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Do You Believe People are Basically Evil?

Objectively I can't even discern what evil would look like. If evil exists, I have no way of knowing it.

Subjectively, there's plenty of "evil" out there. Of course, it may or may not be "actual evil" since subjective beliefs aren't "facts" at all - just opinions. I suppose if enough people share the same subjective opinion, we come think of that belief as a "fact" But... it's still not really a fact.

Is killing a man evil? Might be, I suppose... if it's cold blooded murder... but, what if it's killing another man to save your kids' life? Not so evil. Depends on the motivation... even stupid people act on the motivation that strikes them as the most appropriate.... so... where's the evil? (Different that social responsibility)

Abortion is evil to some... not to others.... is it Evil? Fuck if I know. Depends on who you are. Thus, to me, there is not evil, nor good... just acts... and people having opinions regarding them.

None among us, I don't think, can say what is Good or what is Evil. We can only say "I don't like it when some bitch microwave's here baby" But, is it evil? Hell if I know. I know I think it's unimaginably horrid. I know that the bitch should face severe consequences. But can I call her "evil?" Nope. I don't know what evil is. And, I submit, none on this thread do either.
 
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Evil is:


1. morally wrong or bad; immoral; wicked: evil deeds; an evil life.
2. harmful; injurious: evil laws.
3. characterized or accompanied by misfortune or suffering; unfortunate; disastrous: to be fallen on evil days.
4. due to actual or imputed bad conduct or character: an evil reputation.
5. marked by anger, irritability, irascibility, etc.: He is known for his evil disposition.
–noun 6. that which is evil; evil quality, intention, or conduct: to choose the lesser of two evils.
7. the force in nature that governs and gives rise to wickedness and sin.
8. the wicked or immoral part of someone or something: The evil in his nature has destroyed the good.
9. harm; mischief; misfortune: to wish one evil.
10. anything causing injury or harm: Tobacco is considered by some to be an evil.
11. a harmful aspect, effect, or consequence: the evils of alcohol.
12. a disease, as king's evil.
–adverb 13. in an evil manner; badly; ill: It went evil with him.
—Idiom14. the evil one, the devil; Satan.
 
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CCI;1105142; said:
Evil is:


1. morally wrong or bad; immoral; wicked: evil deeds; an evil life.
Sure... name me a moral wrong. A wicked deed. Show me an evil life. Wait... dont waste your time, you can't. You can show me atrocious humans... I may even agree with you that an individual acts badly.... Still not evil.
2. harmful; injurious: evil laws.
Such as?
3. characterized or accompanied by misfortune or suffering; unfortunate; disastrous: to be fallen on evil days.
Quite an open door there.... When the Buckeyes lost to Illinois owing to the misfortune of a bad ref crew that was "evil?"
4. due to actual or imputed bad conduct or character: an evil reputation.
Opening the door even wider.. now people can be evil if we simply impute conduct to them. HOLY SHIT!!!! WITCH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
5. marked by anger, irritability, irascibility, etc.: He is known for his evil disposition.
I'd say anger is anger. Irritability is being irritable.... I don't see how any of these common emotions are "evil" Of course, maybe religion is right and we are all evil.
?noun 6. that which is evil; evil quality, intention, or conduct: to choose the lesser of two evils.
No definition here... just usage of the term.
7. the force in nature that governs and gives rise to wickedness and sin.
Ah... right.... show me wickedness or sin then. G-d's "law" will come in to play here, and that'll take this thread down a path we've already walked several times on the Bible thread. I won't do that here, but suffice to the reliance on exterior sources for our decisions on good and evil are suspect.
8. the wicked or immoral part of someone or something: The evil in his nature has destroyed the good.
In who's view?
9. harm; mischief; misfortune: to wish one evil.
So, when I hope someone who cut me off on the road has the misfortune of getting stuck at the next traffic light, I'm being evil?
10. anything causing injury or harm: Tobacco is considered by some to be an evil.
So, everything is evil. Except broccoli, of course.
11. a harmful aspect, effect, or consequence: the evils of alcohol.
not only is everything evil, some things are also evil for other reasons.. which when you look closely, are the same reasons as #10.
12. a disease, as king's evil.
My mother died of Cancer. It was not evil. It sucked. I hated that it was happening. But, there was no evil involved.
?adverb 13. in an evil manner; badly; ill: It went evil with him.
Not a definition - usage
?Idiom14. the evil one, the devil; Satan.
Who's this now?
[FONT=arial,sans-serif][SIZE=-1]Miroslav Satan[/SIZE][/FONT]:
1487181.jpg


CCI - I understand what man means when he says evil. My point is, there is no such thing. It's just a way we categorize acts. To say those acts we are categorizing are actually good or evil is impossible. There is no "known correct" morality - only our individual morality, or our collective agreements on what we think is moral (ie laws against killing). Without it, there can be no known good or evil.
 
