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Penn State Cult (Joe Knew)

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NFBuck said:
"It's normal for fathers to shower with their kids."
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The key word there - and it's a big one - "fathers". Sandusky was not the father of any of the boys he abused and therefore, should not have been showering with them. It's one thing for a parent to shower with young children - maybe 3-4 years of age. It's quite another to be doing it with adolescent-aged kids like Sandusky was.

This has been my argument from the start. I cannot believe everyone on the Cult side of things is accepting this showering thing as ok. Anyone with half a living brain cell can see the showering for what it was - a thinly-veiled excuse for a pedophile to get a young boy naked. That's it. Nothing more. Their defending it might be the most pathetic part of this whole discussion.

Apparently, this sort of thing has been happening for years and is widely accepted at PedState. It really makes me wonder what other sort of behavior is accepted as "normal" over there........

ORD_Buckeye said:
The cult only acknowledges that McQueary came to him with a vague story that "something" might have been going on and properly reported that to his superiors. Most of them fight the notion that McQueary explicitly said rape or even "sexual nature."
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Yeah, I hear ya. Honestly though, I don't give a fuck what verbiage McQueary used to describe the incident. At the very least, Joe knew that Sandusky was doing something inappropriate with children in the PedState coaches locker room. That much he knew. If after meeting with McQueary, he didn't know precisely what McQueary had seen, he could have asked for more details. He didn't. He dismissed McQueary and said he'd take care of it. He didn't want to make himself an accessory to the crime. From there, he just passed the bag of shit on to his superiors (all of whom he played a role in selecting) and then buried his head in the sand. He chose not to follow up with Sandusky himself, or take it upon himself to put a stop to it.

This is Joesus' everlasting legacy.
 
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ORD_Buckeye said:
Don't underestimate JayPed and ScottPed throwing a nasty nuisance suit your way if you printed Paterno's name on the shirt. Hell, they wen't to YouTube and had my Saga of Jay Paterno parody video banned and removed.
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They really do seem to have taken the Advanced Scientology Seminar on Suppression of Free Speech Through Intimidation by Litigation course and passed with flying colors.

At one point early on, I might have viewed his family in the light of being collateral damage from their patriarch's corruption. Not any more.
If they had any integrity, they would be too ashamed to show their face in public. Clearly, the apple/tree adage is confirmed here.

Had Chinese carry-out for dinner last night, and was struck by the relevance of the statement in the fortune cookie:

Moderation in temper is always a virtue, but moderation in principle is always a vice.

Guess they've even heard of PedState in China now.
 
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AJHawkfan said:
The key word there - and it's a big one - "fathers". Sandusky was not the father of any of the boys he abused and therefore, should not have been showering with them. It's one thing for a parent to shower with young children - maybe 3-4 years of age. It's quite another to be doing it with adolescent-aged kids like Sandusky was.

This has been my argument from the start. I cannot believe everyone on the Cult side of things is accepting this showering thing as ok. Anyone with half a living brain cell can see the showering for what it was - a thinly-veiled excuse for a pedophile to get a young boy naked. That's it. Nothing more. Their defending it might be the most pathetic part of this whole discussion.

Apparently, this sort of thing has been happening for years and is widely accepted at PedState. It really makes me wonder what other sort of behavior is accepted as "normal" over there........



Yeah, I hear ya. Honestly though, I don't give a fuck what verbiage McQueary used to describe the incident. At the very least, Joe knew that Sandusky was doing something inappropriate with children in the PedState coaches locker room. That much he knew. If after meeting with McQueary, he didn't know precisely what McQueary had seen, he could have asked for more details. He didn't. He dismissed McQueary and said he'd take care of it. He didn't want to make himself an accessory to the crime. From there, he just passed the bag of [Mark May] on to his superiors (all of whom he played a role in selecting) and then buried his head in the sand. He chose not to follow up with Sandusky himself, or take it upon himself to put a stop to it.

This is JoePA's everlasting legacy.
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Who is JoePA? I know of a JoePed, a Joesus (blessed be his name and praise be upon him) and a Dearest Leader Pa Joe Il from whom all thought and wisdom flow. Never heard of this JoePa character.
 
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kujirakira said:
It's not like McQuery was the first incident either. That was actually the second time it came up.
McQuery went into Joe's office w/o future prospects for a job; he left with a job.
It was the second time they covered it up.
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Was specifically told there was no job for him when he first called. Gee, I wonder what happened after that.

Remember as the Paterno Family and the cult tried to destroy the ginger in order to justify JoePed's actions that the ginger was no saint, merely a somewhat less evil player in the whole thing.
 
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AJHawkfan said:
Yeah, I hear ya. Honestly though, I don't give a fuck what verbiage McQueary used to describe the incident. At the very least, Joe knew that Sandusky was doing something inappropriate with children in the PedState coaches locker room. That much he knew. If after meeting with McQueary, he didn't know precisely what McQueary had seen, he could have asked for more details. He didn't. He dismissed McQueary and said he'd take care of it. He didn't want to make himself an accessory to the crime. From there, he just passed the bag of [Mark May] on to his superiors (all of whom he played a role in selecting) and then buried his head in the sand. He chose not to follow up with Sandusky himself, or take it upon himself to put a stop to it.

This is Joesus' everlasting legacy.
Click to expand...

