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Devin Gardner (official thread)

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I know Gardner will have a better line. Everyone knows when you lose your entire interior line and your backup Center your line gets better. I mean walk-on Centers that were 3rd/4th string the year before will be a ton better the following year. It's not like Center is an important position on an OL. I mean if he were the one to call out protections it would be one thing. Nah Glasgow will make Michigan's line much better. Gardner won't be touched.

I'm sure Gardner will have a much better running game as well because of the loss of those 3 starters and backups being gone. Touisaint will be a much better back after his broken leg. That always happens as well. RB's get broken legs and come back better. True Freshmen always come in and tear the world up. The automatically know how to pickup blitzes. Michigan couldn't run the ball from the RB position last year. It must have been the RB's on their roster or maybe it was the 3 starters that left fault they couldn't run the ball from the backfield.

I guess we shall see. I know I'm gonna be watching that CMU game. September Heisman's and NC's might be handed out again in AA.
 
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brutus2002;2360233; said:
You just suck period...I knew Saban was over 60...that's the [censored]ing point!!! The point is Meyer is young in the coaching ranks despite his 2 UNC...It's not far fetched to think he could match Sabans 4 UNC's by the time he's 60+...

I could give a [Mark May] what is Sabans birthday...I'm not wasting my time when I already know he's over 60...the point went over your Walmart Wolverine head.

Meyer is gonna continue where Tressel left off and even take us higher. Your program is no better than 4th or 5th in the B10 right now. MSU, Wisconsin, OSU,and Nebraska are better. If NW keeps charging and PSU can keep BOB you might be 6th or 7th at the way your program is heading...show me on the field big mouth and then talk smack to Buckeyes on their board.
Click to expand...

Sure Meyer could make it to 4, but he has to stay healthy.

As for the rest of your post is a lot of emotion, Michigan and OSU are destroying the other big ten schools in recruiting the past three years. Talking who's is better michigan vs OSU would be a fun debate. Will see how it plays out and should be fun.

No smack talk, just football debate. You have to get some perspective from others about your team, it's way to easy to drink the koolaid.

Gardner best WR was 5' 8'' gallon last year. Who's the kid from OSU who made that one handed catch last year? It's nice to have a WR like him to throw too, DG had nobody even close to that calibor last year. I think the two WR this year have the ability to make those type of catches. Will see.

TE has to be big this year, with DR michigan never seemed to attacked the seems with our TE's. I hope this changes and we use our TE"s.
 
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brutus2002;2360243; said:
I know Gardner will have a better line. Everyone knows when you lose your entire interior line and your backup Center your line gets better. I mean walk-on Centers that were 3rd/4th string the year before will be a ton better the following year. It's not like Center is an important position on an OL. I mean if he were the one to call out protections it would be one thing. Nah Glasgow will make Michigan's line much better. Gardner won't be touched.

I'm sure Gardner will have a much better running game as well because of the loss of those 3 starters and backups being gone. Touisaint will be a much better back after his broken leg. That always happens as well. RB's get broken legs and come back better. True Freshmen always come in and tear the world up. The automatically know how to pickup blitzes. Michigan couldn't run the ball from the RB position last year. It must have been the RB's on their roster or maybe it was the 3 starters that left fault they couldn't run the ball from the backfield.

I guess we shall see. I know I'm gonna be watching that CMU game. September Heisman's and NC's might be handed out again in AA.
Click to expand...

Mealer was the worst center in CFB last year, jack miller can't be any worse. This group is young, but they have a ton more talent.
 
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germ;2360244; said:
Sure Meyer could make it to 4, but he has to stay healthy.

As for the rest of your post is a lot of emotion, Michigan and OSU are destroying the other big ten schools in recruiting the past three years. Talking who's is better michigan vs OSU would be a fun debate. Will see how it plays out and should be fun.

No smack talk, just football debate. You have to get some perspective from others about your team, it's way to easy to drink the koolaid.

Gardner best WR was 5' 8'' gallon last year. Who's the kid from OSU who made that one handed catch last year? It's nice to have a WR like him to throw too, DG had nobody even close to that calibor last year. I think the two WR this year have the ability to make those type of catches. Will see.

