2010 TSUN arguments & shenanigans (in-season)

[Dryden]

Here is another gem from a Scum fan.....Makes me proud to have JT as our coach.....:osu:

Here's a Jim Tressel story for you: I used to work with a woman whose grandson was a good-but-not-great high school football player (he's now a preferred walk-on at Toledo). She wrote Tressel a letter telling him about her grandson and her hope that he could play at OSU. Now, Tressel must have known that the kid was not Big Ten material, but not long after the letter went out, Dick Tressel showed up at the kid's high school and talked to the kid about his future. The kid also got an invitation to the OSU football camp, a great opportunity to showcase his skills. Tressel gained nothing (from a purely selfish perspective) by trying to help this kid but he did it anyway...I'm sure you can come up with a cynical explantion of what Tressel did here (as with his class) but cynical reasons can be read into any good act.

I think it's obvious ... JT is steering kids to Toledo, where they can also enjoy the opportunity to beat Michigan.

 

[billmac91]

Really?

It hasn't seemed to affect Florida at all, who signs 5* after 5* to play in a ZONE READ offense and who sent more players to the NFL in this past draft than any other team, including a center named Maurkice Pouncey who just so happened to go in the 1st round and is now starting for the Pittsburgh Steelers as a rookie.

And please. Our 4* recruits in these classes haven't been "half-slot midgets", that's a ridiculous statement.

The only 4* slot WR's from those classes that are 5'9/5'10-ish were Terrence Robinson and Jeremy Gallon. That's it.

Michigan will get it's fair share of elite recruits as long as they are actually winning and competing for B10 titles.

Going 8-16, talk and negativing surrounding Rich and his job security, and looming NCAA sanctions have hampered recruiting. Not the type of scheme Rich runs.

Scheme was the underlying reason Terrelle Pryor chose to go to Ohio State over Michigan. Because he wanted to become an NFL QB.

And Florida zone offense is significantly different than Michigans. While they are both technically spreads, Michigan doesn't utilize drive blocking and pass protection schemes like Florida has. Urban Meyer incorporates some NFL style techniques in his offense.

When Michigan can recruit a run/pass threat like Braxton Miller out of High School I'll be impressed. Or a 6'2 230 lb running back. Until then it's all jitterbug RB's, projects at QB, and a massive collection of slot dots.

But if you don't believe me, just keep comparing Ohio States track record for producing pros vs. Michigan. It'd be nice to have D-Rod there for 10 years so a fair sample size could be taken in a heads up comparison. I doubt we ever get that, but it'd be fun to look at.

 

[OMGbro]

What happened to Odoms, Teric & Dileo? Smith was also in that ballpark, and Kelvin was added in a different way.

Odoms, Teric, and Dileo all 3*'s. Smith is a RB, not a slot, and he was a 3* as well. Kelvin wasn't even rated as a football prospect in high school, he was a basketball one. BTW, Odoms doesn't even play in the slot, he plays on the outside primarily, just like he did in his entire illustrious HS career at Pahokee.

Because florida goes out and makes their own success in recruiting, they don't wait until their own failures are no longer holding them back (which is dangerously close to a potentially endless loop) before they start landing elite classes.

Not really buying that argument. First of all, Florida has a big edge over every school in the nation save maybe Texas and USC in that they don't even have to leave their backyard to get the top ranked players in the country in any given year.

Secondly, Urban's first year at Florida he went 9-3 and finished 2nd in the SEC East. Not 3-9 and dead last in the conference. Pretty big difference right there. Urban's second year at Florida he won the National Title, he didn't go 5-7 and he wasn't rumored to be fired and he didn't have to deal with practice-gate.

Florida won't land another Brantley after how that's worked out. They'll be fine with other players though.

You think Florida would give up Brantley for Robinson? Tate? Devin? I do. Florida tried like hell to get Devin at the last minute. Robinson, Tate, and Devin were all ranked as 4*'s in Top100/250 type lists. Good enough rankings for me. Don't need to have a 5* QB recruit every year to have a prolific offense.

