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WR Terrelle Pryor ('10 Rose, '11 Sugar MVP)

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Buckeyeskickbuttocks;1908536; said:
Being wrong does not necessarily indict ones morality.
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Not necessarily.. but in this case, a handful of players made some decisions that not only put an asterisk on their college careers, but got their school in trouble, their head coach in trouble, and put a lot of unnecessary pressure on their teammates.

And I realize that Tressel's actions are his own.
 
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matcar;1908533; said:
TP knowingly broke a rule. That doesn't make him a horrible guy but it does make him someone willing to risk both personal and team goals to break that rule. I can get with forgiving the action but suggestions that he did nothing wrong are absurd.
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I never claimed, or intended to claim he was without fault. My point is just because a law is a law doesn't make it right. Just because someone breaks a law, doesn't make them wrong. In a broader sense, not at TP specifically.

3074326;1908534; said:
I agree with your thoughts on the NCAA. It sucks.

That being said, this type of personal property is pretty clearly something that shouldn't be sold while in school. It not only gets the players in trouble, it gets the school in trouble and puts a lot of pressure on the rest of the team. It's one of the rules that I do agree with, and I do think it makes sense.

I really get the idea behind the "selling personal belongings should be allowed" argument. I just look at these items as more of a team/university owned thing until the player is done at school. Selling them is a pay-for-play kind of thing at its core.

I don't really agree with the punishment either, especially compared to other offenses. But there really isn't much else to say about that.
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If I have to concede that a rule shouldn't be broken because it's a rule, then you shouldn't be able to add qualifiers that make it less absurd. :biggrin:
 
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3074326;1908539; said:
Not necessarily.. but in this case, a handful of players made some decisions that not only put an asterisk on their college careers, but got their school in trouble, their head coach in trouble, and put a lot of unnecessary pressure on their teammates.

And I realize that Tressel's actions are his own.
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Your post contradicts itself. The players actions didn't get JT in trouble, nor the school. The players actions got themselves in trouble. JT's actions are what have gotten him in trouble, and if the University suffers, his actions will have been the catalyst.
 
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BUCKYLE;1908542; said:
Your post contradicts itself. The players actions didn't get JT in trouble, nor the school. The players actions got themselves in trouble. JT's actions are what have gotten him in trouble, and if the University suffers, his actions will have been the catalyst.
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JT handled the situation poorly, but the fact that there was a situation to deal with in the first place is the issue. But if you want to take out the part about the school and JT, I'm fine with it.

My point still remains.. their actions put their teammates in a tough spot. If we're going to keep talking about morality, that's something I find highly immoral. Pretty selfish. Selling some stuff for personal gain even though it could have massive consequences on probably more than 100 other people directly.. not a fan of this at all.
 
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3074326;1908544; said:
JT handled the situation poorly, but the fact that there was a situation to deal with in the first place is the issue. But if you want to take out the part about the school and JT, I'm fine with it.

My point still remains.. their actions put their teammates in a tough spot. If we're going to keep talking about morality, that's something I find highly immoral. Pretty selfish. Selling some stuff for personal gain even though it could have massive consequences on probably more than 100 other people directly.. not a fan of this at all.
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Their teammates suffering is greatly exaggerated, in my IMO. They aren't being judged, hired, or fired based on games won. It has a greater impact on fans, by far, in my imo, than the rest of the team.

Since you disagree, I'd greatly appreciate a couple examples of "massive consequences" to their teammates.
 
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BUCKYLE;1908542; said:
Your post contradicts itself. The players actions didn't get JT in trouble, nor the school. The players actions got themselves in trouble. JT's actions are what have gotten him in trouble, and if the University suffers, his actions will have been the catalyst.
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Agreed. The players made mistakes and then JT made his own mistakes. Saying that he wouldn't have been put in that position without the players making those choices is irrellevant and silly. Coaches are put in those positions all the time and they either make the proper choice or not. So I can't blame the Tat 5 for JT or the administration's mistakes.
 
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matcar;1908558; said:
Agreed. The players made mistakes and then JT made his own mistakes. Saying that he wouldn't have been put in that position without the players making those choices is irrellevant and silly. Coaches are put in those positions all the time and they either make the proper choice or not. So I can't blame the Tat 5 for JT or the administration's mistakes.
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Exactly. One can't blame the players for JT's fuck-up then not allow others to blame the NCAA for having the fucking absurd rules in the first place.
 
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matcar;1908533; said:
TP knowingly broke a rule. That doesn't make him a horrible guy but it does make him someone willing to risk both personal and team goals to break that rule. I can get with forgiving the action but suggestions that he did nothing wrong are absurd.
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Wrong according to who? The ncaa???? What we are trying to say is that the ncaa saying something is wrong does not make it actually wrong.
 
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It is unlawful in the state of Ohio to not buckle my seat belt when I drive my car. Am I "wrong" or immoral for making the choice not to anyway?
 
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BUCKYLE;1908546; said:
Their teammates suffering is greatly exaggerated, in my IMO. They aren't being judged, hired, or fired based on games won. It has a greater impact on fans, by far, in my imo, than the rest of the team.
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If you lose to Miami or Michigan State, or a rusty TP throws three pics in a losing effort one of his first games back - then yeah - teammates will suffer. Teammates want to go to the Rose Bowl. They want to continue the string of BCS games. If TP's actions lead you to the Capital One instead of the Rose Bowl, that is indeed a problem for the players as well as the fans.

I think you are significantly minimizing the effects of not having your starting QB for the first five games.
 
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Padraig;1908788; said:
It is unlawful in the state of Ohio to not buckle my seat belt when I drive my car. Am I "wrong" or immoral for making the choice not to anyway?
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Yes, you are just understandably wrong or easily forgiveable.

He didn't put anyone's life in jeopardy, assault anyone, badmouth anyone.

He made a mistake, got caught, deserves the punishment (under the rules in place... the absurdity of the rule is a separate issue), and deserves a shot to reconcile his legacy with a nearly unprecedented return to full strength when everyone else is starting to break down.
 
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