-
New here? Register here now for access to all the forums, download game torrents, private messages, polls, Sportsbook, etc. Plus, stay connected and follow BP on Instagram @buckeyeplanet and Facebook.
- Thread starter BB73
- Start date
OneBuckeye
Hall of Fame
IMO this is an issue with the execution of wither's cover 4 and pressure from the d line. This is not Luke fickells defense. I don't know why everyone puts the blame on him.
Upvote
0
Onebuckfan
classof76
OneBuckeye;2234682; said:
No one is blaming him .Defense stinks ..LF is making the calls..he can call cover 1 or 2 or whatever.
Upvote
0
Poe McKnoe
Head Coach
OneBuckeye;2234682; said:
"I think we gave up 49 points. That?s all I give a s--- about."
Upvote
0
bukIpower
Head Coach
Well I'll chime in since I'm now sober. I think it's a coaching issue IMO.
Like was stated the offense was a big issue then we brought in new guys and it turned around quickly. We kept some key people on defense and look where we are at on defense now. We might not have a AJ Hawk or Mike Doss in our secondary but I'll be damned if I'm going to blame any of our players for what we are seeing out there right now.
We have a very experienced defense, one that should have seen it all. One that with less experience last year finished out alright ranking 19th. Fast forward to this year and we have experienced starters in Robey, Barnett, Bryant, Johnson, Howard, Sabino, Klein, NATE WILLIAMS, Simon, Hankins, and not to mention a slew of others that played extensively last year as well like Shazier and Bennet.
For the most part this is the same freaking defense that did OK last year. We should be an improved defense and we are 10 fold worse this year. Infact I'm not old enought o remember a defensive squad being this bad, and to be honest it shouldn't be like this.
I like Coombs and I actually like Vrabel because he's so new at coaching I can see him developing into something great down the road. However, if the head coach has seen enough through 7 weeks and decides he needs to take control then we do not have the right coordinators on defense.
That's not easy to say either because Fickel really was a quality co-coordinator with Heacock, but he's just not getting the job done. At this point I don't see any way he returns next year I really don't and that really does suck. As for Withers, I think he'll be retained just mainly because of his Carolina recruiting ties but if not for that he would be shown the door too. At this point i'm personally not a fan of his style.
Like was stated the offense was a big issue then we brought in new guys and it turned around quickly. We kept some key people on defense and look where we are at on defense now. We might not have a AJ Hawk or Mike Doss in our secondary but I'll be damned if I'm going to blame any of our players for what we are seeing out there right now.
We have a very experienced defense, one that should have seen it all. One that with less experience last year finished out alright ranking 19th. Fast forward to this year and we have experienced starters in Robey, Barnett, Bryant, Johnson, Howard, Sabino, Klein, NATE WILLIAMS, Simon, Hankins, and not to mention a slew of others that played extensively last year as well like Shazier and Bennet.
For the most part this is the same freaking defense that did OK last year. We should be an improved defense and we are 10 fold worse this year. Infact I'm not old enought o remember a defensive squad being this bad, and to be honest it shouldn't be like this.
I like Coombs and I actually like Vrabel because he's so new at coaching I can see him developing into something great down the road. However, if the head coach has seen enough through 7 weeks and decides he needs to take control then we do not have the right coordinators on defense.
That's not easy to say either because Fickel really was a quality co-coordinator with Heacock, but he's just not getting the job done. At this point I don't see any way he returns next year I really don't and that really does suck. As for Withers, I think he'll be retained just mainly because of his Carolina recruiting ties but if not for that he would be shown the door too. At this point i'm personally not a fan of his style.
Upvote
0
OneBuckeye;2234682; said:
I think we look to Fick an Vrabel because they are our known commodities on this staff. Both Buckeyes and still here. Withers and Coombs are new to the mix, so understanding who is coaching what technique, etc. is tough to assess, at least for me. I know the amount of cushion we give in the secondary drives me crazy. We have to have DBs who can run with receivers, if not then we will constantly be in trouble. Who is coaching the technique, Coombs or Withers or?
As for the young guys. Right now Grant has no clue where the ball is when he is in coverage. I remember watching Spence drop off into coverage last night and he ran to a defined spot on the field, never mind where the play was and where the receiver was crossing. He took himself right out of the play.
It just seems to be a confluence of a lot of issues right now.
Upvote
0
Poe McKnoe
Head Coach
The one play that sums up this defense was (please correct my factual errors, I was loaded):
Travis Howard gets hurt and comes off the field. Must have been Doran Grant that came in. I'm looking at the top of the field and the CB is playing 8-10 yards off on a 3rd and 6. I can't help but stare at this. There's no way Indiana is NOT going to go this receiver. They're going to run a slant and there's not going to be an Ohio State defender near him. I'm pleading for him to move up at least 4 yards. You don't even have to bump him, just be in position to make a play.
