2010 TSUN News offseason (football)

[cincibuck]

I thought it was the Dominos guy now... at least that's what the UM alum said when he dropped off my pizza.

Bastard was at 35 minutes, too. Wonder what he was doing that made him late...

What did you order, pepperoni and oysters?

 

[eightpointbuck]

I thought it was the Dominos guy now... at least that's what the UM alum said when he dropped off my pizza.

Bastard was at 35 minutes, too. Wonder what he was doing that made him late...

If masturbating on the porch of a house in Ann Arbor is wrong...

 

[jwinslow]

Scout.com: Carr explains why he coached one year longer than he intended...

Carr explains why he coached one year longer than he intended...

....Ryan Mallet.

I caught the tail end of an hour long interview with Carr on the "Huge show" on WTKA.
Asked why he left, Carr explained that he knew he was done after the loss to OSU in 06 (#1 vs #2) followed by the loss to USC in the Rose Bowl.
He decided to stay one more year because of Mallet.
Mallet was the #1 QB in the country and was going to enroll in Jan at UM. Carr wanted to ensure that he left the program in good shape. I'm assuming he was afraid Mallet would change his verbal if he retired.

 

[Bill Martin]

Scout.com: Carr explains why he coached one year longer than he intended...

Similarly, that is why I stuck around longer than I should have. I wanted to make sure the program was going to continue in its current direction.

And that's why I hired Rich Rodriguez. That, and no one else wanted the job. And I secretly had a man crush on everything WVU.

 

[SSS]

Archiving this post over here from this discussion:
Scout.com: Toe to toe with the Big Guys?

Carr generally landed 10 top tier, 4-5 next tier, 2-4 lower tier recruits.

RR's first full class was 11 top, 8 next tier, 4 lower tier... which was comparable to Carr. However, his '10 & '11 classes are much more bottom heavy with 7 top, 11 next, 19 lower tier.

Top = bcs powers
2nd = next tier schools Iowa, Wisc, Cal, A&M, Nebraska until recently
Low = MSU, IU, USF, WVU, MAC schools
^ = OSU recruit

12- Top - Grady**, Manningham^, Bass, McKinney^, Taylor, Schifano, Slocum, Moosman, Harrison, Zirbel, Logan, Sears,
6 - 2nd - Forcier, McAvoy, Savoy, Germany, Richards, Ortmann,
5 - Low - Mesko, Butler, Simpson, McLaurin, Criswell

12- Top - Schilling, Graham, Mouton, Boren^, S Brown, Patterson, C Brown, Minor, Mixon^, Mathews^, Banks, Kates
3 - 2nd - Cone, Dorrestein, Woods
4 - Low - Ferrara, Patilla, Ezeh, Wright

7 - Top - Mallett, Warren^, Williams, Clemons, Webb, Hemingway^, Woolfolk,
8 - 2nd - Molk, Rogers, Herron, Babb, Chambers, Horn, Sagesse, Watson
5 - Low - Helmuth, Van Bergen, Panter, Evans, Huyge,

9 - Top - Cissoko^, O'Neill, Stonum, Fitzgerald, Koger^, Martin, McGuffie, Moore, Witherspoon
3 - 2nd - Demens, Mealer, Cox
2 - Low - Khoury, Wermers

4 - Top - Shaw, Barnum, Odoms, Feagin
5 - 2nd - Smith, Hill, Robinson, Roundtree, Floyd
1 - Low - Omameh

11- Top - Turner^, Campbell, Roh, Schofield, Forcier, Lalota, Robinson, Stokes, Lewan, Schofield, Washington
8 - 2nd - Gallon, Emilien***, Gordon, Fitz, Bell, Hawthorne, Jones, V Smith
4 - Low - T Jones, Gordon, Gibbons, Witty

6 - Top - Gardner, White, Robinson^, Dorsey, Miller, Hagerup,
7 - 2nd - Christian****, Furman, Talbott, Hopkins, Ash*5, Jackson*6, Talbott,
14- Low - Black, Robinson, Pace, Avery, Jones, Wilkins, Paskorz, Johnson, Ryan, Kinard, Dileo, Rogers, Vinopal, Williamson

1 - Top - Rock*7
4 - 2nd - Posada, Beyer, Jones, Miller
5 - Low - Fisher, Hollowell, Sousa, Conway, Brown

** - Grady was a national name as a junior. His early commitment distorted his offer list, I'm listing him as a top player.

*** - Vlad will clear up very quickly whether he had an OSU offer. Weird recruitment, but not a head to head battle.

**** - Some question over whether an OSU offer was extended, he was not welcomed in for a visit as it was perceived to be a fun trip (even though they tend to bring in their top targets with that knowledge going in)

*5 - There was a reason Ash didn't visit the powerhouse "offers" on his list besides Michigan.