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Taosman;1105204; said:
In the animal world there is no good or evil, just animals doing what is necessary to survive. No evil there.
So. Why do we want to say there is evil?
It's just a judgement on our part.

agree, animal instinct is not evil, it is a way of life for animals. But for humans what would be the defined as evil killing another human being?
 
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CCI;1105212; said:
agree, animal instinct is not evil, it is a way of life for animals. But for humans what would be the defined as evil killing another human being?
I suppose a killing where you are convicted of it by a jury of your peers, or one which one pleads to. But, there again, it's not "evil" per se, just an agreed opinion that the act is counter our individual or collective morality.
 
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Buckeyeskickbuttocks;1105155; said:
CCI - I understand what man means when he says evil. My point is, there is no such thing. It's just a way we categorize acts. To say those acts we are categorizing are actually good or evil is impossible. There is no "known correct" morality - only our individual morality, or our collective agreements on what we think is moral (ie laws against killing). Without it, there can be no known good or evil.


I agree 100%. This could be a discussion about religion (good or evil).
Matt 7:23
And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.:

1. gross injustice or wickedness.
2. a violation of right or duty; wicked act; sin.
Sin is evil, now we can define Sin:biggrin:
 
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Buckeyeskickbuttocks;1105217; said:
I suppose a killing where you are convicted of it by a jury of your peers, or one which one pleads to. But, there again, it's not "evil" per se, just an agreed opinion that the act is counter our individual or collective morality.


premeditated or intentional or accidental

who can be sterotyped into thinking that once a person is guilty of killing doesn't make that individual evil.
 
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On your critique of those definitions, BKB, I agree that using morality makes it too subject to interpretation.

The second definition of "harmful, injurious" is a fair attempt at using other words to define evil. You ask for examples, I'm sure you'd be able to pick each one apart if they were given.

I also believe that you'd be able to do a similar critique for definitions of love, altruism, good, hate, and bad.

Some words are difficult to have a definitive description that almost everybody will agree on.
 
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Best Buckeye;1105220; said:
And this makes evil evil and an actuality.
No it doesn't. It makes it an agreed evil. We could just as well later decide the precise same act is perfectly acceptable. Since the nature of the act (in terms of concluding it's moral significance) could just as easily change, it is not an "actual" anything.... It's just an act. It could be either good or bad. And, again, while we as a culture are perfectly free to decide what we will and will not put up with, it has very little to do with some sort of objective "goodness" or "badness" It's just a human decision. Nothing more, nothing less.
 
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BB73;1105226; said:
On your critique of those definitions, BKB, I agree that using morality makes it too subject to interpretation.

The second definition of "harmful, injurious" is a fair attempt at using other words to define evil. You ask for examples, I'm sure you'd be able to pick each one apart if they were given.

I also believe that you'd be able to do a similar critique for definitions of love, altruism, good, hate, and bad.

Some words are difficult to have a definitive description that almost everybody will agree on.

True.

I suppose the point I'm driving at here concerns the "objective" existence of good or evil at all. I'm perfectly satisfied saying a child rapist is evil. But, when I do, I don't mean damned. I don't mean anything other than a comment that I disapprove of the act of raping children very strongly. In other words, I make my judgments - but I do not suppose those judgments should bear any particular weight, nor do I suppose I can have the slightest idea what is or is not pleasing to G-d.

I'm wondering if Love is different. I mean, we don't talk about love being a quality of humanity the same way we talk about people being good or bad. I mean, I agree Love is something you feel, rather than something you define.... but it seems to me that the idea of Love is a different concept structurally than concepts like Good, Evil and so on. I'll have to think about that one, but thanks for sparking the consideration for me, as I've never really thought about it in these terms.
 
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