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Texas 21, Alabama 37 (BCSCG) Jan 7, 2010 on ABC

jwinslow;1639223; said:
Can't help but think of what anger, bitterness & rebellion filled Gator Nation just 37 months ago... and how quickly most have switched roles and forgotten those injustices they now mockingly dismiss.
You just switched subjects. :biggrin: I was talking about the Crystal Trophy and the value of winning it. You are talking about the unfairness of the selection process and the politicization of it all as controlled by ESPiN. We agree about all of that; it is an unfair process. I'm not saying it is good - or fair - or desired. I was merely pounting out to Kyle why perception actually matters in a substantive way despite the unquestiond greater tradition of success your program has over a program like UF. Perception almost got the Skunkbears into the BCSCG as #2 before the weird dominoes started falling that produced the Big-10 media back lash. We (UF) might jump a more worthy team next year due to our current run of success as a program and conference. Given time, it will all change. Who knows, maybe some off the radar team like Colorado will emerge in the mid 2010s.
 
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I know. It's late and I'm feeling dramatic :biggrin:

It's truly amazing to me how we've come full circle... and really, it only took about 14 months, not 38, for the status quo to be in place. This has just been fortifying it.


Florida fans cried out - with just cause, albeit a bit too emotionally - about the overwhelming disrespect for their conference. Those serving up the disrespect said they should play better football if they want that respect.

B10 fans and the media didn't respect stumbling Florida's chances against high flying Ohio State, so much so that we might be better off scheduling a rematch of the defacto national championship game held in columbus.

Now we have national pundits deciding that the SECCG is going to be the BCS semifinals barring a huge implosion, and in many ways that game is more of a championship battle than the one against the weaker (in this case finesse b12) bowl opponent.



The only major difference was the B10 hyperbole was only about a 2-3 month phenomenon (compared to the foreseeable future for the SEC), and I believe it coincided with ESPN courting the B10 to be their official network. Looking back, I wonder if that was more than coincidence, or just more lazy analysis with tunnel vision for flashy offense like always.
 
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Given time, it will all change. Who knows, maybe some off the radar team like Colorado will emerge in the mid 2010s.
That's an interesting topic. I know college football is cyclical, and the SEC will eventually run into more than 1 great team every 4 NC appearances, but you have to wonder what kind of an impact ESPN will have on the future of the SEC.

Hype is what gets Auburn the speed & elite talent talk, where Wisconsin gets stuck with the hulking plowhorse label. But it doesn't take very long to peruse the interwebs and realize that the hyperbole that ESPN spews is implanted in impessionable minds. Nick Saban & Urban Meyer certainly earn their success on and off the field, even if the angry midget has his comeuppance coming one day. Most of the other programs however, especially the Auburns & Tennessees, ride the coattails of successful national powers.

I think there's a serious danger of a self-serving cycle, where unearned praise and greatness is heaped upon schools by proximity, when their only real accomplishment was being around someone else's success.

ESPN has paid a huge fortune to be the official sponsor of SEC football. It's in their best interest to make it into the greatest thing since sliced bread, even if they don't intend to distort the truth or intentionally plant seeds for those programs.


ESPN has always been prone to exaggeration, but since the modern era of football began on New Years Day 2006, we've seen a level of vitriol & television trolling that dwarfs most smack talk on message boards. It's not about the greatness of USC slaying Oklahoma in dominating fashion, or Vince Young turning in all-time great performances...

It's about how badly this team is exposed. How unworthy this conference is. How slow they are. How archaic their schemes are.

Florida was disrespected heading into the NC game, but I don't remember the whole conference being bagged on in proximity. If they had lost, it would have been proof of how great Troy Smith & Ohio State was all season long. Would it have proven how unworthy the SEC was to get that bowl berth?


There were some epic beatdowns in NC games before that, but I don't recall folks trying to find a way to keep that losing team out of the NC in successive years because of being unworthy.



We're on a very dangerous slope with Disney calling the shots. It would be that way even if Pryor leads OSU to a NC next year, as the media will jump on his bandwagon in a hurry (and the defense will still get about 5 minutes of attention tops).
 
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jwinslow;1639232; said:
That's an interesting topic. I know college football is cyclical, and the SEC will eventually run into more than 1 great team every 4 NC appearances, but you have to wonder what kind of an impact ESPN will have on the future of the SEC....

We're on a very dangerous slope with Disney calling the shots. It would be that way even if Pryor leads OSU to a NC next year (and the defense will still get about 5 minutes of attention tops).