Let's not forget the fact that this was the second time he knew about something going on between Jerry and a kid. He lied about knowledge of 1998. Emails proved he was following the 1998 incident and wanted timely updates. Then after the second incident he is sought out by Curley and Spanier to get his holy opinion on how to proceed. This is the clear LOIC moment that everyone, who argues that this was criminal of nature and nothing else, loses sight of. The cult argues that Joesus was just a coach and following chain of command on one hand and then ignores that fact that his "supervisors" sought out what they should do with his ex-defensive coordinator who was suspected of being a pedophile.
 
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Delaware Buck said:
Let's not forget the fact that this was the second time he knew about something going on between Jerry and a kid. He lied about knowledge of 1998. Emails proved he was following the 1998 incident and wanted timely updates. Then after the second incident he is sought out by Curley and Spanier to get his holy opinion on how to proceed. This is the clear LOIC moment that everyone, who argues that this was criminal of nature and nothing else, loses sight of. The cult argues that Joesus was just a coach and following chain of command on one hand and then ignores that fact that his "supervisors" sought out what they should do with his ex-defensive coordinator who was suspected of being a pedophile.
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Remember the e-mail when Spanier is desperately trying to find some cushy academic position for some loyal assistant coach that JoePed is retiring, and they ask if he is qualified to be Dean of the School of Science (not sure of specific name), and it turned out the guy had nothing beyond a bachelor's in physical education. The athletic department had no compliance department and self-exempted itself from Clery Act reporting and training. Throwing the university President out of his house because Spanier merely wanted to discuss a time line for retirement and succession. Vickey Fucking Triponey! The LOIC went so much deeper than merely the Sandusky affair.
 
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Regarding Mike McQueary's reaction that night, I'd had suspicions all along about the cause of his emotional paralysis. So, it wasn't very surprising when this story surfaced:

http://espn.go.com/college-football...tant-said-was-sexual-abuse-victim-sources-say

Mike McQueary confided to a dozen Nittany Lions players that he could relate to the helplessness of the young boy he had seen with Sandusky in a campus shower a decade earlier because he was abused as a boy, according to two players who attended the meeting and four others with knowledge of it. McQueary did not tell the players who had abused him or when or how long the abuse had occurred, the sources said.
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I recalled reading that he and his family had known Sandusky since Mike was a kid. I'd wondered if he, too, was one of "Jerry's kids".
But, whether he was the victim of Sandusky or some other pedophile (or both, because that happens, too), it is a very plausible explanation for what has been incomprehensible to many: his failure to act in defense of a child. Walking in on that situation would have been an enormous trigger that would effectively have snapped McQueary back emotionally to whatever age he was when he was abused. I'm not trying to make the guy a hero, but if the story is true, the way the brain wires its response to abuse isn't really a conscious decision by anyone. In that moment, to ask McQueary to intervene would be like asking a terrified eight-year-old why he didn't do something to help. Unless you've been there yourself, and had the fun of working through the slimy residue of abuse, it's tricky to try to judge how much control someone else should have been able to exert over their own unresolved trauma.
 
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Would it be a stretch to think that his past history with Jerry is what got him his job in the first place, and was told to never get involved with anything dealing with Jerry and to only bring it to joeGOD if something new happened.

From Ohio State getting rid of two coaches in my life time, to Michigan getting rid of a head coach for what I understand as being a loud rude drunk one night, to Bob Knight being let go by IU for his actions.... no school has ever gone to this level of crazy that I can think of.
 
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LostLassie said:
Regarding Mike McQueary's reaction that night, I'd had suspicions all along about the cause of his emotional paralysis. So, it wasn't very surprising when this story surfaced:

http://espn.go.com/college-football...tant-said-was-sexual-abuse-victim-sources-say



I recalled reading that he and his family had known Sandusky since Mike was a kid. I'd wondered if he, too, was one of "Jerry's kids".
But, whether he was the victim of Sandusky or some other pedophile (or both, because that happens, too), it is a very plausible explanation for what has been incomprehensible to many: his failure to act in defense of a child. Walking in on that situation would have been an enormous trigger that would effectively have snapped McQueary back emotionally to whatever age he was when he was abused. I'm not trying to make the guy a hero, but if the story is true, the way the brain wires its response to abuse isn't really a conscious decision by anyone. In that moment, to ask McQueary to intervene would be like asking a terrified eight-year-old why he didn't do something to help. Unless you've been there yourself, and had the fun of working through the slimy residue of abuse, it's tricky to try to judge how much control someone else should have been able to exert over their own unresolved trauma.
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I have a hard time buying all that given that the documented conversation on record started with JoePa telling him he doesn't have a job at Penn State.
At the end of the conversation he's managed to change JoePa's mind and been offered a permanent position on the staff - and kept it until the investigation uncovered his discussion with Paterno.
If he was traumatized... why decide to be employed there? Why decide to put himself in a position where he knew he'd be in contact with Sandusky on a regular basis? Why decide to work somewhere you knowingly knew was continuing to enable a pedophile?

The other problem with this is that Sandusky had already been "investigated" a couple years prior to McQueary's confrontation, and that had been swept under the carpet. Paterno, the AD, etc. knew at least that early. It's not unthinkable that a lot more people knew - especially people in the football program (McQueary was a player and GA.) This was the 2nd time somebody was telling them about Sandusky molesting a child in their facilities. And the end of the exchange involves a job offer to the would-be whistle blower? Hmmm.
 
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