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- Thread starter slickman
- Start date
On a message board it is totally irresponsible not to give the "first post" treatment. If you want to speculate on every comment any yahoo wishes to throw out here is the link:
http://mb23.scout.com/fohiostatefrm1
We also have a rumor mill, which is perhaps where this thread belongs.
http://mb23.scout.com/fohiostatefrm1
We also have a rumor mill, which is perhaps where this thread belongs.
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IronBuckI
Calmer than you are.
[QUOTE='68Flask]I wonder if HH or wstripes got the "first post" treatment too.....?[/QUOTE]
HH still gets the "first post treatment" from the slapnuts at bucknuts. I also seriously doubt that wstripes or HH came on with some info like this in their very first post.
The fact that gbuck has handled all this criticism about his first post as well as he has. I would actually give him some positive rep, if I did that sort of thing. Despite my first post, criticizing gbuck, in this thread. At least the guy didn't come in with some my cousin's brother in law's uncle shit.
Welcome to The Planet gbuck and bryanhd20. It does get better in here. People, including myself, are just tired of the bashing of players that goes on. I know you weren't actually bashing anyone, but we're not very receptive to info that comes from sources that haven't already been established as reputable. Like wstripes, HH, Alan, Goof, etc..
HH still gets the "first post treatment" from the slapnuts at bucknuts. I also seriously doubt that wstripes or HH came on with some info like this in their very first post.
The fact that gbuck has handled all this criticism about his first post as well as he has. I would actually give him some positive rep, if I did that sort of thing. Despite my first post, criticizing gbuck, in this thread. At least the guy didn't come in with some my cousin's brother in law's uncle shit.
Welcome to The Planet gbuck and bryanhd20. It does get better in here. People, including myself, are just tired of the bashing of players that goes on. I know you weren't actually bashing anyone, but we're not very receptive to info that comes from sources that haven't already been established as reputable. Like wstripes, HH, Alan, Goof, etc..
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'68Flask
B-Deck, Dogs and Spirits
Touchy.......Gotta love the 'net...wasn't mad, actually thought his post was dubious or just opinion of some sort and took it that way. He did ask our opinion at the end though....
Just kills me sometimes that some on boards disregard out of hand even legitamate info before looking into the post.... :)
Besides, my wifes' sister said her cousin knows this to be a fact she read in a "lonely widows" chat.....:osu:
Just kills me sometimes that some on boards disregard out of hand even legitamate info before looking into the post.... :)
Besides, my wifes' sister said her cousin knows this to be a fact she read in a "lonely widows" chat.....:osu:
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Pnut
Newbie
68Flask asks how can Zwick not be the starter? The most obvious reason for Troy or Todd to start instead of Justin is that he has two opportunities to lose the job: in Spring Practice and in Fall Practice. Had Zwick been chosen to start against OkState because Smith had played poorly when he had the chance rather than being suspended, then Zwick surely would ben the presumptive starter going into Spring Practice. It would, as it were, be "his job to lose."
I got the clear impression after the UM game and before the "incident" arose that JT was solidly behind Troy. Now there is one and only one reason should Troy be our best QB (in JT's eyes) why JT might chose Justin or Todd over Troy is that JT wants proof from Troy that he won't let his team down again by violating a team or NCAA rule or breaking a law. JT certainly doesn't want to start Troy in the first game and give him most of the reps the next week only to find out that he got arrested on the Thursday night before the game for a dui. I don't know what would reassure JT that Troy is now on a straight and narrow path. It may already have happened. The fact that Troy didn't take the money, which was not a very large amount anyway, simply out of greed would be an important factor I would think in supporting the idea that he would be very unlikely to repeat that "mistake." Of course, sadly, there are other things a young man might do that would get him in trouble. I did many of them myself way back when.
I see the Texas game as winnable and should Troy be reinstated and be a member in good standing for the first game, I can't see JT going with Zwick or the other two guys if he believes that Troy gives the team the best chance to win. The Texas game could go a long way to putting us in BCS #1 or #2 territory. It is huge.
