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Mid Majors, playoffs and who "deserves" what

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BKB, with all due respect, just because you agree with your opinions, and disagree with my opinions, doesn't mean mine are opinions and yours are fact. I've read all your posts about this subject over the years. I've seen all the work you have done. But I still see it as opinions, just with more work put into them than I have done because I don't have the time to do all you have done. You still draw conclusions that are opinions. I disagree with conclusions you draw (games would mean less, attendance would drop, big regular season games would go away, teams that don't deserve NCs would win them, etc.) and the only way to truly know will be when it happens. I can't magically come up with facts because we don't have a playoff yet for me to draw facts from. And I really don't think it is fair to compare college football to other sports, because they are two separate sports.

My hope is that when a playoff does come, it's well thought out, and involves home-field advantage. I feel this is key.

If things do play out the way that you feel they will BKB, then I feel that a playoff may be a mistake. But even after reading all your research, I only feel stronger that they will not play out that way. I could be wrong. You could be wrong.

But in the long run, nothing they do to the way a NC is crowned can change my love for Ohio State. So i'm not worried either way. I will still love the games, and I will still just care about beating Michigan. But I feel like a playoff would make me interested in college football as a whole. And really, when it comes down to it, if I enjoy it more than that's great for me. If other people hate it, then why should I care? I enjoy international soccer. Most people don't. Doesn't make me like it any less. If people start hating a playoff system and college football, it wouldn't make me enjoy it any less. Heck if games stop selling out, then there will be more tickets for me :)
 
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My problem with the whole BCS is that teams can take far divergent paths to reach the NC game. Texas this year didn't play a team that finished inside the top 18. Two years ago, the schedule gods favored our Buckeyes. TCU, UC, Boise.. are they really great teams or just really good teams in really bad conferences? Schedules are often set years in advance and the politics make it difficult for a mid-major to pack their OOC schedule with top match-ups. I favor a playoff not because I give a rat's ass about a team like Boise St getting a "shot they deserve," but because I care about them being able to make that claim without facing the week in and week out opponents that the teams of the Big 10, Big 12, Pac 10, and SEC do. Any system is going to be unfair to somebody. Would it be fair to force this year's Alabama to play 2 or 3 more game to make the NC game? Of course not. Texas, eh, not so much. Boise, TCU, UC.. absolutely not. If UC could knock off say LSU, tOSU, and Alabama in route to a NC.. now that would prove something. Just my 2 cents.
 
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JXC;1616115; said:
:lol: It's giddy, not gitty.
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Opps... :biggrin:

On the other issue - I guess I'm of the position that I've laid out the basis for my "opinion" and am met with words like "I just feel..."

I've openly asked for ideas on systems that solve BCS problems and said I would fairly evaluate them if they came. LJB and Billmac met the challenge, and - with all due respect - I don't believe you have. I'm trying to argue with something approaching objectivity... facts, and reasoned analysis... we can argue about that analysis... but it gets tiring trying to do so when you're met with "I feel..." and "but it's great"

I don't mean to suggest your opinion is wrong. But, I also don't think my "opinion" on the matter is just me saying "I feel it's bad for football." I'm trying to demonstrate WHY I am of that opinion, and - again, with respect - I don't feel you've returned that.

I mean, the nova example.... you say playoffs are more fair. I demonstrate how this is precisely NOT the case, and you say "to me it's a lot more fair...."
 
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Buckeyeskickbuttocks;1616103; said:
I've never felt "gitty" knowing my team just got in the playoffs. Honestly. No once. Ever.

Most of the time, when they qualify, it comes with little fan fare at all.. take New Orleans and Indianapolis, for example... they're in.. and...

who [censored]ing cares? They got a Y by their names in the standings! Whoppty [censored].
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I say take your example and look at the last two teams to get in the playoffs rather than the first two. Fans of these teams definitely [censored]ing care when their teams qualify. It's the borderline teams that make the end of the regular season so compelling and it would be the same for CFB. As is, those teams are playing for a chance to make their conferences money in an exhibition game.
 
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Buckeyeskickbuttocks said:
Opps... :biggrin:

On the other issue - I guess I'm of the position that I've laid out the basis for my "opinion" and am met with words like "I just feel..."

I've openly asked for ideas on systems that solve BCS problems and said I would fairly evaluate them if they came. LJB and Billmac met the challenge, and - with all due respect - I don't believe you have. I'm trying to argue with something approaching objectivity... facts, and reasoned analysis... we can argue about that analysis... but it gets tiring trying to do so when you're met with "I feel..." and "but it's great"

I don't mean to suggest your opinion is wrong. But, I also don't think my "opinion" on the matter is just me saying "I feel it's bad for football." I'm trying to demonstrate WHY I am of that opinion, and - again, with respect - I don't feel you've returned that.

