OHSportsFan
Fan of Ohio Sports in Indy
Just wait until we find out Arthur’s thoughts on tempo.
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After taking a day to let my frustration with the hire subside, I started looking into Smith's personnel when he was with the Titans, Falcons and Steelers. I'm also a Steelers fan(Here we Go), so I didn't exactly get the warm and fuzzies when Smith was announced as the HC. But then, after doing a little bit of research, you can easily see that he has had some of the worst collection of talent any coach can have.
Feel free to bash for being a "homer" or wearing "scarlet colored glasses", but I went from not liking the hire, to being very intrigued. Smith has been the OC to the following QBs: Ryan Tannehill, Desmond Ridder and (WELL past his prime)Aaron Rodgers. Not exactly a talented bunch, so then he had to lean on the run game, when he had Derrick Henry. Then had Corradelle Patterson, Tyler Algiers, Bijan Robinson, Najee Harris, Jaylen Warren and Kenneth Gainwell at RB. He gets knocked for not utilizing a rookie Bijan Robinson enough. That is a fair assessment, but when your RB is a rookie and your starting QB is a 2nd year below average player, you kind of need to rely on more than 1 RB to see any type of success. Which he split carries between Robinson and Algiers. He utilized the same gameplan in Pittsburgh this last season, when it was apparent that Rodgers was limited in his mobility and arm strength(similar to Ridder). As well as having a suspect OL in Ten and Pitt, using a RBBC approach was going to be the best option.
He prefers to use 1 primary WR, and then the #2 WR and TE then become the next receiving weapons, but depending on the personnel, a RB could move into a top 3 role. I don't see that happening at OSU with all of the WR and TE talent, but Smith likes using his RBs in the passing game, A LOT! So get used to see screens, wheel routes and slants to Bo, Ja'Kobi, Isaiah and company.
And the funny thing is, if you look at the offenses of the top 4 teams this weekend in the championship games, ALL of their offenses mimic this. But difference is, they all have better talent than anything Smith ever had. The 2nd leading receiver for NE is TE, Hunter Henry. Treveyon was eased into a starting role at RB, similar what Smith did with Bijan, but the OL were quite different, which led to more success for Henderson. McDaniel was also a failed HC who came back to being an OC, and now has Vrabel in the SB in only his 2nd year as HC. The Broncos didn't have a 1000yd rusher due to JK getting injured, but Harvey filled in and has almost 900yds from scrimmage after seeing JK start the first 10gms.
So to sum it up, expect more of a pro style/NFL offense. There will be a dominant WR1(Smith), a reliable WR2(tbd), a versatile TE(tbd) and a RB who can run and catch(Jackson). Gone are the days of 5 wide, air raid, pass happy offenses that were once so popular in college. Day wants to run an NFL style team, not just on defense, but on offense. And some of the ways that Hartline ran the heavy looks, didn't show the same type of creativity that he's hoping Smith does. Smith has studied under Shanahan, McVey and LeFleur, but has never had the talent that they have had. Well now he will, and similar to Patricia who didn't really have a defense/team with talent for what he wanted to run in Detroit or Philly, along with not getting the serious NFL looks like he wanted, it could be good for both parties.
And if I'm wrong on all of this, PLEASE quote this and laugh in my proverbial face
Feel free to bash for being a "homer" or wearing "scarlet colored glasses", but I went from not liking the hire, to being very intrigued. Smith has been the OC to the following QBs: Ryan Tannehill, Desmond Ridder and (WELL past his prime)Aaron Rodgers. Not exactly a talented bunch, so then he had to lean on the run game, when he had Derrick Henry. Then had Corradelle Patterson, Tyler Algiers, Bijan Robinson, Najee Harris, Jaylen Warren and Kenneth Gainwell at RB. He gets knocked for not utilizing a rookie Bijan Robinson enough. That is a fair assessment, but when your RB is a rookie and your starting QB is a 2nd year below average player, you kind of need to rely on more than 1 RB to see any type of success. Which he split carries between Robinson and Algiers. He utilized the same gameplan in Pittsburgh this last season, when it was apparent that Rodgers was limited in his mobility and arm strength(similar to Ridder). As well as having a suspect OL in Ten and Pitt, using a RBBC approach was going to be the best option.