I got the clear impression after the UM game and before the "incident" arose that JT was solidly behind Troy. Now there is one and only one reason should Troy be our best QB (in JT's eyes) why JT might chose Justin or Todd over Troy is that JT wants proof from Troy that he won't let his team down again by violating a team or NCAA rule or breaking a law. JT certainly doesn't want to start Troy in the first game and give him most of the reps the next week only to find out that he got arrested on the Thursday night before the game for a dui. I don't know what would reassure JT that Troy is now on a straight and narrow path. It may already have happened. The fact that Troy didn't take the money, which was not a very large amount anyway, simply out of greed would be an important factor I would think in supporting the idea that he would be very unlikely to repeat that "mistake." Of course, sadly, there are other things a young man might do that would get him in trouble. I did many of them myself way back when.
I see the Texas game as winnable and should Troy be reinstated and be a member in good standing for the first game, I can't see JT going with Zwick or the other two guys if he believes that Troy gives the team the best chance to win. The Texas game could go a long way to putting us in BCS #1 or #2 territory. It is huge.
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HineyBuck
Old newb
First off, let me say that I would be happy with any of the three (JZ, TB, or TS) at QB. All are good, and all are capable of leading us to the National Championship.
That said, the depth chart going into Spring practice is, as I understand it: 1) JZ, 2) TB, and 3) TS. Coming out of the scUM game, the job was Troy's to lose. And he lost it. Tressel has said (a couple of times) that Troy starts out at the bottom of the totem pole. Certainly he will be given a full and fair opportunity to win the starting position, but when you start out at #3, and both #2 and #1 are awfully damned good, it would take a lot to make it happen.
There seems to be a persistent belief among many that JZ is just not very good. I can't buy into that. Unless someone else just blows away the competition in Spring and Fall practice, Justin is the starter for game #1. Assuming that, what would it take for him to lose the starting job during the season? One of two things: a) injury, or b) poor play. Yanking him for poor play would likely mean we take a loss. And there goes the National Championship bid. Thus, wishing that Troy Smith takes back the starting role by mid-season seems to be tantamount to wishing that a) Justin gets injured, or b) he plays so badly that we lose a game.
It's fine to have favorites. And a QB controversy in February is not likely to disrupt team morale. But as the season approaches, fans should be careful about what they wish for. I'm with Martinss01 on this. The most likely scenario, and the best scenario as far as the Bucks chances for a National Championship, is that Justin starts from game #1 and continues as starter all the way through the Rose Bowl.
:osu:
That said, the depth chart going into Spring practice is, as I understand it: 1) JZ, 2) TB, and 3) TS. Coming out of the scUM game, the job was Troy's to lose. And he lost it. Tressel has said (a couple of times) that Troy starts out at the bottom of the totem pole. Certainly he will be given a full and fair opportunity to win the starting position, but when you start out at #3, and both #2 and #1 are awfully damned good, it would take a lot to make it happen.
There seems to be a persistent belief among many that JZ is just not very good. I can't buy into that. Unless someone else just blows away the competition in Spring and Fall practice, Justin is the starter for game #1. Assuming that, what would it take for him to lose the starting job during the season? One of two things: a) injury, or b) poor play. Yanking him for poor play would likely mean we take a loss. And there goes the National Championship bid. Thus, wishing that Troy Smith takes back the starting role by mid-season seems to be tantamount to wishing that a) Justin gets injured, or b) he plays so badly that we lose a game.
It's fine to have favorites. And a QB controversy in February is not likely to disrupt team morale. But as the season approaches, fans should be careful about what they wish for. I'm with Martinss01 on this. The most likely scenario, and the best scenario as far as the Bucks chances for a National Championship, is that Justin starts from game #1 and continues as starter all the way through the Rose Bowl.
:osu:
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#1buckeyestunna
Junior
i believe coach T, will go with the guy who practices the best. I have heard him say this before and believe all parties involve knows this going in. TB will have to be pretty amazing for tressel to consider starting a red shirt frosh.Also coach is not going to have qb controversy hanging over a team so highly touted. He will pick a guy stick with him to the bitter end much to many of our chagrin.He has shown loyalty and confidence in the person he has picked know matter the clamoring from outsiders.
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FKAGobucks877
The Most Power-Drunk
Several things...Tressel has never, ever, indicated that TS was in his "doghouse", or that he would never see the field again. There are a lot of people on this board that seem to feel that because TS screwed up the way he did, the coaches will never let him see the field again. Horseshit. He was moved, as of the date of his suspension, to the bottom of the totem pole. He can be back to the top of the totem pole before the season starts. I'm not saying he will, but he was a significantly better QB last season than JZ, and his performance in the scUM game only solidified his status as the starting QB. As Tressel has yet to announce that TS is in his doghouse (so to speak), I will choose to believe that JT will (or has) punished TS, and move on.