You're right, jwins. I think that many posters here discount the effects that ESPiN has had on Ohio State and the Big Ten in the last decade. Think how we might have positioned Ohio State in the minds of consumers if we had had as much time to run advertising to build the brand image.

ESPiN is in it for the money. There is some decent commentary and analysis, very little in fact, but some. The majority of time is devoted to program designs intended to involve viewers in the type of smacktalk chatter that used to be the realm of barbershops in the 1950s. Off angle camera shots, people spouting opinions and someone clicking a bell to increase their score as if they got something right.

Give them this--they are very good at what they do. If you are a consumer behaviorist, ESPiN is a living laboratory in shaping consumer opinions and behavior.

There is a bright side. They will now begin to punt the Big Ten for a while. The world of SEC and PAC10 speed just got a lot slower. ESPiN was badly exposed as a result. They know that the pendulum has begun to swing back home.
 
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jwinslow;1639232; said:
There were some epic beatdowns in NC games before that, but I don't recall folks trying to find a way to keep that losing team out of the NC in successive years because of being unworthy.
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Fortunately, some slow plodding Midwest team beat the PAC-10 Speedy Snake to allow a disgraced Florida squad a back door chance at the '96 MNC. :paranoid: We never would have been voted into a BCSCG after the pummeling Nebraska gave us the year before, the addition of Bob Stoops or not.


jwinslow;1639232; said:
We're on a very dangerous slope with Disney calling the shots. It would be that way even if Pryor leads OSU to a NC next year, as the media will jump on his bandwagon in a hurry (and the defense will still get about 5 minutes of attention tops).

Absolutely true that the Mouse is the root of all evil, having destroyed the Florida I grew up in. I have no doubt that the SEC's deal with CBS and ESPN was not only made for the money, but for the exposure gained from more nationally televised games and the PR power of ESPiN. Some of that is due to the fanatical fanbases here, which are, in my humble opinion, more rabid than their northern or western conference counterparts. The level of rabid fan support for the Old Miss, Miss State, Arkansas, Kentucky - Hell - everyone but Vandy's of the world exceed that of the lower tier of most other conferences, who do not sell out the games or garner TV and radio following of their lower tier team like the nut jobs of the SEC. It is that support that makes it attractive to ESPN. (Yes, you have fantastic support at tOSU, but the bottom of the Big-10 is not as rabid about the sport as your average lower tier SEC nut job - IMO )

I guess I'm saying it was a deal with the devil for both sides. And I have no doubt that it will put the SEC at an unfair advantage - publicity wise. For us, it stops the ABC slobbering over the PAC-10 and USC to the exclusion of the SEC, which as a CBS product was anathema to ABC's spin machine. We were invisilbe. Now we are part of that machine, and we get a huge pot of gold every year too. Good move for us. Bad move for college football? Possibly. It further separates the have and have nots, with only the Big-10 and its great media deal keeping up. The mid majors should fall further behind as in tough times they have financial issues and the SEC and Big-10 get fat on TV contracts. Does a kid want to go to a school with awesome weight room facilities, locker rooms with built in gaming consoles for each kid, the newest Jumbotrons, indoor practice fields, etc, or to the twenty year old facility at a mid major? Life ain't fair.
 
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powerlifter;1639050; said:
Ingram had a huge impact on that game..He sit for most of the second half. I don't see very many people saying..if he would have played the entire second half it wouldn't have even been close.That's something you have to consider as well..and the what if's and might have beens mean literally nothing. I don't think anyone is asking for people to believe the SEC is a dominate conference..It's pretty much a given. Nobody has to believe that though..To each their own.Your or my opinion has no impact on a national level,and it will be what it will be.

If the Big Ten won 4 in a row,i'd be happy. It would give our conference some leverage in the polls.

Most Alabama fans would tell you that Ingram is the second best running back on the team. Richardson is a special talent.
 
