It's spin if the other 51 words mean nothing. If you were told one of your employees was reportedly raping a boy in the workplace showers, would you care about other "co-workers" weekend plans?
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- Thread starter mercer_buckeye
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It's spin if the other 51 words mean nothing. If you were told one of your employees was reportedly raping a boy in the workplace showers, would you care about other "co-workers" weekend plans?
409fold
All-American
A couple anecdotes:
(1) There have been many times in my career where I've had to "quickly pass forward" news as regards one of my direct reports. He's leaving the job to work for a competitor, he screwed something up and has created a massive "brush fire" that our organization needs to put out, her father tragically and unexpectedly died and she's going to need substantial time off for the funeral. Sometimes my boss is readily available, sometimes he is not. Sometimes he's on airplanes or off fly-fishing in Colorado or at some professional conference in NYC. Sometimes I don't get to discuss 1-on-1 with my boss for a full 24 hours and all our communication on the subject in the meantime is via e-mail.
For all we know, Tim Curley was similarly unavailable for a 1-1 discussion. I don't know. One thing we do know is that Paterno got in touch with Curley at some point over the next 24-36 hours, given that Curley and Paterno did have a discussion as regards Sandusky on that same weekend. That Curley/Paterno meeting on 11-February-2001 is a fact, as testified to in the Freeh Report.
(2) In 2007, I was unfortunately driving a car that was hit by a drunk driver. The drunk driver died, and all the passengers in my car died as well --- except one (obviously, that person is me).
That is, by far, THE most traumatic experience of my life. This accident happened in Northwest Lower Michigan.
I still drive by that intersection a couple times every year. This past May, someone was with me, I pointed to the intersection where the accident happened. Thing is, I got the intersection wrong. Missed it by a mile. Sometimes memories fade even for VERY memorable events. As the years go by, you get stuff wrong even if you don't mean it. Paterno misspoke on the weekend thing, yes. He misspoke when giving testimony 9 1/2 years later. That's a long time.
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As I said earlier in this thread, there is plenty of stuff to blame Paterno for. The weekend thing, however? That's not on MY list. Fair enough if it is on your list.
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The spin is in acting like the fact he may have reported it on Sunday somehow negates the outrageous comment Paterno made (and he did make it) of not wanting to ruin anyones weekend.
Who in the hell even thinks of such a thing at a time like that? So he may have actually spoken to someone during the weekend. Maybe he did and maybe he didn't but the sick old bastard did indeed think first of not ruining a weekend, not about the poor kid.
As far as buying the notion that Joe paterno couldn't get anyone at PSU on the phone anytime he wanted to, well lets just say I find that harder to believe than the idea Paterno knew absolutely nothing about Sanduskys atrocities going all the way back.
Who in the hell even thinks of such a thing at a time like that? So he may have actually spoken to someone during the weekend. Maybe he did and maybe he didn't but the sick old bastard did indeed think first of not ruining a weekend, not about the poor kid.
As far as buying the notion that Joe paterno couldn't get anyone at PSU on the phone anytime he wanted to, well lets just say I find that harder to believe than the idea Paterno knew absolutely nothing about Sanduskys atrocities going all the way back.
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Buckeye86
I do not choose to discuss it
I'm curious to see the excuses as to why Paterno never followed up on his initial "all that he was legally required to do" report to his superiors during the following decade when Sandusky continued to bring kids into the locker room and onto road trips.
Just once you'd think the thought would have crossed someone's mind to follow up on that initial report, given its incredibly serious nature and all, when Sandusky continued to run around with boys.
It's almost unfathomable that no one did, actually.
That is, unless you accept the incredibly obvious truth that Paterno orchestrated a cover up and mandated no further action or questions on the matter.
Just once you'd think the thought would have crossed someone's mind to follow up on that initial report, given its incredibly serious nature and all, when Sandusky continued to run around with boys.
It's almost unfathomable that no one did, actually.
That is, unless you accept the incredibly obvious truth that Paterno orchestrated a cover up and mandated no further action or questions on the matter.
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409fold
All-American
As referenced in pages 66-68 of the Freeh Report, a meeting occurred on Sunday 11-February-2001. Unless one is saying that the Freeh Report got that wrong, there IS NO "maybe he did and maybe he didn't."
Maybe Tim Curley went on some Saturday excursion where he did not have his phone (remember, this was 2001, cell phones were not ubiquitous). Maybe he was stuck as some painful get together with his wife's family. Maybe he was traveling with some Penn State athletic team. Maybe he was just sitting at home all day reading a book. I don't know. But I DO think it's possible that "Joe Paterno couldn't get (Curley) on the phone anytime he wanted to."
There are certainly situations in my professional life where I would NOT tell my boss truly horrible news (e.g., our biggest client is dropping us) over a weekend. E.g., if it was the weekend his daughter was getting married, or if he was at his father's funeral. Fair enough if you think I'm an idiot, but I simply don't see the comment as truly "outrageous."
IMO, Paterno should have advised McQueary on that Saturday morning to go to law enforcement ASAP. Paterno should have offered to go to law enforcement w/ McQueary if necessary. It was a miss for Paterno not to do these things. McQueary was the direct witness to the event and he needed to let law enforcement know what he saw as soon as possible.
But as regards Paterno informing Curley/Schultz --- whether that informing occurred on Saturday, Sunday or Monday --- I don't view the timing there as quite as critical. Neither of Curley/Schultz are/were law enforcement. They're bureaucrats.
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409fold
All-American
That was a huge moral failure on Paterno's part. No doubt about it. You have to follow up, and go to law enforcement if/when Curley/Schultz/Spanier don't have the moral fiber to go to law enforcement themselves.