He prefers to use 1 primary WR, and then the #2 WR and TE then become the next receiving weapons, but depending on the personnel, a RB could move into a top 3 role. I don't see that happening at OSU with all of the WR and TE talent, but Smith likes using his RBs in the passing game, A LOT! So get used to see screens, wheel routes and slants to Bo, Ja'Kobi, Isaiah and company.
And the funny thing is, if you look at the offenses of the top 4 teams this weekend in the championship games, ALL of their offenses mimic this. But difference is, they all have better talent than anything Smith ever had. The 2nd leading receiver for NE is TE, Hunter Henry. Treveyon was eased into a starting role at RB, similar what Smith did with Bijan, but the OL were quite different, which led to more success for Henderson. McDaniel was also a failed HC who came back to being an OC, and now has Vrabel in the SB in only his 2nd year as HC. The Broncos didn't have a 1000yd rusher due to JK getting injured, but Harvey filled in and has almost 900yds from scrimmage after seeing JK start the first 10gms.
So to sum it up, expect more of a pro style/NFL offense. There will be a dominant WR1(Smith), a reliable WR2(tbd), a versatile TE(tbd) and a RB who can run and catch(Jackson). Gone are the days of 5 wide, air raid, pass happy offenses that were once so popular in college. Day wants to run an NFL style team, not just on defense, but on offense. And some of the ways that Hartline ran the heavy looks, didn't show the same type of creativity that he's hoping Smith does. Smith has studied under Shanahan, McVey and LeFleur, but has never had the talent that they have had. Well now he will, and similar to Patricia who didn't really have a defense/team with talent for what he wanted to run in Detroit or Philly, along with not getting the serious NFL looks like he wanted, it could be good for both parties.
And if I'm wrong on all of this, PLEASE quote this and laugh in my proverbial face
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I think the Smith love for using TEs, is quite overblown.
And he had Bijan for his rookie year, its not like he had him for multiple years. Did you expect him to give a rookie RB 300car like he was Derrick Henry? Vrabel/McDaniels barely started Treveyon most of the season and now they're in the SB, using him in a committee, like what Smith did. And you're forgetting his only competent WR was a 2nd year Drake London, so the only other offensive weapons he had were 2 TEs(Pitts and Jonnu Smith). Gotta tell the whole story if you're going to bash the guy.
If he only stays 2-3yrs, that's a massive success. Saban only kept his OCs for the same amount of time and saw success. Plus it keeps new voices in the room. Coordinators aren't staying for 5-10yrs any longer
1 guy who had never called plays and was only a position coach his entire short career, compared to a guy who literally worked his way up the NFL coaching tree, was an NFL HC and OC. And he called plays while being a HC, so 3 different stops he was an actual OC. I'd say that's an upgrade
But he called the plays, so he was the OC in essence.
Funny, those are 3 things I don't loathe either
Sorry for writing so many, but there were a lot of interesting posts to respond to.
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Idk, but we can ask the OCs for Denver, New England, Seattle and LA. They didn't seem to have an issue with it, and they played in a 17gm regular season with 2-3 post season games with no issue. And if I dug deeper, I'm sure I could find many more teams who also implemented this method with success as well.
And to add, the WR2 will factor into the top 4 offensive weapons as well. Including that, shows the offense of pretty much every team that made the NFL playoffs.
Again, if I'm wrong, I have no problem being told so and eating a large portion of crow
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BuckBackHome
Wolverine is largest member of weasel family
But does his system take three years for the players to really master it.