You can land elite recruits in any scheme, but there are going to be challenges for certain QBs, I-form RBs & Braylon-type WRs if the offense doesn't suit them. It seems to finally be adjusting for the latter, the former two are probably not going to change.

The scheme absolutely hampers WR & QB recruiting. It doesn't prevent it however, and there will always be plenty of athletes and interested parties to find recruits, OL as well.

I don't think the scheme hampers WR recruiting much, if at all. It hampers QB recruiting simply because of the fact that it takes a very specific skill set to run the style of offense.

RB/WR talk- that's certainly debatable. I don't think it has affected Michigan's recruitment of WR's as much as you think it has.

Flankers and split ends aren't that attracted to an offense overly focused on bubble screens, decoy routes for Stonum & most passes to the slots and backs. That playcalling held back national recruiting as much as the results did.

We seem to be doing just fine in the WR recruiting department, and right now our #2 and #3 leading receivers in terms of yardage are a split end and a flanker in Stonum/Hemingway and the play-calling seems just fine to me as well. They seem to be letting Denard throw down the field more and more and his accuracy has improved greatly compared to where it was last year.

 

[Dryden]

I thought it was pretty telling when John Gruden made the observation during the Patriots/Dolphins MNF game last night that neither Tom Brady or Chad Henne would start at Michigan right now.

 

[zwem]

When Michigan can recruit a run/pass threat like Braxton Miller out of High School I'll be impressed. Or a 6'2 230 lb running back. Until then it's all jitterbug RB's, projects at QB, and a massive collection of slot dots.

Devin Gardner and Stephen Hopkins. Probably not good players in most people's eyes, but they fit the mold.

 

[zwem]

I thought it was pretty telling when John Gruden made the observation during the Patriots/Dolphins MNF game last night that neither Tom Brady or Chad Henne would start at Michigan right now.

Henne.....dude drove me nuts. Brady did more in 2 years than Henne did in 4.

 

[SSS]

Devin Gardner and Stephen Hopkins. Probably not good players in most people's eyes, but they fit the mold.

OSU can land Jake Stoneburner when he's from Dublin Coffman (like Gardner from Inkster in AA's backyard). Whether they can land him from elsewhere is another matter.

 

[OMGbro]

Scheme was the underlying reason Terrelle Pryor chose to go to Ohio State over Michigan. Because he wanted to become an NFL QB.

Do you honestly believe the garbage you write?

Terrelle Pryor chose Ohio State over Michigan because Michigan didn't even start recruiting him until a month before NSD when it was announced Rich was hired. Lloyd Carr wanted Terrelle.....as a Wide Receiver...and he made that perfectly clear from the start.

Truth of the matter is Ohio State was solidly entrenched as the #1 choice for Pryor when Michigan actually, you know, offered him a shot at QB. It was a complete uphill battle for Michigan to try and come in there and basically get him to flip within a couple of weeks.

And Terrelle Pryor is not an NFL QB, he'll never be. Doesn't matter what scheme he's in. Period.

And Florida zone offense is significantly different than Michigans. While they are both technically spreads, Michigan doesn't utilize drive blocking and pass protection schemes like Florida has. Urban Meyer incorporates some NFL style techniques in his offense.

Lol. While it is a different offense, it's principals are the same and it's very similar. Meyer is good friends with Rich and the foundation/blue-print of that offense came from Rich.

When Michigan can recruit a run/pass threat like Braxton Miller out of High School I'll be impressed.

Oh, you mean...like Devin Gardner. How about Denard Robinson?

Or a 6'2 230 lb running back.

Does true frosh RB 6-0, 228-pound Stephen Hopkins count?

projects at QB

Ha! That's funny, because your current QB is the definition of the word project QB, and I am pretty sure that your hot-shot QB recruit Braxton Miller completed about 43% of his passes last year as a JR with oh, I don't know, 7-million turn-overs.

massive collection of slot dots.

