Midwest Bracket Discussion

[buckeyeboy]

. How is that crying? I couldn't care less how far Oregon makes it in either tournament. I was just pointing out that they've been the beneficiary of some upsets in both the Pac-10 (playing Cal in the semis after Cal's upset of UCLA) and NCAA (playing Winthrop after their upset of ND and palying UNLV after their upset of Wisconsin) tournaments. Let's put it this way: they could make the Elite 8 by beating teams seeded #14, #11, and #7 -- you don't think they've been lucky at all?

 

[jwinslow]

I was just pointing out that they've been the beneficiary of some upsets in both the Pac-10 (playing Cal in the semis after Cal's upset of UCLA)

That win over USC is looking awfully good after yesterday.

and NCAA (playing Winthrop after their upset of ND and palying UNLV after their upset of Wisconsin) tournaments. Let's put it this way: they could make the Elite 8 by beating teams seeded #14, #11, and #7 -- you don't think they've been lucky at all?

I'd say the upcoming game (which they haven't won) is the only "lucky" break out of the three (tho I think UNLV might be a tougher opponent).

Winthrop was an excellent team for an #11 seed, very comparable to the 6 seed they ousted, and on par with Duke or Vanderbilt (also six seeds).

 

[buckeyeboy]

That win over USC is looking awfully good after yesterday.

This is not responsive to my argument. Whether Oregon beat USC (a team in the bottom half of the Pac-10 tournament bracket) has absolutely nothing to do with Oregon getting lucky by Cal's upset of UCLA which allowed Oregon to face Cal in the semis in the top half of the bracket. If Cal doesn't upset UCLA, Oregon probably doesn't even face USC in the Pac-10 final.

I'd say the upcoming game (which they haven't won) is the only "lucky" break out of the three (tho I think UNLV might be a tougher opponent).
Winthrop was an excellent team for an #11 seed, very comparable to the 6 seed they ousted, and on par with Duke or Vanderbilt (also six seeds).

I disagree. ND, relies heavily on the three-point shot, and if they get hot, they have the potential to beat almost anyone out there. While I'm not saying that ND is better than Oregon, I know that if I were an Oregon fan, I'd much rather face Winthrop than ND. For the same reason, I think Tennessee will be a tough game for us to win in the Sweet Sixteen.

 

[OregonBuckeye]

This is not responsive to my argument. Whether Oregon beat USC (a team in the bottom half of the Pac-10 tournament bracket) has absolutely nothing to do with Oregon getting lucky by Cal's upset of UCLA which allowed Oregon to face Cal in the semis in the top half of the bracket. If Cal doesn't upset UCLA, Oregon probably doesn't even face USC in the Pac-10 final.

You have absolutely no proof of that and now you look like you're just grasping at straws.

 

[buckeyeboy]

You have absolutely no proof of that and now you look like you're just grasping at straws.

Let me break it down for you:

1. I made a point.
2. A non-responsive argument was made.
3. I labeled it as non-responsive and reiterated my original point in order to prove #2.

Your claim that I'm grasping at straws might actually seem halfway intelligent if I had changed my argument or made a new argument in light of a valid response to my original point. Neither happened here.

Look, I know you didn't like my post b/c you're a total Oregon homer and I said that Oregon has gotten lucky in their tournament draws lately. . If it makes you feel any better, I think that Oregon's played very well as of late and that they're looking like they could make a strong run in the tournament. However, that does not change the fact that they've been the beneficiary of several upsets lately, which was my original point.

 

[OregonBuckeye]

When you start throwing in words like "probably" and "if" in your argument you look like you're just trying to start a pissing match which I believe you are. Let me get this straight. Cal, a crap team away from home, can beat UCLA but Oregon, a team that beat UCLA once in the regular season and throttled that same Cal team in the Pac-10 tourney, would have little chance to beat UCLA? The way Oregon was playing in the Pac-10 tournament I doubt anyone was going to beat them. But I digress. I'm done arguing with you about the Pac-10 and Oregon. Your feelings toward them are pretty much set in stone and no logic is going to sway you.

 

[Fungo Squiggly]

Who would you rather have played: Cal or UCLA? The answer is Cal, right? That's his point.

I didn't see anyone say Oregon wouldn't have beaten UCLA, just that getting Cal INSTEAD of UCLA is a good break.

EDIT - I've only read the last couple posts. If I missed a comment from earlier, feel free to call me names and ding me mercilessly.