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I guess I'm saying it was a deal with the devil for both sides. And I have no doubt that it will put the SEC at an unfair advantage - publicity wise. For us, it stops the ABC slobbering over the PAC-10 and USC to the exclusion of the SEC, which as a CBS product was anathema to ABC's spin machine. We were invisilbe. Now we are part of that machine, and we get a huge pot of gold every year too. Good move for us. Bad move for college football? Possibly. It further separates the have and have nots, with only the Big-10 and its great media deal keeping up. The mid majors should fall further behind as in tough times they have financial issues and the SEC and Big-10 get fat on TV contracts. Does a kid want to go to a school with awesome weight room facilities, locker rooms with built in gaming consoles for each kid, the newest Jumbotrons, indoor practice fields, etc, or to the twenty year old facility at a mid major? Life ain't fair.
So basically you're saying to go grab Texas and we'll join you in strutting? :biggrin:
 
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Alabama won the MNC. Why would that cause fans to chant "S.E.C., S.E.C, S.E.C."? Or does one drunken group start it, then the crowd / sheep / southern mentality take over and everyone else copies it? During the year, they beat three top ten teams. They earned the championship. The only knock I would have is their, and the rest of the conference's, fear of playing out of region, out of the SouthEast. You can also gripe about the final win, as Texas did not have their Heisman Candidate on the field, but a win is a win. 'Bama beat everybody put before them, and Texas was put before them by the votes of the other coaches, including Tressel.

Thinking that the best conference, for-the-year-record-wise, is the one with the MNC is wrong IMO. In recent years, while USC had their dominance going on, that did not mean the PAC10 had the best conference. Actually, the conference as a whole sucked. At least USC fans had the brainpower to refrain from chanting, "P.A.C. 10, P.A.C. 10, P.A.C. 10", or would it be, "Pac Ten, Pac Ten, Pac Ten"?

The current iteration of the SEC is the same. One bordering-on-great team, one good team, and two other top twenty five teams, then what? And those four come from a pool of twelve teams. Only two 11 win teams. Only two 10 win teams (same two.)
Alabama: three wins against top ten teams (though they had to play an extra "championship" game to do it), their regular season opponents had a total of 82 wins, and of course, that pesky MNC.
Florida: one win against top ten teams, of course their only loss was to the eventual MNC winner. Or it could be said that their only loss was to a top ten team.

Compare that to the Big10. One really good team, two good teams, along with another top twenty five team. And that from a pool of only eleven teams. The only conference with three 11 win teams. The only conference with four 10 win teams.
Ohio State: three wins against top ten teams, they had wins against five (count'em, five) teams with ten or more victories (and the B10 is smart enough to know who the champion is without another game), and their regular season opponents had a total of 82 wins. And, unlike Florida, it could be said that they never lost to a top ten team.

Could this year's Florida team survive a full season playing in the B10, going against four ten win teams? Evidence shows they lost half their games against ten win teams. Could Alabama have survived a full season in the B10? Possibly, but it would be in a little more doubt.
In heads-to-head bowl games, it was one win per conference. In each game, the SEC was the odds on favorite. The B10 won one outright, then took the other into overtime before losing. That while being in an eleven team conference vs a twelve team conference.

Which conference is the best? Well, one has the MNC team in its ranks, the other has everything else. I'm voting for the everything else.
 
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powerlifter;1639090; said:
To really confuse you....I'd say Ingram had a better year then Mccoy(best offensive player in the game).

If Ingram had sat out the entire season Richardson would have put up similar numbers. Alabama's running game isn't really, really good because of Ingram it's really, really good because of that offensive line.

Ingram is a very good back...but he's not the second coming of Adrian Peterson.

Edit: Damnit...I really should start reading the entire thread before replying...
Bill Lucas;1639311; said:
Most Alabama fans would tell you that Ingram is the second best running back on the team. Richardson is a special talent.


Gatorubet;1639307; said:
Absolutely true that the Mouse is the root of all evil, having destroyed the Florida I grew up in.

[IMGL]http://www.cinemademerde.com/gator-burt.gif[/IMGL]
Watch out boys old smokey's in the Okefenokee
The sheriff's out there snoopin' around
So shut that business down
And let's disappear
Look out boys old smokey's in the Okefenokee
But that sheriff he's really gonna catch the devil
If he keeps on snoopin' around in here
 
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Muck;1639966; said:
If Ingram had sat out the entire season Richardson would have put up similar numbers. Alabama's running game isn't really, really good because of Ingram it's really, really good because of that offensive line.

Ingram is an excellent back...but he's not the second coming of Adrian Peterson.

You won't see me make comparisons to AD. I don't even care to hear comparisons of high school players being the next "Jerry Rice" etc etc..I believe the comparison they kept referring to was "Emmitt Smith"..Same concept.

Obviously,the bama rushing game is a combined effort.Two 100 yard + running backs in a national title game doesn't happen,if it isn't.It's not like Texas defense is a total joke. Ingram is a heisman winner/national title winner as a sophmore..That's a big time accomplishment,but the rest of the offense (and lack of) has an impact.

EDIT
I see in your edit you downgraded him from an excellent to a very good back lol
 
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