*6 - The only sites that mentioned Jackson's other powerhouse offers (LSU, Texas, UF) were Michigan sites. I also found it very curious that none of their sites ever interviewed him, even when he was playing up the texas angle.

*7 - Rock's only big offer was Notre Dame, who just hired former Cincinnati coach who had created controversy on ND boards by pursuing many of the same kids. Rock is somewhere between a top & 2nd tier offer list imo.

 

[zwem]

Archiving this post over here from this discussion:
Scout.com: Toe to toe with the Big Guys?

Carr generally landed 10 top tier, 4-5 next tier, 2-4 lower tier recruits.

RR's first full class was 11 top, 8 next tier, 4 lower tier... which was comparable to Carr. However, his '10 & '11 classes are much more bottom heavy with 7 top, 11 next, 19 lower tier.

Top = bcs powers
2nd = next tier schools Iowa, Wisc, Cal, A&M, Nebraska until recently
Low = MSU, IU, USF, WVU, MAC schools
^ = OSU recruit

What is scary is how the top tier guys never panned out, transferred, or never made it.

2005- Grady wasn't that good, Manningham turned out well, Bass had a freak injury and didn't get show what he could do, Mckinney didn't do well, Taylor was ok, Schifano......um yeah, Slocum couldn't make it, Moosman was alright, Harrison played ok for us. Zirbel, Logan, and Sears made no impact what so ever. Mesko turned out as one of the best punters in the country.

2006- Schilling has played well, Graham was a beast, Mouton hasn't really lived up to exceptions, Boren transferred, S Brown played ok toward the end of his career. The rest didn't really do anything except for Minor and Mathews. Always felt like Minor was held back and could have done a great job for us.

2007- Mallet is gone, Warren is gone, Williams hasn't done anything, Clemons is gone, Webb hasn't done anything, Hemingway hasn't done anything. Woolfolk has been ok. He should do well this year. 2nd tier guys-only molk has done something. most of those guys transferred or haven't panned out.

2008- Look promising.....but has been a disaster. Cissoko is in jail, O'Neil transferred, Stonum is only good on special teams, Fitz hasn't panned out liek we thought he would, Koger hasn't done anything, Martin should have a good year this year, mcGuffie is gone, Moore hasn't done anything. Witherspoon never made it here.

Verdict is still out from 2009 on. Just sucks because all the players that haven't panned out. I thought the 08 class looked good on paper. the 09 class wasn't bad either. We lost 2 dts on signing day, other than that....it was a decent class. All those transfers hurt us because of depth. You can have a good first team. However, the second teams are just as important at times. The best teams in the country have back up players who can come in and make an impact. I actually think Michigan's first teams aren't so bad. You need depth to give them a break, plus injures always play a factor. When you have walk ons starting........I think it is safe to say you have a problem.

If we are healthy this year. I think we can get 6 wins and maybe get to a bowl game. 7 wins would be great and 8 wins would give me a smile. It also depends if any freshman can make an impact.

 

[LightningRod]

Michigan to meet NCAA about infractions Saturday

The school is allowing Rodriguez to contest allegations that he did not promote an atmosphere of compliance and failed to adequately monitor the team.
If Michigan, Rodriguez and his lawyer fail to adequately defend themselves this weekend, especially in the context of recent, similar allegations from his previous tenure as head football coach at West Virginia University, the NCAA could impose sanctions that affect his ability to coach in Ann Arbor, including potential restrictions on his time with the team and possibly recruiting.
Most observers expect the allegations against Rodriguez to be the most-reviewed, most-contested portions of what is expected to be a day-long hearing. Michigan officials declined to comment on any aspect of this report. Michigan and Rodriguez are likely to argue that the rules about practice time are so vague that the NCAA officials have suggested making them much clearer, as part of efforts at reform.
"The failure to monitor allegation is going to be disputed," said Michael Buckner, a Florida lawyer who represents institutions before the Committee on Violations. "And with the West Virginia case and the notice of allegations coming out there, Michigan and Rich Rodriguez are really going to be on board and trying to get rid of it."
If the committee decides the Rodriguez did not foster compliance with NCAA rules and failed to adequately monitor the operation of the team at Michigan, and then the dominos fall similarly at West Virginia, he is a repeat offender. The NCAA would likely enhance any punishment of him.
"It could affect the team," Buckner said, of the Wolverines. "You could see a limited number of days that he can coach on the field, or the time he can recruit can be limited. There's a lot of limitations that the committee could impose on Coach Rodriguez that would limit his ability to coach and recruit."
But even the way Coleman and the new athletic director, David Brandon, have stood by Rodriguez, leaves Michigan well-positioned. If Coleman and Brandon ever decided that Rodriguez is done coaching the Maize and Blue, he will be much easier to fire.
If Rodriguez were to claim in a subsequent lawsuit that his dismissal in Ann Arbor resulted after he received no support, Michigan officials can simply point to all of the support they have offered him -- even to the point of contesting allegations against him before the NCAA.
"Overall, I believe Michigan has done a very good job of handling these allegations, conducting the investigation and handling even the legal aspects of it," Buckner said. "They are giving themselves enough room, legally and tactically, to deal with Coach Rodriguez's situation in the future."
As part of its sanctions, Michigan dismissed a graduate assistant, Alex Herron, whom the NCAA accused of lying. And, Brad Labadie, the director of football operations, who, documents in the case reveal, repeatedly failed to provide reports that might have revealed that he violations were occurring -- which they were occurring -- resigned. That both Herron and Labadie are no longer associated with the university benefits Michigan in the hearing.