 

[jwinslow]

This is not responsive to my argument. Whether Oregon beat USC (a team in the bottom half of the Pac-10 tournament bracket) has absolutely nothing to do with Oregon getting lucky by Cal's upset of UCLA which allowed Oregon to face Cal in the semis in the top half of the bracket. If Cal doesn't upset UCLA, Oregon probably doesn't even face USC in the Pac-10 final.

This is precisely how I read your first post, and now you are revealing the context of your detraction (which you're now trying to sell as a casual observation).

I think that Oregon's played very well as of late and that they're looking like they could make a strong run in the tournament. However, that does not change the fact that they've been the beneficiary of several upsets lately, which was my original point.

So they can make a strong run in the tourney, despite their probably second opponent being Florida, yet they needed luck to advance in the Pac10 tourney?

One could argue that they played even better in the pac-10 tourney looking at their box scores (I didn't tune in).

 

[OregonBuckeye]

Who would you rather have played: Cal or UCLA? The answer is Cal, right? That's his point.

I didn't see anyone say Oregon wouldn't have beaten UCLA, just that getting Cal INSTEAD of UCLA is a good break.

EDIT - I've only read the last couple posts. If I missed a comment from earlier, feel free to call me names and ding me mercilessly.

I'm focusing on the main point though. Buckeyeboy's main point is Oregon is lucky to be where they're at right now. One of his arguments is facing Cal instead of UCLA. I completely agree that UCLA would be much tougher and would've had a better shot at knocking off Oregon. However, he seems to think this is rare in tournaments. I guess UNC is lucky since they only had to face NC St. in the ACC championship game or Florida is lucky since they only had to face Arkansas in the SEC championship game. Upsets happen. Welcome to sports. Oregon's Sweet 16 berth has little to do with luck.

 

[buckeyeboy]

My original post:

Between the Pac-10 tournament and the Midwest bracket in the NCAA tournament, Oregon's the luckiest team in college basketball right now.

Nowhere did I say that they're "lucky to be where they're at right now," as you, Oregonbuckeye, claim. I meant that they, more than any other team in the last month, have been the beneficiary of upsets in both their conference tournament and the NCAA tournament. Nor do I think that upsets are rare in tournaments, as you accuse me of thinking. I entirely agree with your statement that UNC got a lucky draw in the ACC tournament. However, they, unlike Oregon, have not been the beneficiary of a lucky draw in the NCAAs as well. If you and jwins want to continue to read disrespect into that statement and ignore the several clarifications I have made, go ahead.

 

[Cicero]

Yeah, we missed some free throws which hurt but we didn't really get to the line too much either. Overall I'm happy with the effort. Played the number one overall seed within 7 points and covered (I believe). I'm excited about our future, we have a great recruiting class coming in next year. Horford finally got going in the second half and we didn't have the height to stop him. Hey, we lost but at least Kramer knocked Noah on his ass HARD. Good luck to the Buckeyes, if you play the Gators I think you HANDLE them.

I was on my way back to South GA during the game and was pulling for you guys. You do indeed have a bright future.

Now I am rooting for the Gators. I really want to face them if we reach the big game. That football NC game would taste a lot less bitter if we got the chance to send them packing.

 

[jwinslow]

Now I am rooting for the Gators. I really want to face them if we reach the big game. That football NC game would taste a lot less bitter if we got the chance to send them packing.

Especially considering their media-driven pedestal is three times as high as OSU football's...

 

[OregonBuckeye]

Especially considering their media-driven pedestal is three times as high as OSU football's...

WHAT!?!?! But Joakim Noah told me they get no respect! He abused my trust. :(

 

[SanAntonioBuck]

AP

Gators pass tough test against Butler

By MARK LONG
AP Sports Writer

ST. LOUIS (AP) -- Al Horford and Joakim Noah had small spots of blood speckled across their shirts and shorts - remnants of Butler's aggressive, physical play. For Florida's big men, the red dots were a reminder of how tough it can be to try to repeat as national champions.

Continued...

UF wins 65-57

 

[SanAntonioBuck]

AP

Gators heading back to the Final Four

By NANCY ARMOUR
AP National Writer

ST. LOUIS (AP) -- Inside, outside, early, late. It doesn't matter how Florida does it.

At tournament time, nobody's better than the Gators.

Joakim Noah and his buddies are heading back to the Final Four, looking for a second straight national championship that was worth more to them than NBA millions.

Continued...