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Yankees lose! Thaaaaaaa, Yankees LOSE!

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While I can appreciate that NYC and Boston, for example, have enough population to support bringing in the $$ to spend on buying All Star players, in my mind, there really isn't much of a reason any team out there can't make a similar committment.

If you're bummed that your small market team isn't competing, than have that small market team start spending some money. "We can't afford it...." Bullshit. You don't WANT to afford it. The Twins, for example... they're considered "Small Market" and yet they are the ONLY baseball for hundreds of miles to the East (Milwaukee) and 1,000s of miles West (Seattle) and hundreds south (St. Louis or Chitown) Sell the damn product and the revenue will follow. I don't want to hear about how no one can afford to compete with the Yanks. It's not that, it's that they dont WANT to.
 
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Buckeyeskickbuttocks said:
While I can appreciate that NYC and Boston, for example, have enough population to support bringing in the $$ to spend on buying All Star players, in my mind, there really isn't much of a reason any team out there can't make a similar committment.

If you're bummed that your small market team isn't competing, than have that small market team start spending some money. "We can't afford it...." Bullshit. You don't WANT to afford it. The Twins, for example... they're considered "Small Market" and yet they are the ONLY baseball for hundreds of miles to the East (Milwaukee) and 1,000s of miles West (Seattle) and hundreds south (St. Louis or Chitown) Sell the damn product and the revenue will follow. I don't want to hear about how no one can afford to compete with the Yanks. It's not that, it's that they dont WANT to.
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An EXCELLENT post BKB
 
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How is a Reds fan supposed to make the Reds spend money and compete? Yankee fans hang their hats on arguments like this because they know they have an unfair advantage and don't want to give it up. Makes you wonder how they can even be fans of other sports.......or golf for that matter :p
 
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Buckeyeskickbuttocks said:
While I can appreciate that NYC and Boston, for example, have enough population to support bringing in the $$ to spend on buying All Star players, in my mind, there really isn't much of a reason any team out there can't make a similar committment.

If you're bummed that your small market team isn't competing, than have that small market team start spending some money. "We can't afford it...." Bullshit. You don't WANT to afford it. The Twins, for example... they're considered "Small Market" and yet they are the ONLY baseball for hundreds of miles to the East (Milwaukee) and 1,000s of miles West (Seattle) and hundreds south (St. Louis or Chitown) Sell the damn product and the revenue will follow. I don't want to hear about how no one can afford to compete with the Yanks. It's not that, it's that they dont WANT to.
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This is assuming a few faulty things IMO:
1) That baseball sells that well (ask any kid whether he likes football or baseball better. plus, there is CFB & NFL to be sold, both during the best time for baseball). This doesn't mean they can't do better, but it's not the easiest sport to market, especially as it continues to nosedive with the steroids stuff.
2) That if they throw money at it, suddenly they'll have the revenue to start stocking a team full of studs that is at least capable of competing with the yankees

I agree there are disgusting owners that just pocket cash, but if you think that all teams can change their philosophy and start competing with the Yankees for talent level just by marketing harder, I think you are mistaken.

In the NFL the talented teams that do market like crazy and are on top one year are often unseeded the next. Look at the 49ers. However, they won't stay down forever.
 
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BuckeyeNation27 said:
How is a Reds fan supposed to make the Reds spend money and compete? Yankee fans hang their hats on arguments like this because they know they have an unfair advantage and don't want to give it up. Makes you wonder how they can even be fans of other sports.......or golf for that matter :p
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I'd like to see anyone argue that the NFL isn't the best product on the market right now. If baseball was run the same way, 20-25 teams every year could be reasonably optimistic and have a reason to watch. Meanwhile, us Reds fans know that there is not a thing we can do to get in the playoffs, beyond catching lightning in a bottle.