cont'd

 

[Buckeyeskickbuttocks]

All those transfers hurt us because of depth. You can have a good first team. However, the second teams are just as important at times. The best teams in the country have back up players who can come in and make an impact. I actually think Michigan's first teams aren't so bad. You need depth to give them a break, plus injures always play a factor. When you have walk ons starting........I think it is safe to say you have a problem.

As much as I enjoy under-evaluating Michigan players, you are correct that Michigan's first teamers - for the most part - are of good quality (Kovacs, as you note, doesn't meet the standard, in my opinion (and trying to be fair)) but depth is a HUGE issue in modern football. I suppose this is what makes the BARWIS!!! love so funny to me. I mean, it's true that the Michigan S&C program needed a serious upgrade post LC - and it's also true that Barwis has done that. The reason the results on the field haven't matched that upgrade, in part, is owing strictly to depth. In this respect, Michigan is a lot like a MAC team - 1st team can compete with anyone... but.. not for 4 quarters... when the other team is able to roll in guy after guy after guy (for example, Ohio State's D line).

Really, depth along the lines is where it is most obvious, and this post speaks mostly to those areas (though, Michigan's Defensive back seven is unbelievably thin)

If we are healthy this year. I think we can get 6 wins and maybe get to a bowl game. 7 wins would be great and 8 wins would give me a smile. It also depends if any freshman can make an impact.

I don't think health alone will get you there. Assuming a lack of depth, even if the first string guys stay healthy, they'll wear down. It's just the nature of the modern game....

 

[Ttown]

If all your best D players are recruits with scholastic problems coming out of high school then you lose a lot and that is what has happened to the last three top cornerbacks they have recruited.

 

[TheIronColonel]

As much as I enjoy under-evaluating Michigan players, you are correct that Michigan's first teamers - for the most part - are of good quality (Kovacs, as you note, doesn't meet the standard, in my opinion (and trying to be fair)) but depth is a HUGE issue in modern football. I suppose this is what makes the BARWIS!!! love so funny to me. I mean, it's true that the Michigan S&C program needed a serious upgrade post LC - and it's also true that Barwis has done that. The reason the results on the field haven't matched that upgrade, in part, is owing strictly to depth. In this respect, Michigan is a lot like a MAC team - 1st team can compete with anyone... but.. not for 4 quarters... when the other team is able to roll in guy after guy after guy (for example, Ohio State's D line).

Really, depth along the lines is where it is most obvious, and this post speaks mostly to those areas (though, Michigan's Defensive back seven is unbelievably thin)

I don't think health alone will get you there. Assuming a lack of depth, even if the first string guys stay healthy, they'll wear down. It's just the nature of the modern game....

That's the crucial problem right now. Last year, they sucked against the pass. This year, they lose their best pass rusher, best corner, and have true freshmen in their three deep by necessity. Any team that can field 3 competent receivers can exploit this. I don't see how they're going to stop anybody on defense.

So yeah, the depth EVERYWHERE is an issue. But in the back seven, it's nonexistent. They're in a lot of trouble, and the season hasn't even started.

 

[cincibuck]

I've spent some time re-watching five games, Michigan - Iowa, Michigan - Notre Dame, Michigan - Illinois and Michigan - Ohio State. Two games that in the past have always been tough and two games that Michigan usually put away early in the 3rd Quarter. What I come away with is the notion that in each game Michigan had the talent to be in the game (and in one case to win), but had the sort of things happen to them that used to happen to the other team. In two games, Illinois and Ohio State, they became completely unglued in the 4th quarter.

Is that, as BKB suggests, lack of depth? Maybe lack of experience? A year in which the breaks all went the other way?

