Program in turmoil (maybe not)

[colobuck79]

Boy, who wouldn't love the job of "ball screen situation counter?"

And since it also involves watching all the Duke games, make mine a bazooka.

 

[calibuck]

Part of the interview/interviewee thing. I see that kids like Mickey saw what they wanted on their visit(s), and said I can fit in here (same for AJ and Giddens). Well, this year team developed a quite different personality than last year's team, and so the offense changed (kids don't go to a school for it's defense). Basic skill set, plus set offense equals outcome. Or not. Grandstaff was told he'd be better than Jon Diebler. Well, Diebler had the penetrators who would push the ball down and kick back to him for a shot after the defense collapsed. Not so with this offense, the equivalent of a 'weave' (if any of you are long enough in tooth to remember that), and maybe one of the O guys are closer to the basket than Grandstaff was, which in turn brings out the D man tighter. After last few years of less than stellar bigs, tOSU went away from a 'get it down low' mentality, so Giddens rightfully got pretty tired of setting picks. Did anyone see him on the court for his HS team? Did he play differently there than here? Heck his HS team would give tOSU a pretty good battle. Keep Matta, we won't do much better, methinks. Upgrade the assistants, and work on fundamentals. I'll quit now, anything more will sound like (or be) a complaint session. Go Bucks

 

[DZ83CK]

I love the idea that's been thrown around in here that Oklahoma is some sort of MBB powerhouse. They're in the FF this year because they have one incredible player and some nice complimentary pieces. After this season is over and Hield is gone, they're likely to be on the same track on which Ohio State is riding.

Hell, they're probably going to lose out on an elite 2017 recruit, who plays his high school ball in freaking Norman, to Kentucky.

Would I trade Thad Matta for Lon Kruger strictly as a coach (ignoring the issue of how many years they have left)? Yes, after the last few years there's no doubt. Kruger didn't build that program on recruiting stars, he found players who were underrated and built a good team out of them. Kruger doesn't have to beat the blue bloods for recruits because he knows what he's doing in evaluating talent. The current staff at OSU, I'm not sure they really do. OSU does well when they get stars, clearly they try to build their offense around elite scorers, but they do not do a good job of identifying prospects they can develop, and they have very average players right now so their style is not going to work very well.

 

[DZ83CK]

College basketball is a hot mess!
Too many recruit managers and greedy family members looking for a brown bag gift.
Too many entitled kids.

Funny how Wisconsin and MSU make the tourney every year and are more consistent, with all the same potential problems. You need to get kids who fit in the culture of a winning program, who have some appreciation for college basketball & being a part of a team. Too many blanks in the good teammate column for OSU lately.

 

[DZ83CK]

Diddy isn't down with Thad's "The right guys stayed" comment.

Did Giddens, Harris, Mitchell have too much energy, grit, too high a motor, too invested in S&C, too much fast twitch, need to act more like Loving?

Something is rotten in Denmark.

From a pure production standpoint the losses were not great but when it wipes out 80% of the class and 3 of them were the kids who competed the hardest and the other landed at a school in the Final 4 - then it smells like lawn sausage.

Loving leaving would be good for most programs out there. Unfortunately, he's one of about 2 players on this team that can score on a relatively consistent basis. Which points out two big flaws in the program right now, having players who often aren't giving their best effort and not having enough scoring ability offensively. Defensively they are also lacking significantly right now.

Lyle also is a talented player whose commitment to playing team basketball is questionable.

I don't think Grandstaff going to OU means anything. Just because he transferred there doesn't mean he's going to play a big role for them. Every team can use shooters.

 

[DZ83CK]

Put me in the camp that is mildly concerned but not much more. There's definitely a downward trajectory over the last 4 years, but that stuff happens -- especially in basketball where one or two recruits can mean that much. A couple misses here and there can make a HUGE difference. They've been on a bit of a rough stretch with recruiting (outside of Russell) -- guys haven't turned out to be what was projected. Is that a problem? Yes....is it a recruiting problem a development problem or just a bit of luck problem? I don't know.

That being said....they won 21 games this year. I remember the mid-late 90's....what did they win in Obie's first year...8 games? 8 fucking games? Hell, they won a total of 36 games over that season and the preceding 3. Only 13 conference wins in 4 years....and then they vacated two of those conference wins later. [Mark May], we're nowhere NEAR the low point in the program. Hell, this was still better than Obie's last couple years....and we didn't even end up on probation!