I mean, the nova example.... you say playoffs are more fair. I demonstrate how this is precisely NOT the case, and you say "to me it's a lot more fair...."
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I guess i'm just not smart enough to be able to illustrate why my opinions are they way the are. :lol:

I am just not ambitious enough right now to go that in depth. It just makes sense to me. I tire myself trying to get it to make sense to others. Maybe I do feel too passionate about it to be rational about it. But that's fine, because whenever it comes to college football i'm driven by passion, not rational thought. And I'm okay with that.
 
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College Basketball/NBA/NHL/MLB are all bad examples due to the amount of games played.

Additional reason for big OOC games = Recruits want to play in them + exposure for NFL

MOV would need added back in if playoff is instituted.

I never care about 95% of the college games towards the end of the year- AND I LOVE COLLEGE FOOTBALL. Who they hell cares about Wisconsin/hawaii. We would if we might have to play Wisky again down the road.

Rematches happen. So what. Life isn't fair. At least that team has the chance to beat out the fact that it wasn't fair. They have to beat them 2 times and it wasn't just picked that they were worse. And teams in most cases are gelling better at the end of the year, especially if they are playing for something.

Just my 8 cents.
 
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CookyPuss;1616135; said:
...and this is my main concern about a playoff. It will be well thought out.. well thought out to maximize corporate profits.
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This.

A playoff system will ruin CFB as we know it.

The beauty of CFB is that there is impassioned debate about who deserves what. There are disputed MNCs from 40-50 years ago. There is an entire season of relevent contests. There are opportunities to schedule meaningful and challenging non-conference games in the future which have the potential of validating the quality of your team.

I don't want NCAA Div 1A football to turn into NFLjr. That's great that Div. 1AA, Div. 2, Div. 3 all have their play-offs and stuff - but they don't have the traditions of the big bowls that D1A has. The bowl system is quirky, and the BCS system is quirkier, but it's about the best one can hope for while remaining true to the single post-season bowl game construct.

Why are so many people intent on their being one indisputable Nat'l Champion anyway? Part of the beauty (and unique quirkiness) of D1A CFB is that many different organizations recognize a 'National Champion'. As those organizations continue to get paired down to the AP and Coaches poll, then down the the ONE BCS CHAMP, I think *that* is what diminishes CFB.

Forcing a playoff system is another step away from the amateur nature of CFB. These are student athletes, not professionals. Why force an NFLjr framework on one of the last compelling high-profile amateur sports?

You want a nice neat playoff crowned champion? Go follow the NFL. Give me the controversy, the debate, the chaos of D1A CFB. Don't fuck with my conference. Don't fuck with my rivalries. Don't fuck with my Rose Bowl.

:gobucks3::gobucks4:
 
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FCollinsBuckeye;1616151; said:
Don't fuck with my Rose Bowl.

:gobucks3::gobucks4:
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5 consecutive Big 10 championships and 1 Rose Bowl. Sorry, but they've fucked with your Rose Bowl. I get what you are saying and I prefer the old system to the half loaf BCS. But since we're not going back, I'm for a playoff.
:oh::io:
 
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CookyPuss;1616160; said:
Sorry, but they've [censored]ed with your Rose Bowl.
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Indeed, they had - Jan. 2002 being the nadir of Rose Bowls, imo, but since they've added the extra MNC game, I think things are as they should be. If the Buckeyes earn a trip to the MNC Game instead of our rightful spot in the Rose, than I can't complain.

Further tinkering and the implementaion of a playoff will do far more to alter D1A CFB than the BCS has to date - and I think if/when that happens, many will truely yearn for the days of yore.
 
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BCS opponent tied to Fiesta Bowl scandal


The public face of opposition to the Bowl Championship Series for the past two years has been Playoff PAC, a small but vocal group based in the nation's capital.

Registered as a political-action committee in fall 2009, the organization operates less like a PAC and more like an anti-BCS lobbying organization.

Though Playoff PAC has raised little money, it has engaged in a public-relations campaign to gather and disseminate embarrassing data on the BCS bowls - the Fiesta, Orange, Rose and Sugar. It also has filed complaints with government entities against BCS bowls, alleging improper and potentially illegal activity.

The Arizona Republic found that Sanderson, Playoff PAC's key spokesman, also has a tie to the recent scandal at the Fiesta Bowl, in which the bowl confirmed that some employees were reimbursed for making campaign contributions, a potential felony.

.../cont/...
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Muck;2007146; said:
Rather it shows that shows that those pushing for a playoff aren't doing so because they have the best interests of college football at heart.
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Did you even read that article? He was on McCain's campaign staff. He didn't know there was anything wrong with the funds until the organization he was a spokesperson for called for an investigation in to it. This would strictly be related to campaign financing of McCain and not Playoff PAC.

This reeks of beign contorted to disparrage Playoff PAC.

No evidence of wrongdoing by Sanderson of Playoff PAC here, I don't even see a direct accusation. Rather, a bunch of statements strung together in such a way we're supposed to think they're bad guys.

These guys have hardly raised enough money to keep their website running.

What are you insinuating they are doing it for, if not for the best interests of College Football?
 
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