As long as their team wins, they will argue their methods to the grave. If they were on the other side of the argument...they'd sing a completely different song.
YANKEES SUCK! :cheers:
 
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Buckeyeskickbuttocks said:
While I can appreciate that NYC and Boston, for example, have enough population to support bringing in the $$ to spend on buying All Star players, in my mind, there really isn't much of a reason any team out there can't make a similar committment.

If you're bummed that your small market team isn't competing, than have that small market team start spending some money. "We can't afford it...." Bullshit. You don't WANT to afford it. The Twins, for example... they're considered "Small Market" and yet they are the ONLY baseball for hundreds of miles to the East (Milwaukee) and 1,000s of miles West (Seattle) and hundreds south (St. Louis or Chitown) Sell the damn product and the revenue will follow. I don't want to hear about how no one can afford to compete with the Yanks. It's not that, it's that they dont WANT to.
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Partly true, BKB, but the Yankees get $55 million a year from their local TV deal. That's more than some teams' entire payrolls. Teams can try harder, but they can't match what the Yankees spend.
 
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BB73 said:
Partly true, BKB, but the Yankees get $55 million a year from their local TV deal. That's more than some teams' entire payrolls. Teams can try harder, but they can't match what the Yankees spend.
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Thats more than allot of teams payroll's.
You just cant defend a team spending over 200+ million, no matter how you spin it.
The Yanks make the game boring for the rest of us who want to see more than 1 or 2 teams with big time all-stars, who want to see teams grow players through their farm systems, and would like to have a chance to sign a big name player or two...
 
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strohs said:
Thats more than allot of teams payroll's.
You just cant defend a team spending over 200+ million, no matter how you spin it.
The Yanks make the game boring for the rest of us who want to see more than 1 or 2 teams with big time all-stars, who want to see teams grow players through their farm systems, and would like to have a chance to sign a big name player or two...
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And keep those players that come up through the farm systems. The thing I hear from yankee fans is how jeter and mariano and people like that came up through the farm system so they aren't really buying championships. The problem there is that if jeter and mariano came from KC, they would've been shipped off to the highest bidder once they became better than their team. The yankees don't have to worry about that.
 
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All I want to know is... if dollars correlate to # of victories... and in some measure we know they do....

How much did the Yankees spend per win?

I don't have time to run the numbers right now... But I'd bet they are the most underacheiving team in baseball.

The Indians for example spent a shade under 500K per win... the Yankees, something like 2.6 million... anyone spend more?
 
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BB73 said:
Partly true, BKB, but the Yankees get $55 million a year from their local TV deal. That's more than some teams' entire payrolls. Teams can try harder, but they can't match what the Yankees spend.
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Is there some reason the Reds can't get a big Local TV contract?
Is there any reason why the Twins aren't selling TV rights like Hot Cakes to North and South Dakota, Wyoming, Montana? Etc...

If your answer is, lack of interest, then make it interesting. It's not like the Yankees or the Sox just showed up and commanded interest... no, over time they have invested in their programs and made fans out of people...

............

Jwin, I thought that Yankees were also in the MLB and therefore suffered the same drawbacks of Baseball not selling as well as Football. Perhaps I assume too much?

Second, I'm in no way suggesting you "throw money at it" I'm suggesting you INVEST in your team. There's a difference.

..............

27
How is a Reds fan supposed to make the Reds spend? Well, stop showing up to games until they field a quality team, I guess. Other than that, it's really out of the Fans hands, and up to the owners.

It's not an "unfair" advantage where each team in the league could maximize that same advantage IF they were willing to take the risk. Blame your favorite little market team for being pussies or money grubbing swine, but get off George's nuts about it.... AS I said above, George may be a lot of things, but one of them is "committed to winning"
....................................

All in all a lot of you sound like MAC football fans. Waaa waaa waaa... we can't compete.... bla bla bla.... You want a big time team? Root for someone who's owner takes it seriously enough to sock big time bucks in to it.

(And, as I said before, and in agreement with Oiler, the NFL should be the standard for how to run Professional Sports.)
 