Secondly, there have been some conflicting statements made in this thread regarding the ability of Todd Boeckman. From everything I have ever heard, from coaches, players, and independent third parties (people in the know, Herbie, etc.), TB is an excellent QB, and would have pushed for the starting job this year even without the TS implosion. Again, I'm not saying he's the starter, but I have never heard anyone say anything negative about him; conversely, I have heard many people go out of their way to announce how talented he is.
Secondly, there have been some conflicting statements made in this thread regarding the ability of Todd Boeckman. From everything I have ever heard, from coaches, players, and independent third parties (people in the know, Herbie, etc.), TB is an excellent QB, and would have pushed for the starting job this year even without the TS implosion. Again, I'm not saying he's the starter, but I have never heard anyone say anything negative about him; conversely, I have heard many people go out of their way to announce how talented he is.
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I think we need to evaluate JZ more fairly, on both the positive and negative end. He has a lot of talent and showed some toughness and touch while injured in the Alamo Bowl. Also, he had no running game to freeze the pass rush, and the OL looked like they were fresh out of high school when he was still the starter.
However I also think we need to remember the leadership Smith brought to this team. Yes he was blessed by the emergence of Ginn & Gonzo, an improved OL, and a couple of easier games (IU, PSU) to allow those factors and himself to gel and make progress. But he did turn around a team that was dead in the water. We should not have lost to NW, could not support our defense against Wisconsin, and I don't even need to mention what happened in Iowa.
TS revitalized a slumping team with his enthusiasm and drive to win, and players seemed to rally around that. He was willing to sacrifice his body and scramble for the tough yards, and then lower his helmet against the defenders. He managed to get the ball to Ginn more than JZ could (again, partially due to Ginn's route improvement), and made a number of timely passes to make us list Gonzo as the third threat thru the air.
I really think that all three QBs are talented. TB has received rave reviews, but JZ was popular with coaches last year IIRC. Until his incident, TS was far and away the leader of this team.
I really don't think any of us know for sure what is going to happen. Hopefully the addition of Boone to an already vastly improved OL will be enough for our rushing attack. Hopefully MWells will be ready to go, Pittman's success will continue, and Haw will live up to at least some of his billing and be able to handle the "big back" carries. But realize that our rushing attack might not be as good as we want it to be (at least not right away), and at first we still might need a more mobile QB.
These are all things we can't understand. We also don't know the dynamics of which QB the players rally around the most (I'm sure each has their followers, but which has the most overall support). We don't know whether Smith has looked impressive in practices in addition to playing good in games (there was no comparison, Zwick was hurt and TB was RS-ing).
But by all means, we have very little to discuss earnestly. So enjoy reading this post, and still consider there to be clear favorites for the QB job so that we can all disagree with you. :)
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Interesting question... I was being sarcastic earlier when I made fun of the newer posters with this inside info about TB (no hard feelings guys, and I didn't ding you, fyi) and I said Ted Ginn would play QB.
But if he were doing an end around, and then right as a defender closed on him, he threw the ball up and over the defender's head (a 7-10 yard lob) and run and get it himself? Basically he would go from running, to throwing a lob pass, and then being the receiver that catches up to the ball. Technically, if he timed it right wouldn't the defender be prevented from hitting him (roughing the passer) or impeding his path to the ball (pass interference?).
I realize this is an absurd play, I'm just imagining it could work if there was one linebacker who was somewhat stationary... plus it would make a dang cool highlight for his heisman campaign.
However I also think we need to remember the leadership Smith brought to this team. Yes he was blessed by the emergence of Ginn & Gonzo, an improved OL, and a couple of easier games (IU, PSU) to allow those factors and himself to gel and make progress. But he did turn around a team that was dead in the water. We should not have lost to NW, could not support our defense against Wisconsin, and I don't even need to mention what happened in Iowa.
TS revitalized a slumping team with his enthusiasm and drive to win, and players seemed to rally around that. He was willing to sacrifice his body and scramble for the tough yards, and then lower his helmet against the defenders. He managed to get the ball to Ginn more than JZ could (again, partially due to Ginn's route improvement), and made a number of timely passes to make us list Gonzo as the third threat thru the air.