TE has to be big this year, with DR michigan never seemed to attacked the seems with our TE's. I hope this changes and we use our TE"s.
Click to expand...

The problem is Michigan has 13 OL in the 2012-2014 classes...right? IIRC all but 2-3 are 4-5 star. The point I am trying to make is the majority of your highly rated player were OL. Eight of the 13 are gonna ride the pine. That's a lot of those stars and points doing you nothing on the bench...what else are they gonna do?

You guys lose both OT's after this season. That's gonna be another chink in your amour.

You lack skill position players to deny it is homerism. You lose Gallon and Dileo...like it or not those are your 2 best WR's.

Michigan will have almost 40 scholarship OL/DL on their roster. Wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy too many. Your team is unbalanced. Moving guys like Beyer to linebacker is not the smartest thing I have ever heard of. I can see moving people up...linebacker to DE...but never DE to LB'er. IMO that's very telling about the young linebackers development.

I like Funchess. IMO he is the biggest threat you guys have on offense.

Your RB's are average. We will see what Green and Smith do but you only have 2 RB's on your recruiting board with a pulse. Ballage and Hilliman...better hope Green and/or Smith pan out because you have some average backs in that stable by Michigans standards. If you whiff on Balage/Hilliman and nobody pans out...well you will have to wait till 2015 till a true frosh comes in and tries to carry the load. Norfleet will give you a presence on special teams so he is one RB that will contribute even if he is not toting the rock.

QB recruiting at Michigan has me scratching my head. Morris is a project. He may give you something down the road by a RS and maybe 1-2 more years before he is ready to contribute. Cleary...GMAB...Bellomy...GMAB. I have a buddy who coaches in the Alexandria VA area. He has seen Speight and cannot believe Michigan took his commitment so quickly. My buddy mentioned that he is not even in the top 5 in the VA/DC/MD area. He may pan out but once again I wouldn't expect much till 2016 even with him. QB is a huge void for Michigan. Gardner goes down and your season is over in 2013 and 2014 and too deny that is homerism.

Denard Robinson is a bigger loss than any Michigan fan wants to acknowledge. The pressure he put on defenses. The quick strike ability. One of the greatest offensive threat in NCAA history at the QB position...or just play homerun hitter. He's gone and nobody on your roster has his homerun ability. It's gonna hurt. You don't lose someone like him and just plug and play. Teams are gonna force you guys to throw the ball. If they don't need 8 guys to stop your run game you are in trouble.

Losing Jake Ryan is huge.

Losing Kovacs is huge.

I like Black and Clark on your DL but they are not world beaters as a group.

We will see if Countess comes back as good as he was before. He was solid...nothing more...nothing less.

Touisaint will not be 100%. They can coach speak all they want he will not be 100%...he was less than impressive last year anyways.

I see a 5 loss team including the bowl with Gardner healthy. If Gardner goes down for any length of time you miss a bowl game. Your schedule is harder than your fans want to admit. Iowa always gives you fits at their place and UCONN beat Louisville at their place. I think you lose to ND,@MSU, NEB, and OSU. @ Iowa, @UCONN, @NW, and @PSU should be interesting. I think Indiana and Minnesota will be better teams than they were a year ago.

We shall see what happens.
 
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brutus2002;2360275; said:
The problem is Michigan has 13 OL in the 2012-2014 classes...right? IIRC all but 2-3 are 4-5 star. The point I am trying to make is the majority of your highly rated player were OL. Eight of the 13 are gonna ride the pine. That's a lot of those stars and points doing you nothing on the bench...what else are they gonna do?

You guys lose both OT's after this season. That's gonna be another chink in your amour.

You lack skill position players to deny it is homerism. You lose Gallon and Dileo...like it or not those are your 2 best WR's.

Michigan will have almost 40 scholarship OL/DL on their roster. Wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy too many. Your team is unbalanced. Moving guys like Beyer to linebacker is not the smartest thing I have ever heard of. I can see moving people up...linebacker to DE...but never DE to LB'er. IMO that's very telling about the young linebackers development.

