sandgk
Watson, Crick & A Twist
There's a reason programs other than tOSU lead the Fulmer Cup rankings.jwinslow;1621627; said:
BTW, isn't it about time those were updated from 9/3/2009?
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- Thread starter kevnow123
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BTW, isn't it about time those were updated from 9/3/2009?
JXC
17-4 since 2001
Bad apples happen anywhere. You have a big football program, kids get egos at big football programs, things happen.
Here is something that I think a football program has a little more control over. Graduation rate. Although part of me feels like this should only count players who don't go to the NFL, because honestly, who cares if you graduate if you get drafted. I'd much rather get drafted in the NFL then get a degree from any university. Not that the degree isn't important, and not that if you have a chance you shouldn't come back and graduate, much like Eddie George did. But getting paid 6 or 7 figures can go a much longer way than a degree can if you are smart with your money. But most of the football players on any program are never going to play professional football, even the big time programs.
I really wish Ohio State had a higher graduation rate, but it has come a long way. The Big Ten does very well overall when it comes to graduation rates though, but to be fair, the ACC does even better.
Miami, FL's graduation rate through the past 4 classes was 70%, Ohio State's was 51%. This was much lower for Ohio State before Tressel came to town. And as far as Miami, their graduation rate has soared lately. It was much, much lower as little as 5 years ago, when it was at 40s.
I don't know if it means anything, but 100% of white players graduated at Miami, where as 61% of black students did. Ohio State was 72% to 41%. Again, I would like to see these stats not include those who have NFL contracts. At almost all schools, white football players graduated at a higher rate than black ones.
Also, Ohio State graduates 68% of all it's students overall. Still lower than Miami's football team currently.
Miami has done a lot to turn their football program around as far as it becoming more respectable. Arrests are down and the graduation rate is up. But the same can be said for Ohio State, too. But to try and deny the type of program they ran in the past, that's a little silly.
To argue that Miami was giving a chance to the under-privileged is kind of silly. All universities give scholarships to under-privileged students. But college isn't for everybody, nor should it be. There is a difference between giving people second chances, and just letting players do whatever they want. Miami wasn't about giving kids second chances, it was about having no rules, no discipline, and making football first, and being a student second, and learning how to grow up to be a man last.
Miami has changed in this regard. And I feel it's also something that Tressel has brought to the table. Tressel makes it known that being a student and learning how to grow up and be a good man is much more important than football. He doesn't treat his student-athletes as players...he treats them as students. Sometimes I think we forget about this, as fans. It's why I love this years football team a bunch. I think we have a great bunch of kids on the team who have bought into what Tressel is preaching. They are great kids, and will turn into great men. I especially feel this way about Pryor. I've heard media talk about how Pryor made a bad decision by going to Ohio State because they aren't using him properly. I remember Pryor 2 years ago, and I see him now. And NO OTHER COACH in the country could have helped Pryor become the man he is becoming more than Tressel has. Pryor is very lucky to be at Ohio State and around coach Tressel and his staff. Pryor will be reaping the benefits of it for the rest of his life.
You know, it's possible to have a good discussion about this stuff without spouting off stupid non-sense like kevnow123 is. I was surprised when he said he worked at a pre-school. I figured he was 14 at the oldest. For acting like he knows a lot, he sure doesn't know much.
Here is something that I think a football program has a little more control over. Graduation rate. Although part of me feels like this should only count players who don't go to the NFL, because honestly, who cares if you graduate if you get drafted. I'd much rather get drafted in the NFL then get a degree from any university. Not that the degree isn't important, and not that if you have a chance you shouldn't come back and graduate, much like Eddie George did. But getting paid 6 or 7 figures can go a much longer way than a degree can if you are smart with your money. But most of the football players on any program are never going to play professional football, even the big time programs.
I really wish Ohio State had a higher graduation rate, but it has come a long way. The Big Ten does very well overall when it comes to graduation rates though, but to be fair, the ACC does even better.
Miami, FL's graduation rate through the past 4 classes was 70%, Ohio State's was 51%. This was much lower for Ohio State before Tressel came to town. And as far as Miami, their graduation rate has soared lately. It was much, much lower as little as 5 years ago, when it was at 40s.
I don't know if it means anything, but 100% of white players graduated at Miami, where as 61% of black students did. Ohio State was 72% to 41%. Again, I would like to see these stats not include those who have NFL contracts. At almost all schools, white football players graduated at a higher rate than black ones.
Also, Ohio State graduates 68% of all it's students overall. Still lower than Miami's football team currently.
Miami has done a lot to turn their football program around as far as it becoming more respectable. Arrests are down and the graduation rate is up. But the same can be said for Ohio State, too. But to try and deny the type of program they ran in the past, that's a little silly.
To argue that Miami was giving a chance to the under-privileged is kind of silly. All universities give scholarships to under-privileged students. But college isn't for everybody, nor should it be. There is a difference between giving people second chances, and just letting players do whatever they want. Miami wasn't about giving kids second chances, it was about having no rules, no discipline, and making football first, and being a student second, and learning how to grow up to be a man last.
Miami has changed in this regard. And I feel it's also something that Tressel has brought to the table. Tressel makes it known that being a student and learning how to grow up and be a good man is much more important than football. He doesn't treat his student-athletes as players...he treats them as students. Sometimes I think we forget about this, as fans. It's why I love this years football team a bunch. I think we have a great bunch of kids on the team who have bought into what Tressel is preaching. They are great kids, and will turn into great men. I especially feel this way about Pryor. I've heard media talk about how Pryor made a bad decision by going to Ohio State because they aren't using him properly. I remember Pryor 2 years ago, and I see him now. And NO OTHER COACH in the country could have helped Pryor become the man he is becoming more than Tressel has. Pryor is very lucky to be at Ohio State and around coach Tressel and his staff. Pryor will be reaping the benefits of it for the rest of his life.
You know, it's possible to have a good discussion about this stuff without spouting off stupid non-sense like kevnow123 is. I was surprised when he said he worked at a pre-school. I figured he was 14 at the oldest. For acting like he knows a lot, he sure doesn't know much.
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Apparently I was right that the counting video wouldn't help.
Bleed S & G
Taking Crazy Pills
How old are you?kevnow123;1621620; said:
And for the record, yes - Penn State should carry that label.
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kevnow123
Banned
I like your post, but there was quite a bit of "stupid nonsense" posted before I had posted. Going out and calling Miami thug u and focussing only on the negative is "stupid nonsense." Failing to recognize the wrongs that other universities might have done is "stupid nonsense." Insulting someone for volunteering at an inner-city pre-school and calling him a bitch is "stupid nonsense." Exposing the fact that other universities did their wrongs as well is not. Failing to recognize the significance of miami's rise in the 80's with everything that was going on in the south is "stupid nonsense." Failing to recognize that miami was the first major program in the south to integrate is "stupid nonsense." Failing to recognize miami getting descriminated against (catholics vs convicts, steak fry with PSU player John Bruno, and ND's other slogans) is "stupid nonsense." I am in no way trying to condone crime. I just don't like prosecuting one school, when many others are just as guilty.JXC;1621679; said:
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kevnow123;1621701; said:
Agreed. That is stupid nonsense...however, when you account the racist garbage post that started the whole thing, that context becomes a bit more clear and stated 'stupid nonsense' becomes defense against said racist garbage.
Miami in the 80s celebrated their outlaw image, attitude, and defiance...they loved to be called thugs. Now you want to chastise people for allowing them that desire?
Yup, stupid nonsense.
Game over...your bullshit is tiresome.
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