Result: Indiana runs a slant and catches the ball for a gain of 8. First down.
Come the fuck on.
Travis Howard gets hurt and comes off the field. Must have been Doran Grant that came in. I'm looking at the top of the field and the CB is playing 8-10 yards off on a 3rd and 6. I can't help but stare at this. There's no way Indiana is NOT going to go this receiver. They're going to run a slant and there's not going to be an Ohio State defender near him. I'm pleading for him to move up at least 4 yards. You don't even have to bump him, just be in position to make a play.
Result: Indiana runs a slant and catches the ball for a gain of 8. First down.
Come the fuck on.
Upvote
0
bukIpower
Head Coach
If fans can see this issue in our secondary then like you stated poe i'm pretty sure all other teams we are playing can see that issue as well.
If Gene Chizik is fired and is willing to take a peak at OSU as a D-coordinator what would you guys think. I know i'm jumping the gun but even if Meyer decides to stick things out with the current staff and gives them more time how do we not jump at that opportunity regardless?
The OSU defense is suppose to be the best in this conference without question and if someone with the pedigree comes along to get us back to where we are suppose to be I think you got to do it.
If Gene Chizik is fired and is willing to take a peak at OSU as a D-coordinator what would you guys think. I know i'm jumping the gun but even if Meyer decides to stick things out with the current staff and gives them more time how do we not jump at that opportunity regardless?
The OSU defense is suppose to be the best in this conference without question and if someone with the pedigree comes along to get us back to where we are suppose to be I think you got to do it.
Upvote
0
buckeyboy
Legend
My main concern is that this defence has regressed so much. Yes, I know there are injuries and depth at LB and secondary are concerns. In my opinion, development of players (namely freshman) has been a concern with this defensive coaching staff. The one thing I remember fondly of Tressel and staff was they were excellent at developing players for the most part. I believe this defensive staff is lacking in that regard and it is unfortunately hurting this team badly. There should be a freshman or two that can at least come in and contribute. Curtis Grant has not progressed at MLB. He has a ways to go before he graduated, but I'm not sure he will ever be the player we were all hoping he would become.
Upvote
0
Bill Lucas
Assistant Coach
Poe McKnoe;2234692; said:
Grant also started for Roby and was pulled. When Grant came in for Howard Indiana attacked him. A deep completion and a pass interference on back to back plays.
I disagree with Phil Steele. I don't see any All Americans on the Ohio State defense. All Americans make a difference and no one if making a difference on defense right now.
Upvote
0
Poe McKnoe;2234692; said:
I saw this as well and was saying the same thing. I think Howard would have been just as far off though, although he may have come up at the snap. The second piece of this is that Grant backed up at the start of the play giving even more cushion.
Upvote
0
buckeyboy
Legend
buckeyebri;2234691; said:
I think it's too early to talk about coaching changes. I think we can all clearly see where this is trending. I just can't figure out why this defensive coaching staff are unwilling to make changes. If things are not working in the previous six games, why continue to stick with it. I don't buy the lack of talent argument.
Upvote
0
bukIpower
Head Coach
buckeyboy;2234703; said:
IMO it's not too early to talk about changes. I mean afterall Something has to change right? If michigans defensive coach can get Kovacs to play like Ronnie Lott then someone should be able to get Bryant to play at a higher level as well.
Too early was weeks 2-4. We are 7 weeks in and we've been absolutely CRUSHED by 3-4 doormat teams on defense.
Upvote
0
bukIpower;2234697; said:
I guess my only opinion would be I trust Meyers judgement.
As far as last night and the current state of the D goes I think it's a lot of factors all in play. Impossible to say it's just one thing.
Some things I think I see;
-DL cannot affect a QB from the shotgun enough (sometimes they do but not consistently enough).
-When QB's get time they find open receivers
-When long runs are given up it seems like its usually 4 DL blocked, an OL gets on 1 LB and no one else in the picture. I can only assume the safeties are off helping the corners?
-Intangibles/effort...I get the feeling this part of the team suffers the most from "nothing to play for this year" syndrome r something to that effect. They just don't seem to have much fire in the collective belly. (Obviously there are a couple of exceptions). This more than anything else is what I think could get LF in trouble. The defense appears to not play hard for him....that could be huge.
This week vs Purdue will be interesting as they have scored 17, 13 and 14 points respectively against ND, scUM and Wisky. Conversely, they have scored 48, 54 and 51 against Eastern Kentucky, Eastern Mich and Marshall.
This is a big game for Luke Fickell's future imo. If our D can't keep them under 21 I think he's in a lot of trouble. Hope not, I like the guy but I just get the feeling he's in over his head right now.
Upvote
0