My bad. Wrong coordinator thread;-)
My bad. Wrong coordinator thread;-)
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I'm not quite sure how you can say this as a Steeler fan. (also....look out. somebody around here doesn't like Steeler fans)
DK Metcalf was invisible this year. He'd have like 2 catches for 30 yards in the 1st quarter and then never get another target. I can't even name another Pittsburgh WR.
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One charitable way to view this is Day clearly raising his hand and saying "I need to solve this running game; that if that gets fixed, everything else will come along with it". I would agree with that and honestly be glad he's taking addressing it that seriously.
If Arthur Smith can:
- improves the running game
- improves the offensive line blocking scheme and execution vs the stuff they struggle against (which is NFL style stunts and twists)
- thoughtfully implements Day's passing game, without totally ruining it
- allows Day to focus more broadly and get back mental share for other things (overall gameplan, special teams, roster management, etc.)
We will look back on this as a successful hire.
He won't revolutionize our offense... he's not that kind of hire. But he will professionalize certain elements, especially the run game. And Day clearly is saying that is what he needs.
If Arthur Smith can:
- improves the running game
- improves the offensive line blocking scheme and execution vs the stuff they struggle against (which is NFL style stunts and twists)
- thoughtfully implements Day's passing game, without totally ruining it
- allows Day to focus more broadly and get back mental share for other things (overall gameplan, special teams, roster management, etc.)
We will look back on this as a successful hire.
He won't revolutionize our offense... he's not that kind of hire. But he will professionalize certain elements, especially the run game. And Day clearly is saying that is what he needs.
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OHSportsFan
Fan of Ohio Sports in Indy
The Good: I’ve at least talked myself into Smith coming from the OL/TE mold (former OL for UNC) - similar to Kevin Wilson and Chip Kelly. So there has to be some emphasis on running and good run concepts, surely.
The Bad: the passing side seems to be heavy on the TE. I’d say Day would help him here but uh…seems to be a feature not a bug. Blah.
The Unknown: I can’t shake the nepotism tag with this guy. Elite people like hiring/being around other social elite people, even if they suck at their job.
The Bad: the passing side seems to be heavy on the TE. I’d say Day would help him here but uh…seems to be a feature not a bug. Blah.
The Unknown: I can’t shake the nepotism tag with this guy. Elite people like hiring/being around other social elite people, even if they suck at their job.
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That's been DK is entire career buddy. He's one of the most overrated WRs in the NFL. He's made a living off of an NFL draft picture, and chasing down an INT. He's a glorified WR2. He's a 7yr vet with only 3 1000yd seasons. This was his lowest overall yards in a year, but his targets, TDs, and reception average were all on par to what he's always done. So he played like DK plays. His Ole Miss counterpart: AJ Brown is who fans think DK is. And btw, Smith coached Brown too. He had 2 1000yd seasons, and in his 3rd year he had multiple injuries and still had 869yds 5tds.
The man made chicken salad out of chicken you know what with DK. And when he had a solid WR1 in Brown, he had success. Smith didn't have a good WR1 in Atlanta. He had a rookie ad 2nd year Drake London. Not sure how many coaches are seeing success with that. And oh btw, you fail to mention: DK had an over the hill Rodgers throwing to him, Brown had an average Tannehill and London had Mariota... Again, how many OCs are winning with that?
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We don't need him too. OSU has enough talent, to where they should be able to get 2-3yds for a first down, which they couldn't last year. OSU should have more success in the RZ, regardless if Smith and Tate were in there or not. Kelly didn't revolutionize anything last year, he figured out the strengths of the offense, and leaned on that. He leaned on the strengths of Henderson and Judkins. That's all you want your OC to do. They don't need to get cute, and that's what it seemed like Hartline was doing too much. A lot of meat was left on the bone of this offense this past season, and that falls squarely on Hartline since he was the OC. He wanted the job, he wanted to call plays, and we were all told he was. Now the Miami game falls on Day, but the rest, that's on Hartline.