Or is it possibly the lack of a coach who can keep himself together in crunch time? The shots of Dick Wad on the sidelines seem to say a good deal about how he tries to handle pressure. His frustration, confusion and chaotic manner remind me of John L. Smith at MSU and seem to end in the same results. Contrast that, if you will, with the sideline manner of Tressel.

 

[WolverineMike]

I've spent some time re-watching five games, Michigan - Iowa, Michigan - Notre Dame, Michigan - Illinois and Michigan - Ohio State. Two games that in the past have always been tough and two games that Michigan usually put away early in the 3rd Quarter. What I come away with is the notion that in each game Michigan had the talent to be in the game (and in one case to win), but had the sort of things happen to them that used to happen to the other team. In two games, Illinois and Ohio State, they became completely unglued in the 4th quarter.

Is that, as BKB suggests, lack of depth? Maybe lack of experience? A year in which the breaks all went the other way?

Or is it possibly the lack of a coach who can keep himself together in crunch time? The shots of Dick Wad on the sidelines seem to say a good deal about how he tries to handle pressure. His frustration, confusion and chaotic manner remind me of John L. Smith at MSU and seem to end in the same results. Contrast that, if you will, with the sideline manner of Tressel.

interesting thoughts. Definitely something to keep an eye this season.

 

[Buckeyeskickbuttocks]

I've spent some time re-watching five games, Michigan - Iowa, Michigan - Notre Dame, Michigan - Illinois and Michigan - Ohio State. Two games that in the past have always been tough and two games that Michigan usually put away early in the 3rd Quarter. What I come away with is the notion that in each game Michigan had the talent to be in the game (and in one case to win), but had the sort of things happen to them that used to happen to the other team. In two games, Illinois and Ohio State, they became completely unglued in the 4th quarter.

Is that, as BKB suggests, lack of depth? Maybe lack of experience? A year in which the breaks all went the other way?

Or is it possibly the lack of a coach who can keep himself together in crunch time? The shots of Dick Wad on the sidelines seem to say a good deal about how he tries to handle pressure. His frustration, confusion and chaotic manner remind me of John L. Smith at MSU and seem to end in the same results. Contrast that, if you will, with the sideline manner of Tressel.

In my view, it's a combination of those things. The Michigan and RR threads are quite pregnant with observations of RR being a "one trick pony" and I think that has shown to be true in the 2 years he's been at Michigan (if it wasn't obvious at WVU) and when that pony isn't working, there simply is no other plan. So.. "in game" coaching = Not good.

Depth = Not good... even poor.

Leadership - I question RR's demeanor. A team usually takes on the attitude of it's headman, and RR doesn't strike me as composed and "sure" of himself. That's not to say he's awful, a bad person, or anything.. just that he doesn't seem to inspire much confidence.. a "We're going to win because I won't let us fail" sort of feel.. if that makes sense. Troy Smith, for example, had that quality I'm trying to describe... Tressel has it too, in my opinion.

Pair this stuff with marriages to "gimmicky" schemes on both sides of the ball. I know the spread option has become more than a "gimmick" in today's game, and I know the 3-3-5 has it's purpose... but.. the reality of it is these system - in my opinion - are most effective when they are used by schools who have smaller kids who can't just line up and hit. They put pressure on different places and try to exploit that... but.. what you see most times is that eventually the "big boys" catch up, over power, and roll. I think about times when the Buckeyes, for example, would struggle to get their hands on shifty little MAC fucks for a quarter or two... and then end up winning 31-10 or whatever.

RR has taken Michigan, a "power" program designed to meet those interests held by the NFL, and turned it into a mid major program set on trying to "gimmick" its way in to wins. This was a colossal mistake. Indeed, all the talk was "Well, with WVU caliber guys RR was able to do bla bla bla.. imagine what he'll do with Michigan men!" Well... he never used the advantage Michigan has over WVU... He still takes WVU caliber players...

This aint the Big East. RR hasn't figured that out yet.
He's not coaching at friggin Miami of Ohio... he hasn't figured that out yet either.

 

[Steve19]

[snip]
You think that might upset the AD? What the [censored] is his problem?

Too much cheese, not enough pepperoni?

 

[Buckeye86]

Really, depth along the lines is where it is most obvious, and this post speaks mostly to those areas

depth, especially along the lines, is the number one thing I would point to that KILLED Ohio State in the high profile bowl losses a few years ago, I have said it before, but the weak recruiting classes of '03 and '04 killed our depth in '06, '07, so while our starters were the best in the country, when we played LSU and Florida they rolled us with their depth along the lines especially

to bring this back to Michigan, it might not take them long (once they can Rodriguez) to get some starters in the pipeline to bring the program back to 9-3 seasons, it is going to take quite some time to get the depth back that they need to compete with elite teams