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ttun Shenanigans and Arguments (2016 official thread)

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jwinslow said:
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rain_man_phone-booth.jpg


uh oh
 
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Jaxbuck said:
ESPN’s Lee Corso: ‘Jim Harbaugh is Urban Meyer’s worst nightmare’
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I am going to temporarily abstain from talking trash till December and simply point out that if JBlo doesn't get it done this year, I think it will be impossible for him the following year. It is time for JBlo to take his "in year two we are so much better than year one" team and all of his seniors and beat tOSU when tOSU is the youngest team in the nation. No way he wins when the youngest team in America is now much more experienced and has the 2017 recruiting class. After that, the best JBlo can hope for is the best 4 out of 7.

Somehow people seem to be able to puff JBlo at 0-1, but if it gets to be 0-2, they will still puff JBlo but no one will listen to it.
 
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LostLassie said:
Yes, I do feel a little sorry for him, because...Somebody owes him some damn money. As much as that image has been used, he ought to be a millionaire by now. Just tuned in to the College Football kick-off show on Fox, and there he is in the intro video.
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He should replace Vinko Bogataj as the Agony of Defeat.
 
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So Rivals staffer Chris Balas is not high on Speight (kind of like everyone used to be, until he was suddenly the QB):
"I know what I've seen. I'll be pleasantly surprised if he is a good Big Ten quarterback"

"Nobody pushed a "narrative." That's what was said inside the walls of Schembechler Hall, from those closest to it. Bottom line, they hoped and expected O'Korn would be much further along. That's a fact. Wilton Speight completed 36 percent of his passes last year."
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Elsewhere, a prominent political analyst (Steve Deace) was incredulous that anyone would doubt Harbrau (and to be clear, he has a 99.9% stranglehold on unquestioned worship right now):
Weird to see so many folks think they know more about the quarterback situation than arguably the best quarterback coach on the planet, who's also seen every snap of training camp they didn't see.

Weird.

Weird to see folks rip the guy who came off the bench and led us to perhaps our most important win last season. If we had lost that Minnesota game, who knows how the season would've turned out.

Weird, indeed.
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but instead of unblinking group think, it actually led to some honest admissions of doubt and candid references to what they used to (and in some cases, still) think of Speight.

Also, the petty, juvenile star ratings for anything they don't like is hilarious. Approximately 10-20 angry fans downvoted all of these posts:
Agreed. But to be fair, aside from 2 passes, Speight looked every bit as bad as Bellomy against Nebraska. I don't believe that is a preview to the future or anything.
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And Speight himself has said the game was moving too fast for himself last year and has slowed down considerably. Back up QBs aren't given reps etc. fact is though...he won and he did demonstrate pocket presence.
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I wasn't impressed by WS and sorry if that's weird to you. He appeared in more than the Gopher game and most people watching felt that maybe SM should have been the back up.

However 2016 is a different year so let's hope the qb whomever that may be has a great year.
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must have missed it ... where is Speight being ripped on?



I see plenty of people saying they are rooting for O'Korn, believe he gives us the best chance to win, etc, etc. And you your point, it is hard to process the second guessing in the context of it being a second guessing of JIM HARBAUGH.



But IMO rooting for O'Korn or having an opinion that O'Korn would be better is not the same as ripping on Speight.



But maybe someone can help me out and show me where he is getting ripped on. Is it on another board, maybe? I don't see every thread here, but I tend to at least peruse most of them, and I haven't seen it.
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I think it is weird that so many people feel compelled to grossly distort the opposing argument. I can't recall a single poster saying that JH is making a mistake. There are a lot who are disappointed that JOK isn't the choice as they (incl. me) have little confidence in WS and were hoping that we could do better.
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think people were hoping Okorn would win because he adds an added dimension with his feet. Obviously, I am okay with whoever JH has step out there, but I wanted O'Korn to win the job. I don't dislike WS, I just wanted O'Korn to progress enough to pass WS, because that would mean not only would he have added to the running game, but also would have had to have improved upon his decision making. I think many just felt O'Korn has the most upside and were hoping he could pick up in the areas that WS is better, like composure and decision making.
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I don't think people are insinuating that Harbaugh made the wrong choice or that they know more than him; but I think most people would agree that outside of 1 drive, Speight hasn't shown much in game action that would illicit confidence in him being the starting QB
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I don't see people ripping Wilton. It seems like more surprise than anything, which I understand.

Stats:
O'Korn = 4000+ career yards and 34 touchdowns
Speight = 73 career yards and 1 touchdown

Recruiting:
O'Korn was "recruited" by Harbaugh to transfer in.
Speight was recruited by Hoke & Borges.

"Insider talk":
O'Korn was touted last year as being the best QB on the roster.
Speight was rumored to be looking to transfer (not necessarily from this site, but many mentioned it as a possibility)

Public talk from coaches:
O'Korn never really mentioned publicly due to redshirt
Speight showed up on the HBO special with Harbaugh yelling at him to do it his way or "f*ing go somewhere else."

Basically there was a year of setting unrealistic expectations that O'Korn was going to be the guy by a wide margin. So people clearly are a bit surprised that Wilton seems to have beat him out. I don't think that's a negative on Wilton.
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I think you are confusing things a bit, I think we all trust JH but JH can only work with what he has. I am not completely convinced this is just about Speight but it's about O'Korn not being good enough. And I think it is weird that you are simply ignoring the rest of Speight's performance that game and basing your opinion on one play that any QB on our roster could have made because it was a great play design. He was not good in that game and I am confident that prior to that play not many of us thought we were going to win because he was the QB. You don't have to believe me here is Sam's post from the sub 5:

"O'Korn is better than in the spring, but Wilton has shown better command of the offense. I don't expect him to struggle as much as Rudock did early last season, but I don't know that Wilton will rise to the level that Rudock played at by the end of last season. Time will tell on that one."

Now of course Ruddock was playing on a very high level but this isn't exactly a ringing endorsement. All I know is if he turns out to be as good as you are suggesting I will be thrilled.
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I was only referring to the fact that, outside of 2 passes, thsd Speight was brutal (my opinoo) in game action last year. That's it. Nothing more. No issue if he's the starter, he obviously has earned it if that's the case.
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A brief diversion:
Is there anything more representative that "we're back"? Michigan fans armchair fighting over who plays quarterback at quarterback U is a long time tradition at Michigan dating back to the Bo era. Heck, see John Navarre for more details ...
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met with this:
Were we back in 2013-14 when everyone argued Devin vs. Shane?
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*iceburn*
This is the same board that overwhelmingly begged for Shane Morris to play over Gardner a few years ago, sight unseen. "He can't be any worse."
crazy.gif


Despite Harbaugh being in charge now, methinks you're still asking too much of this crowd, Deace.
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If O'Korn didnt have a rep for throwing the ball to the other team I would understand the rancor. What I remember from the spring game was him holding the ball for 2 seconds and trying to run. I would prefer the guy (whoever it is) that protects the football.
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Factually speaking, O'Korn did not perform very well in the last 5 games of the 2013 season. That carried over into the 2014 season, which resulted in him being benched.
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Just to be clear, in no way, shape or form do I believe that Speight is "special". I am amazed, however, at the number of people who managed to convince themselves that O'Korn is an elite talent. He never has been and never will be (imho).


I do not believe we're primed for a playoff run this season regardless of who the starting QB is. Peters is the one elite talent we have at the QB position on the roster and he isn't ready yet.
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