Wow, you managed to weave all 3 of O'Brien's non-tourney years (out of the 7 he coached at OSU) into the same argument. Reading your post, you'd think he had no successful years instead of mostly successful seasons, and that "crap" is the default status of OSU basketball instead of being rated among the top-10 in college basketball over the first 72 years of the program. Congrats!

 

[DZ83CK]

Pretty interesting read in the Dispatch on the whole situation, including this quote from Thad:



http://buckeyextra.dispatch.com/content/stories/2016/03/31/331-matta-team-relationships.html

So they had better be ready to replace them with better players then, right???

 

[Fungo Squiggly]

Wow, you managed to weave all 3 of O'Brien's non-tourney years (out of the 7 he coached at OSU) into the same argument. Reading your post, you'd think he had no successful years instead of mostly successful seasons, and that "crap" is the default status of OSU basketball instead of being rated among the top-10 in college basketball over the first 72 years of the program. Congrats!

Thanks? My point was never about what the "average" OSU team should be or what a fair expectation should be -- it was about comparing this year's "bad" team to some of the other "bad" OSU teams of the last 20 years. If we are talking about Thad's worst years, shouldn't we be comparing it to Ayers's & Obie's worst years, too?

Give me two more years like this year and my mild concern will become serious concern, but Thad has definitely earned some leeway with me. That's all I'm saying.

 

[NorthCoastKid]

He's baaaaaaaack

 

[MaxBuck]

Lyle also is a talented player whose commitment to playing team basketball is questionable.

Personally, I have little doubt that Lyle is completely committed to playing team basketball. Why do you doubt it?

 

[MaxBuck]

He's baaaaaaaack

Thinking Jent might be aiming toward being the Buckeye head coach in a couple years.

 

[DZ83CK]

Its really a red herring to compare Matta's underwhelming teams to some of the worst seasons in OSU basketball history. Historically speaking, the past couple seasons have been very average for OSU. If you want to look at how long you can be average before you get fired, look at Eldon Miller. You could justify your support for Matta very easily by citing his career achievements and ranks at OSU instead of harping on years that everyone agrees were unsatisfactory ones at OSU.

Thanks? My point was never about what the "average" OSU team should be or what a fair expectation should be -- it was about comparing this year's "bad" team to some of the other "bad" OSU teams of the
last 20 years. If we are talking about Thad's worst years, shouldn't we be comparing it to Ayers's & Obie's worst years, too?

Give me two more years like this year and my mild concern will become serious concern, but Thad has definitely earned some leeway with me. That's all I'm saying.

 

[OSU_Buckguy]

is this the poster who said that aaron craft should just be satisfied to wear the buckeye uniform? the one who thought he was more suited to be a combo (shooting) guard?

the opinions of such recorded ignorance i do not regard at all.

 

[Fungo Squiggly]

Its really a red herring to compare Matta's underwhelming teams to some of the worst seasons in OSU basketball history. Historically speaking, the past couple seasons have been very average for OSU. If you want to look at how long you can be average before you get fired, look at Eldon Miller. You could justify your support for Matta very easily by citing his career achievements and ranks at OSU instead of harping on years that everyone agrees were unsatisfactory ones at OSU.

Did you read the post right before my original one where the poster stated:

Count me in the camp that feels like we are at or near a low point in the program

That is what I was responding to. This is nowhere near the low point of the program.

 

[OSU_Buckguy]

Would I trade Thad Matta for Lon Kruger strictly as a coach (ignoring the issue of how many years they have left)? Yes, after the last few years there's no doubt. Kruger didn't build that program on recruiting stars, he found players who were underrated and built a good team out of them. Kruger doesn't have to beat the blue bloods for recruits because he knows what he's doing in evaluating talent. The current staff at OSU, I'm not sure they really do. OSU does well when they get stars, clearly they try to build their offense around elite scorers, but they do not do a good job of identifying prospects they can develop, and they have very average players right now so their style is not going to work very well.

I resume my pen, in reply to the curious epistle you have been pleased to favor me with, and can assure you ... it has been the source of abundant merriment to me. The spirit that breathes throughout is so rancorous, illiberal, and imperious; the argumentative part of it is so puerile and fallacious; the misrepresentation of facts so palpable and flagrant; the criticisms so illiterate, trifling, and absurd; the conceits so low, sterile, and splenetic, that I will venture to pronounce it one of the most ludicrous performances which has been exhibited to public view during all the present controversy.