No idea why he didn't. Even if it took several years for Paterno to do so. That time frame would have been later than ideal, but it's NEVER too late to do the right thing.
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If you don't find a 1-2-3 whatever day delay in reporting child rape more than a little disturbing you are no better than him.
In regards to the original point, it still stands. You acted flabergasted as to why anyone would still use the "ruin a weekend" thing. They use it because those were the words Paterno himself used.
It's not rocket science.
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409fold
All-American
Fair enough, I'm a crappy and lousy and bad and awful person.
These points remain:
(1) Neither you or I can know for certain whether Curley even WAS available on Saturday 10-Feburary-2001. There are perhaps 100% legitimate reasons for a 1-day delay. We do not know for certain because (a) Paterno is currently dead and cannot talk on the issue, and (b) Curley is not going to speak of these things prior to his trial.
(2) A meeting between Curley and Paterno occurred on Sunday 11-February-2001. (or perhaps you don't concede this point?)
(3) The "interfere with their weekend" quote did not occur in 2001. It occurred nine and one half years AFTER the February 2001 weekend where (if one concedes that point number 2 is correct) "interference" did occur.
(4) This is a rather weak point, but I feel it is worth mentioning. Curley/Schultz/Spanier (reference exhibit 5E in the Freeh Report) did not formulate and finalize a plan as regards reporting Sandusky until Sunday 25-February-2001. If one is to harp on a ONE day delay as regards Paterno, one should also harp on a delay by these guys that was FOURTEEN times longer. In the long run, whether the Paterno/Curley meeting occurred on Saturday the 10th, Sunday the 11th, or Monday the 12th, I doubt the timeline amongst Curley/Schultz/Spanier gets accelerated/delayed much at all.
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Ped State needs to be wiped from the face of the Earth. Their inhuman scumbag fans eliminated and their records entirely expunged from the books.
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If you don't think the delay in reporting child rape was bad then you aren't a crappy person, you are as sick, demented and twisted as the pedophile or the pedophile enabling coach. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if you are one of the guys over at BWI talking about your adventures with kids and how Jerry never got a fair trial.
These points remain because you insist on bringing the BWI schtick over here and no one is buying it.
You wondered aloud why anyone would still dare utter the phrase of "ruining someones weekend". It's quite simple to any non cult member, because Paterno said it.
It doesn't matter if you know pages of the Freeh report by heart, you can capitalize and bold your little heart out, you can retype the BWI dogma until your fingers cramp up you are making a slippery slope argument that Paterno reported it on a Sunday so therefore the "ruined weekend" narrative is false. This of course is the same as arguing no one should remember Allen Iverson's "practice?" rant because Iverson did actually attend practices during his playing career.
Anyway, probably the last I am going to comment on this one. I don't think your stay is going to last much longer if you just keep going the big lie path over here anyway.
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Joe Pa Thetic
Heisman
Wow, what serendipity that you mentioned Allen Iverson. I just finished reading Kent Babb's excellent new biography on Iverson this past weekend (thankfully, low-ranking employees don't ruin my weekends with trivial shit). Babb's book really paints an ugly picture of Iverson and his problem with alcohol. Iverson burned through $150 million in his career and still drinks Coronas at T.G.I. Fridays and P.F. Changs because that is "exotic" beer to him.
http://www.amazon.com/Not-Game-Incredible-Unthinkable-Iverson/dp/1476737657/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1438312451&sr=1-1&keywords=allen iverson
One of my favorite hobbies is playing low-level poker, so I have spent lots of time in Atlantic City playing poker. On different trips to Atlantic City several years ago, I heard all kinds of stories about what a drunken, abusive a-hole Iverson could be when gambling in Atlantic City. One poker dealer told a youngish kid at our table wearing an Iverson jersey that you have not lived until you have been called a ****sucker by Allen Iverson for dealing yourself a blackjack against Iverson.
Atlantic City was where I first heard that the genesis for the practice rant was that Iverson was an alcoholic who would keep vampire hours and frequently drink to excess in A.C. until 7-8 a.m., then be unable to make practice a few hours later. The Babb book has a huge chapter on the "practice" news conference, and that Iverson was drunk during the rant. It blows my mind that a guy could miss 70 practices in one year. The excuses became so laughable that Larry Brown kept a running tally in his office for how many times each member of Iverson's family was sick or how often Iverson would have car troubles and be unable to attend practice. At the end, Brown got to the point where he was indfferent to whether Iverson came to practice or not because he was such a colossal pain in the ass when he would show up at practice too hung over to do anything or still drunk from the night before.
The Babb book talks about 76ers general manager Billy King standing off-camera a few feet from Iverson during the practice rant and contemplating whether or not he should just walk in front of the cameras and end the press conference. Former 76er team President Pat Croce, who was instrumental in the team drafting Iverson, was watching the press conference at home and turned the channel once he realized Iverson was drunk and ranting.
One of the other stories I heard several times while playing in Atlantic City was that Iverson's mother was living in a suite at the Borgata, while Iverson had a six-figure debt to the casino for gambling losses. When he repeatedly refused to pay down the debt, the hotel moved to evict his mother from the hotel. She refused to leave and the New Jersey State Police had to be called in to forcibly evict her. That story did not make Babb's book, but it certainly seems believable considering there are dozens of similar/near identical stories about Iverson in Babb's book.
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BUCKYLE
Washed
I was a 22 year old construction worker. I had one. I'm sure the president of a B10 university didn't.Yes, TRULY HORRIBLE news like financial stuff. I lost my wallet once with an entire paycheck in it. I'm basically a rape survivor.
A miss. A faux paux. Like the time I watched my neighbor's house burn down while their preteen children had friends staying over and they all died. Boy did I have egg on my face. RIP to the victims...or whatever you want to call them.
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