33, again dependent on how you view a position group vs assignment.
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I agree. Teams have been rolling up corners or playing big safeties down in the box since forever. I understand that, especially in the modern era, teams are going to play a base defense more geared to the pass. My point, that I did not make well so I apologize for that, is that somehow teams substitute better/come out of their base defense better to play the run better than we seem to be able do.

I really don't care what base defense he runs or what his philosophy is as long as it gets results. When we lose, or get taken down to the wire by lesser teams, their ability to run on us is usually a big part of it.
 
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