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Not attacking you, but look at all the excuses. Rookie Bijan, rookie London, over the hill Rodgers, average Tannehill. At what point are we going to stop and just say he aint it? You ask who can have success with a 2nd year WR? Seattle would say hi, but they're busy preparing for the SB. With what I'm assuming you'd call "average Sam Darnold" if he were to have played under Arthur Smith. Tons of OCs in the NFL would love to have Buckeye fandom defending their failures just because they got (inexplicably) chosen to be on the Ohio State staff for what I hope is just one year.
Think this a good hire, think it's a bad hire....whatever. But when people defend every single thing he does with this much excuse making (not you....everybody as a whole), it makes me wonder if the defense isn't just hopium. I choose to believe that's exactly what it is, because it's one of the things a massive successful fanbase does best.
edit: ah shit....JSN is in year 3. I'll leave it for transparency.
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More info. would be appreciated.After taking a day to let my frustration with the hire subside, I started looking into Smith's personnel when he was with the Titans, Falcons and Steelers. I'm also a Steelers fan(Here we Go), so I didn't exactly get the warm and fuzzies when Smith was announced as the HC. But then, after doing a little bit of research, you can easily see that he has had some of the worst collection of talent any coach can have.
Feel free to bash for being a "homer" or wearing "scarlet colored glasses", but I went from not liking the hire, to being very intrigued. Smith has been the OC to the following QBs: Ryan Tannehill, Desmond Ridder and (WELL past his prime)Aaron Rodgers. Not exactly a talented bunch, so then he had to lean on the run game, when he had Derrick Henry. Then had Corradelle Patterson, Tyler Algiers, Bijan Robinson, Najee Harris, Jaylen Warren and Kenneth Gainwell at RB. He gets knocked for not utilizing a rookie Bijan Robinson enough. That is a fair assessment, but when your RB is a rookie and your starting QB is a 2nd year below average player, you kind of need to rely on more than 1 RB to see any type of success. Which he split carries between Robinson and Algiers. He utilized the same gameplan in Pittsburgh this last season, when it was apparent that Rodgers was limited in his mobility and arm strength(similar to Ridder). As well as having a suspect OL in Ten and Pitt, using a RBBC approach was going to be the best option.
He prefers to use 1 primary WR, and then the #2 WR and TE then become the next receiving weapons, but depending on the personnel, a RB could move into a top 3 role. I don't see that happening at OSU with all of the WR and TE talent, but Smith likes using his RBs in the passing game, A LOT! So get used to see screens, wheel routes and slants to Bo, Ja'Kobi, Isaiah and company.
And the funny thing is, if you look at the offenses of the top 4 teams this weekend in the championship games, ALL of their offenses mimic this. But difference is, they all have better talent than anything Smith ever had. The 2nd leading receiver for NE is TE, Hunter Henry. Treveyon was eased into a starting role at RB, similar what Smith did with Bijan, but the OL were quite different, which led to more success for Henderson. McDaniel was also a failed HC who came back to being an OC, and now has Vrabel in the SB in only his 2nd year as HC. The Broncos didn't have a 1000yd rusher due to JK getting injured, but Harvey filled in and has almost 900yds from scrimmage after seeing JK start the first 10gms.
So to sum it up, expect more of a pro style/NFL offense. There will be a dominant WR1(Smith), a reliable WR2(tbd), a versatile TE(tbd) and a RB who can run and catch(Jackson). Gone are the days of 5 wide, air raid, pass happy offenses that were once so popular in college. Day wants to run an NFL style team, not just on defense, but on offense. And some of the ways that Hartline ran the heavy looks, didn't show the same type of creativity that he's hoping Smith does. Smith has studied under Shanahan, McVey and LeFleur, but has never had the talent that they have had. Well now he will, and similar to Patricia who didn't really have a defense/team with talent for what he wanted to run in Detroit or Philly, along with not getting the serious NFL looks like he wanted, it could be good for both parties.
And if I'm wrong on all of this, PLEASE quote this and laugh in my proverbial face
Upvote
0