I really think that all three QBs are talented. TB has received rave reviews, but JZ was popular with coaches last year IIRC. Until his incident, TS was far and away the leader of this team.
I really don't think any of us know for sure what is going to happen. Hopefully the addition of Boone to an already vastly improved OL will be enough for our rushing attack. Hopefully MWells will be ready to go, Pittman's success will continue, and Haw will live up to at least some of his billing and be able to handle the "big back" carries. But realize that our rushing attack might not be as good as we want it to be (at least not right away), and at first we still might need a more mobile QB.
These are all things we can't understand. We also don't know the dynamics of which QB the players rally around the most (I'm sure each has their followers, but which has the most overall support). We don't know whether Smith has looked impressive in practices in addition to playing good in games (there was no comparison, Zwick was hurt and TB was RS-ing).
But by all means, we have very little to discuss earnestly. So enjoy reading this post, and still consider there to be clear favorites for the QB job so that we can all disagree with you. :)
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Interesting question... I was being sarcastic earlier when I made fun of the newer posters with this inside info about TB (no hard feelings guys, and I didn't ding you, fyi) and I said Ted Ginn would play QB.
But if he were doing an end around, and then right as a defender closed on him, he threw the ball up and over the defender's head (a 7-10 yard lob) and run and get it himself? Basically he would go from running, to throwing a lob pass, and then being the receiver that catches up to the ball. Technically, if he timed it right wouldn't the defender be prevented from hitting him (roughing the passer) or impeding his path to the ball (pass interference?).
I realize this is an absurd play, I'm just imagining it could work if there was one linebacker who was somewhat stationary... plus it would make a dang cool highlight for his heisman campaign.
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martinss01
blissfully stupid
ok people. last i heard ts was suspended for 2 games. has this changed? if not, how on earth can ts beat anyone out for the position by the end of spring and fall practice? you can't win a starting position you are not eligable for!
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Smith might not have been slapped with a full 2 game suspension if the NCAA had done it (that is merely a typical punishment for his amount of booster cash). tOSU made a preemptive move and suspended him immediately. They are hoping that the NCAA will rule that missing the Bowl game experience (i.e. practice, game, and fun) will count as two games. It is possible that he could start against Miami. However that wouldn't help tOSU's reputation very much, since everyone thinks he is out for that game.martinss01 said:
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martinss01
blissfully stupid
i know we suspended him immediately for the 2 games. but i was under the impression that we would have to petition the ncaa to decrease the suspension to 1 game. which gieger had originally intended to do. but i thought he had backed off that stance before the alamo bowl. i know tressel said that ts had served "some" of his punishment by sitting out the alamo bowl. which leads me to believe that (atleast at that time) no such patition was going to happen.
the typical punishment for this is to sit out 20% of the regular season if i am remembering correctly. in a 11 game season (not counting a bowl) thats 2.2 games. hard to round that down to 1... if we do, it really leaves us open to attacks from everyone for being soft on punishments. in which they would be correct. it would flat out be correct to say he served LESS THAN half the NCAA required punishment.
not that i think he deserves to get slammed for what he did. i simply think he picked the absolute worst possible time to do something stupid.
i just find it shocking to see so many people believe with such conviction that ts will be/should be eligible to play against miami (OH). seems how you play against scum determines what you can and can't do in life in their eyes *shrug*.
the typical punishment for this is to sit out 20% of the regular season if i am remembering correctly. in a 11 game season (not counting a bowl) thats 2.2 games. hard to round that down to 1... if we do, it really leaves us open to attacks from everyone for being soft on punishments. in which they would be correct. it would flat out be correct to say he served LESS THAN half the NCAA required punishment.
not that i think he deserves to get slammed for what he did. i simply think he picked the absolute worst possible time to do something stupid.
i just find it shocking to see so many people believe with such conviction that ts will be/should be eligible to play against miami (OH). seems how you play against scum determines what you can and can't do in life in their eyes *shrug*.
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He didn't pick the worst possible time to do something stupid (assuming he only took money once). He just got turned in at the worst possible time. If he had gotten caught last spring when it happened and had to sit out the first 2 games last season, it probably wouldn't have turned out any differently for him except he would have started the bowl game.martinss01 said:
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