I like Funchess. IMO he is the biggest threat you guys have on offense.

Your RB's are average. We will see what Green and Smith do but you only have 2 RB's on your recruiting board with a pulse. Ballage and Hilliman...better hope Green and/or Smith pan out because you have some average backs in that stable by Michigans standards. If you whiff on Balage/Hilliman and nobody pans out...well you will have to wait till 2015 till a true frosh comes in and tries to carry the load. Norfleet will give you a presence on special teams so he is one RB that will contribute even if he is not toting the rock.

QB recruiting at Michigan has me scratching my head. Morris is a project. He may give you something down the road by a RS and maybe 1-2 more years before he is ready to contribute. Cleary...GMAB...Bellomy...GMAB. I have a buddy who coaches in the Alexandria VA area. He has seen Speight and cannot believe Michigan took his commitment so quickly. My buddy mentioned that he is not even in the top 5 in the VA/DC/MD area. He may pan out but once again I wouldn't expect much till 2016 even with him. QB is a huge void for Michigan. Gardner goes down and your season is over in 2013 and 2014 and too deny that is homerism.

Denard Robinson is a bigger loss than any Michigan fan wants to acknowledge. The pressure he put on defenses. The quick strike ability. One of the greatest offensive threat in NCAA history at the QB position...or just play homerun hitter. He's gone and nobody on your roster has his homerun ability. It's gonna hurt. You don't lose someone like him and just plug and play. Teams are gonna force you guys to throw the ball. If they don't need 8 guys to stop your run game you are in trouble.

Losing Jake Ryan is huge.

Losing Kovacs is huge.

I like Black and Clark on your DL but they are not world beaters as a group.

We will see if Countess comes back as good as he was before. He was solid...nothing more...nothing less.

Touisaint will not be 100%. They can coach speak all they want he will not be 100%...he was less than impressive last year anyways.

I see a 5 loss team including the bowl with Gardner healthy. If Gardner goes down for any length of time you miss a bowl game. Your schedule is harder than your fans want to admit. Iowa always gives you fits at their place and UCONN beat Louisville at their place. I think you lose to ND,@MSU, NEB, and OSU. @ Iowa, @UCONN, @NW, and @PSU should be interesting. I think Indiana and Minnesota will be better teams than they were a year ago.

We shall see what happens.
Click to expand...

Good stuff, but lets look at it from another view

Yes we have a lot of talented OL, I have to tell you that does not suck. Being when Hoke took over we had 8 scholarship OL on the roster, we now have 16. Which happens to be the same number Bama has at OL. Having players push each other for starting spots is a good thing, I have always liked the OSU saying, we don't rebuild, we reload. Well for the first time in 4 years we have some ammo at OL.

As for RB it's tough to say, our OL was so bad last year and the fact Denard could not throw defense just stacked the line. When Devin took over things loosened up a bit. If Devin can stretch the defense a bit, I believe Michigan can and will run the ball.

If DG goes down we're screwed, but he does have some WR to throw too this year. Chesson and Darboh appear to be playing well, will see how it pans out come game time. Also I like Dukes, I think he can be a great possession WR for us this year. I hope to see Gallon in the slot more this year, the kid is 5' 8'', but he makes plays.

Denard will be missed, no argument here.

Ryan is huge, but it's looking like he'll be back in Oct.

Kovacs is huge also, I think the biggest lost on defense from a leadership standpoint.

Here is where I see the difference with Hoke, he is building this team in the trenches. He wants the best OL and DL guys on Michigan. I refer to it as building a team from the inside out. You get the OL and DL line set and then build your skilled players around your OL and DL. I happen to have liked RR, but he built teams from the outside in. He got all his skilled guys and build the OL around what the skilled players could do. I have no idea which works better, but I believe Hokes teams will be more competitive. RR issue was he never had his DC, which is Michigan's fault for not paying the extra 10 grand when they hired RR.

DG has already graduated, he finished in 3 years, he's a smart kid who played behind DR for his first three years. I just think he's going to surprise a few people this year and he's a good kid. Let's not lose sight he is a good kid and represents the Big Ten well with class.
 