Oh, you mean like 6-2, 194 pound Darryl Stonum (#2 leading statistical WR)? 6'1, 226 pound JR Hemingway (#3 leading statistical WR) ? 6'1, 183 pound Je'Ron Stokes? 6'2, 210 pound Ricardo Miller? 6'4, 200 pound Jeremy Jackson? 6'0, 178 pound Roy Roundtree (#1 leading statistical WR)? How about Rich's lone WR recruit for the 2011 class, 6'3, 180 pound Shawn Conway? But yeah, you're right, Michigan's WR's are all 5'9 midgets.

 

[zwem]

OSU can land Jake Stoneburner when he's from Dublin Coffman (like Gardner from Inkster in AA's backyard). Whether they can land him from elsewhere is another matter.

Well to be fair, it's been hard to recruit Michigan the past 5 years or so. Players have bolted for other places. I thought Florida would come up and get him.

 

[Dryden]

Terrelle Pryor chose Ohio State over Michigan because Michigan didn't even start recruiting him until a month before NSD when it was announced Rich was hired. Lloyd Carr wanted Terrelle.....as a Wide Receiver...and he made that perfectly clear from the start.

You mean the Terrelle Pryor that had a scholarship offer from Rich Rodriguez and West Virginia back in October 2006? The Terrelle Pryor that Rich Rodriguez called, even before talking to Pat White and the rest of his current WVU team, the day he left for Michigan?

Good lord, you're punch-drunk on the Kool-Aid up there in A2.

 

[OMGbro]

I thought it was pretty telling when John Gruden made the observation during the Patriots/Dolphins MNF game last night that neither Tom Brady or Chad Henne would start at Michigan right now.

Denard Robinson is doing things nobody has ever done before. He's setting and simultaneously breaking his own records, which just happen to be virtually every school record for offense as a true sophomore.

Brady was a very good game manager as a SR and Henne never lived up to his potential. Neither one of them ever looked as good as Denard in a Michigan uniform, even against Indiana. Pretty sure that in Chad's last game @ Indiana he threw 2 INT's.

 

[SSS]

Denard Robinson is doing things nobody has ever done before. He's setting and simultaneously breaking his own records, which just happen to be virtually every school record for offense as a true sophomore.

Brady was a very good game manager as a SR and Henne never lived up to his potential. Neither one of them ever looked as good as Denard in a Michigan uniform, even against Indiana. Pretty sure that in Chad's last game @ Indiana he threw 2 INT's.

Starting ahead of college Brady is tantamount to starting over Cato June.

 

[OMGbro]

You mean the Terrelle Pryor that had a scholarship offer from Rich Rodriguez and West Virginia back in October 2006? The Terrelle Pryor that Rich Rodriguez called, even before talking to Pat White and the rest of his current WVU team, the day he left for Michigan?

Good lord, you're punch-drunk on the Kool-Aid up there in A2.

Please. He was never going to West Virginia because he felt it wasn't big enough for him. The kid pretty much came out and said so himself.

Fact is, he only visited Michigan as far as I know one time, on an official, and that was like 3 weeks before NSD, whereas he had been to Ohio State at least 3-4 times.

 

[3074326]

This guy is the dumbest condescending asshole I've seen in a while.

Enjoy your defensive breakdowns in the Big 10 season. You're not worth responding to. And it's not because you're making good points. It's because your head is so far up your program's ass that it's not worth trying to get you to see what you really have up north. And let me tell you, I like what you have up north. And I'm a Buckeye.

 

[SSS]

Fact is, he only visited Michigan as far as I know one time, on an official, and that was like 3 weeks before NSD, whereas he had been to Ohio State at least 3-4 times.

And he didn't like his visit, which he was texting during the basketball game. Charlie Batch flat out told Michigan and reporters (during the visit) that there was no chance Terrelle was coming.