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AKAKBUCK said:
All I want to know is... if dollars correlate to # of victories... and in some measure we know they do....

How much did the Yankees spend per win?

I don't have time to run the numbers right now... But I'd bet they are the most underacheiving team in baseball.

The Indians for example spent a shade under 500K per win... the Yankees, something like 2.6 million... anyone spend more?
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You could probably scientifically derive a saturation curve relating $ spent and wins...:wink2:
 
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BKB, If you were a multi-millionaire, would you invest money in turning the twins into a top team in MLB? It doesn't seem like a very smart investment to me. Sure investing in your team could work, but if you go way out on a limb in 2006 spending money, and you miss the playoffs, you can give up on next year. Who is gonna throw more money down the drain the following year when you couldn't get it done this year? You shouldn't have to risk everything just to have a chance to compete.

The poorest, least capable teams are asked to pull themselves out of a hole. In the NFL, a team with the lowest payroll will be able to sign lots of top free agents and reverse their luck the following season. And every team is capable of signing those players, b/c they don't have to spend 200 million to do so.

I'm not a fan of any baseball team, so I can hardly be like a whiny MAC football fan. I have grown to appreciate the game of baseball, but have zero interest in the league b/c there is no parity.

Jwin, I thought that Yankees were also in the MLB and therefore suffered the same drawbacks of Baseball not selling as well as Football. Perhaps I assume too much?
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this means nothing. They are the team benefiting from zero parity, therefore they win most years. Obviously the hometown is going to like being unbeatable most years, and when it is in THE city in the US, that's the easiest thing to market in the world.

If basketball had followed the baseball system, then the Bulls would have signed Patrick Ewing, Charles Barkley, and John Stockton to play with Michael Jordan and Scottie Pippen. It would not have been worth watching. Instead, the bulls were a dynasty, but were nearly beaten many times due to weaknesses in their roster.

It's like playing a dynasty in EA sports. You can stack your team and leave no holes at any position, but then it really isn't very challenging or fun. When you approve trades from other teams, and steal everyone else's good players, you lose the essence of the game and competition. The yankees thrive in a sport that allows you to do just that, and therefore many years it isn't much of a game.
 
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Yes, I would, Jwin... Because I believe in myself, and because I'd want to maximize my revenue. No one is arguing it happens over night, and it didn't happen over night in Boston or NYC. Poorest teams are in a hole... yep.... so is Miami Oh and Bowling Green... So the fuck what? Shoulda had the forsight to build your product 75 years ago.

Hell, OSU enjoy's today's present popularity in large part because they build a big ass stadium in 1922. It's the same idea with the Yanks, or Boston... they built up thier program from the same level as everyone else, and within the same rules.

AS for my other remark "meaning nothing" I guess maybe I don't follow.... How in the fuck are the Yankees so much bigger just because they play in NYC as compared to, say, Minneapolis/St. Paul.... Can Cleveland's population not fill the Jake? It's not like Yankees stadium seats 150,000 and whatnot. "Small market" is pure unadulterated bullshit. An excuse.

I'm not arguing baseball's system is the best system, or even that it encourages parity. I'm arguing that hating on the Yankees for buying wins is stupid as all fuck.
 
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jwinslow said:
BKB, If you were a multi-millionaire, would you invest money in turning the twins into a top team in MLB? It doesn't seem like a very smart investment to me. Sure investing in your team could work, but if you go way out on a limb in 2006 spending money, and you miss the playoffs, you can give up on next year. Who is gonna throw more money down the drain the following year when you couldn't get it done this year? You shouldn't have to risk everything just to have a chance to compete.
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And this is why people who don't take risk don't end up multi-millionaires. To make money, you gotta risk it. The higher the risk, the higher the reward.

George risks a shit load of money every year. A SHITLOAD. Damn right he should get rewarded for that, that's the whole fucking point of taking the risk in the first place. Turns out, it didn't work out for him this year, or last, or the year before, or the year before, or even the yaer before....
 
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