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Sat., Aug. 31 vs. Central Michigan Michigan Stadium 3:30 p.m. ET
Sat., Sep. 7 vs. Notre Dame Michigan Stadium 8:00 p.m. ET
Sat., Sep. 14 vs. Akron Michigan Stadium 12:00 p.m. ET
Sat., Sep. 21 at Connecticut East Hartford, Conn. TBA
Sat., Oct. 5 vs. Minnesota - Homecoming * Michigan Stadium 3:30 p.m. ET
Sat., Oct. 12 at Penn State * State College, Pa. 5:00 p.m. ET
Sat., Oct. 19 vs. Indiana * Michigan Stadium 3:30 p.m. ET
Sat., Nov. 2 at Michigan State * East Lansing, Mich. TBA
Sat., Nov. 9 vs. Nebraska * Michigan Stadium TBA
Sat., Nov. 16 at Northwestern * Evanston, Ill. TBA
Sat., Nov. 23 at Iowa * Iowa City, Iowa TBA
Sat., Nov. 30 vs. Ohio State * Michigan Stadium T

I personally like what I see in Gardner. Yeah, he struggled against good teams, guess what? So did Brax. I personally think Michigan will be better than most OSU fans expect.

Second game will tell most of the story. If Gholston were back I'd be writing the wolverines off, but no Gholston and a game in AA makes it a toss up at the very least, probably a W.

Who knows what Penn State will be like this year and this is their bowl game until they go to Ireland. Tougher call than Michigan expects, but 4th quarter, no depth, new QB and half the stadium looking for the ghost of JoePa sounds like 4th quarter blues.

Then comes the trip to East Lansing. Word is that the Spartans actually have a QB this year. I'll believe it when I see it. Really need to see how both teams perform against the Irish before making a call.

Which brings us to Nebraska and the question about a QB comes to the fore again. Is Martinez finally going to look like something more than single wing tail back? I doubt it.

Northwestern, geez, who knows. I really admire Fitzgerald as a coach giving back to his school, but they have a tough time in the 4th quarter even when they have the lead.

Finally, they get the Bucks at home. Assuming Urban has found some DEs and an extra LB or three to give Shazier some help by the end of the season, I think the bucks take 'em.

I'm sure there's at least two losses in the mix, maybe even 3, but a 9 - 3 Michigan team wouldn't surprise me. And a win over Michigan is always sweet, but a win in Ann Arbor is so much sweeter.
 
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As for RB let me throw this name out

Wyatt Shallman I think he may surprise a few people.

Michigan could put

Wyatt Shallman 245 lb and Green at 220 is a big backfield. Word on the street is they are going to play Wyatt at TB.

If anything they should block a bit better than 5' 6'' VS.
 
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germ;2360356; said:
Good stuff, but lets look at it from another view

Yes we have a lot of talented OL, I have to tell you that does not suck. Being when Hoke took over we had 8 scholarship OL on the roster, we now have 16. Which happens to be the same number Bama has at OL. Having players push each other for starting spots is a good thing, I have always liked the OSU saying, we don't rebuild, we reload. Well for the first time in 4 years we have some ammo at OL.

As for RB it's tough to say, our OL was so bad last year and the fact Denard could not throw defense just stacked the line. When Devin took over things loosened up a bit. If Devin can stretch the defense a bit, I believe Michigan can and will run the ball.

If DG goes down we're screwed, but he does have some WR to throw too this year. Chesson and Darboh appear to be playing well, will see how it pans out come game time. Also I like Dukes, I think he can be a great possession WR for us this year. I hope to see Gallon in the slot more this year, the kid is 5' 8'', but he makes plays.

Denard will be missed, no argument here.

Ryan is huge, but it's looking like he'll be back in Oct.

Kovacs is huge also, I think the biggest lost on defense from a leadership standpoint.

Here is where I see the difference with Hoke, he is building this team in the trenches. He wants the best OL and DL guys on Michigan. I refer to it as building a team from the inside out. You get the OL and DL line set and then build your skilled players around your OL and DL. I happen to have liked RR, but he built teams from the outside in. He got all his skilled guys and build the OL around what the skilled players could do. I have no idea which works better, but I believe Hokes teams will be more competitive. RR issue was he never had his DC, which is Michigan's fault for not paying the extra 10 grand when they hired RR.

DG has already graduated, he finished in 3 years, he's a smart kid who played behind DR for his first three years. I just think he's going to surprise a few people this year and he's a good kid. Let's not lose sight he is a good kid and represents the Big Ten well with class.
Click to expand...

Norfleet has been moved to slot WR. That's definitely a position change. I guess there are 3 glaring problems with Michigan that I see.

#1 is your QB recruiting. I think this will cost you dearly in the near future. I thought last year you guys should have taken 2 QB's and IMO I will end up being right. IMO you put all of your eggs in the Shane Morris basket. Cleary and Bellomy may end up being decent...being decent isn't gonna get Michigan a B10 champions, beat OSU, or win a NC. Taking Speight so early was a shocker. Michigan must have liked what they saw. Once again I don't understand why Michigan doesn't take another QB. It has me scratching my head. If there is one position Michigan has to hit a grand slam in the 15' recruiting class it's QB...they have to get a stud...I'd take 2.

#2 is playmakers. Derrick Green and Devon Smith might be good players but they are not homerun hitters. They are grinders. Harris is the best WR prospect in Hokes 3 recruiting classes. Michigan used to get 1-2 kids his caliber every year. It's a huge void. Peppers is gonna play safety...might even grow into OLB. If I were Michigan I would try him at RB. Once again decent/good playmakers will not win you B10 or NC's...definitely will not beat us. You need elite talent all over the field to go against the defense we are assembling. I don't see it. Ways, Hesson, Darboh, Dukes, Canteen...probably solid but nothing special.

#3 your back 7 on defense. Please have Beyer check Marcus Baugh or one of our TE's when we play...pretty please. Douglas, Thomas, Peppers, and the rest might be good but the overall speed and skill is not there to stop us. I think you'll be fine at safety but you better start getting elite corners and linebackers that are good in coverage. The offense we will be running require elite linebackers and corners to stop. The back 7 is key. Like I said you might have some spots that are fine but your only as good as you weakest links. I give Mattison credit. He covered up a mediocre secondary by pressuring QB's...

I think your linemen will get back to typical Michigan talent/standards but it's gonna take more than that to compete with us/other elite schools.

I think your 2015 class has to address the back 7 speed issue/CB talent, skill position upgrade, and QB recruiting. The QB recruiting is the most important IMO.
 
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germ;2360356; said:
Good stuff, but lets look at it from another view

Yes we have a lot of talented OL, I have to tell you that does not suck. Being when Hoke took over we had 8 scholarship OL on the roster, we now have 16. Which happens to be the same number Bama has at OL. Having players push each other for starting spots is a good thing, I have always liked the OSU saying, we don't rebuild, we reload. Well for the first time in 4 years we have some ammo at OL.

As for RB it's tough to say, our OL was so bad last year and the fact Denard could not throw defense just stacked the line. When Devin took over things loosened up a bit. If Devin can stretch the defense a bit, I believe Michigan can and will run the ball.
Click to expand...

So you reload a [Mark May]ty OL?

Or the [Mark May]ty OL from last year couldn't possibly be as bad this year because the second team guys from last year, who rode the pine, are a step up this year? Or the new guys from this class will dominate from the get-go?

1243233539327.jpg
 
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#1 is your QB recruiting. I think this will cost you dearly in the near future. I thought last year you guys should have taken 2 QB's and IMO I will end up being right. IMO you put all of your eggs in the Shane Morris basket. Cleary and Bellomy may end up being decent...being decent isn't gonna get Michigan a B10 champions, beat OSU, or win a NC. Taking Speight so early was a shocker. Michigan must have liked what they saw. Once again I don't understand why Michigan doesn't take another QB. It has me scratching my head. If there is one position Michigan has to hit a grand slam in the 15' recruiting class it's QB...they have to get a stud...I'd take 2.
Click to expand...

I agree 100%

WR we will see
 
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