College Playoff

[Jake]

There's no reason to come up with a complete overhaul of the system because if we ever get a playoff it won't happen that way, anyhow.

Keep it simple. There is a rankings system in place. Use it. The top 8 teams in the final BCS standings duke it out on the field, not the ballot box.

Sugar
1 LSU
vs
8 Kansas State

Rose
4 Stanford
vs
5 Oregon

Orange
2 Alabama
vs
7 Boise State

Fiesta
3 Oklahoma State
vs
6 Arkansas

Not perfect by any means, but it's a start. The semi finals would be home games. The highest remaining seed would host the lowest remaining seed. The championship game would be a neutral site game, as it is now. Of course, this will NEVER happen either because it doesn't make sure every BCS conference gets a piece of the pie.

Plans that propose all kinds of convoluted changes will never get off the ground no matter how much I might agree with some of them. The morons created a rankings system. Challenge them to actually use it.

 

[buckeyesin07]

There's no reason to come up with a complete overhaul of the system because if we ever get a playoff it won't happen that way, anyhow.

Keep it simple. There is a rankings system in place. Use it. The top 8 teams in the final BCS standings duke it out on the field, not the ballot box.

Sugar
1 LSU
vs
8 Kansas State

Rose
4 Stanford
vs
5 Oregon

Orange
2 Alabama
vs
7 Boise State

Fiesta
3 Oklahoma State
vs
6 Arkansas

Not perfect by any means, but it's a start.

The semi finals would be home games. The highest remaining seed would host the lowest remaining seed. The championship game would be a neutral site game, as it is now.

Again, not perfect, but a good first step. Plans that propose all kinds of convoluted changes will never get off the ground no matter how much I might agree with some of them.

Wouldn't teams still be fighting at the ballot box under your system to claim they belong in the top 8? That's why I'm in favor of winning your conference to get in. Take subjectivity out of it.

 

[Mariotwins]

Wouldn't teams still be fighting at the ballot box under your system to claim they belong in the top 8? That's why I'm in favor of winning your conference to get in. Take subjectivity out of it.

So Champions of the B1G, SEC, BIG12, PAC12, ACC, BIG East all get one team in and the 3-6 seeds all have to play a 3rd game? And Leave the other Weak Conferences to Bitch and Moan?

 

[WyoBuck]

So Champions of the B1G, SEC, BIG12, PAC12, ACC, BIG East all get one team in and the 3-6 seeds all have to play a 3rd game? And Leave the other Weak Conferences to Bitch and Moan?

Well If you were going to use the polls you could take it a step further and make a 16 team playoff, All of the playoff champions get in to the playoffs and are seeded according to their BCS ranking. That would put in 11 teams, then you would have 5 at large bids that would all get selected and seeded according to their standings in the poll, but I would include a caveat that no conference can send more than 2 teams to the playoffs and you have to finish at least 2nd in your conference to be considered. Also, if an at large team is ranked higher than a conference champion, they get a higher seeding. You could still have all of the games through the semifinals at all of the traditional bowl sites, then go with what Jake said. This way, you are still not changing too much and no one has a reason to bitch cause everyone has a shot to get in as long as you are ranked and finish 1 or 2 in your conference. Again, not perfect. I should point out, though, that Im not a fan of a playoff system.

 

[buckeyegrad]

The BCS would be a great system if every year ended with two undefeated teams but unfortunately that doesn't happen. The national championship shouldn't be based on bias polls and computers. Now a playoff system is far from perfect but at least it let's the teams settle it on the field and creates far less controversy.

This is a good point. For this year, the reality is that we do not need a playoff, a national championship game, or even a series of bowl games to determine who is the best team and most deserving of a national title. Is there anyone who would argue against LSU being #1 this year as all things stand? Too bad in years like this, we can't just name the champion before the bowl games.

 

[buckeyegrad]

If we do see further conference realignment and the collapse of the Big 12 in football, is there anyone who thinks taking the four conference champions of the ACC, SEC, B1G, and PAC and placing them in a four-team playoff would be a bad idea?

Seems like this is the best possible solution to all things. If you disagree, what are your reasons?

 

[jwinslow]

If we do see further conference realignment and the collapse of the Big 12 in football, is there anyone who thinks taking the four conference champions of the ACC, SEC, B1G, and PAC and placing them in a four-team playoff would be a bad idea?

Seems like this is the best possible solution to all things. If you disagree, what are your reasons?

which may coincide with an eventual departure from the NCAA as a governing body. They are so archaic, inconsistent and backwards that they are a disservice to every type of program, compliant, rogue or somewhere inbetween.

 

[jwinslow]

Well If you were going to use the polls you could take it a step further and make a 16 team playoff, All of the playoff champions get in to the playoffs and are seeded according to their BCS ranking. That would put in 11 teams, then you would have 5 at large bids that would all get selected and seeded according to their standings in the poll, but I would include a caveat that no conference can send more than 2 teams to the playoffs and you have to finish at least 2nd in your conference to be considered. Also, if an at large team is ranked higher than a conference champion, they get a higher seeding. You could still have all of the games through the semifinals at all of the traditional bowl sites, then go with what Jake said. This way, you are still not changing too much and no one has a reason to bitch cause everyone has a shot to get in as long as you are ranked and finish 1 or 2 in your conference. Again, not perfect. I should point out, though, that Im not a fan of a playoff system.

sixteen lets in so much garbage and it ruins the rest of the bowls.

Eight essential keeps the same structure that we have now, or did before the fifth BCS bowl, and keeps the other bowls interesting with good teams.

Four would be fine with super conferences, but would sacrifice too much money since you can't really have two other elite bowls if they're not part of the playoff.


now people will actually watch a boring ACC champ in their fiesta bowl, because they'll probably be playing a higher seeded LSU or OSU in round 1, then they suddenly become compelling if they win, as a David beat Goliath story, instead of a Virginia Tech beat Houston BCS snoozer.

 

[zincfinger]

If we do see further conference realignment and the collapse of the Big 12 in football, is there anyone who thinks taking the four conference champions of the ACC, SEC, B1G, and PAC and placing them in a four-team playoff would be a bad idea?

Seems like this is the best possible solution to all things. If you disagree, what are your reasons?

http://www.buckeyeplanet.com/forum/college-football/404-college-playoff-77.html#post2057772

 

[buckeyegrad]

http://www.buckeyeplanet.com/forum/college-football/404-college-playoff-77.html#post2057772

So, you wouldn't have a problem with it since your post on that page says that if a playoff would occur it would have to be under this situation. Right?

 

[HorseshoeFetish]

sixteen lets in so much garbage and it ruins the rest of the bowls.


Four would be fine with super conferences, but would sacrifice too much money since you can't really have two other elite bowls if they're not part of the playoff.

I'd much rather have 5 or 6 semi super conferences than 4 super conferences. How on earth can you even determine who would be conference champion in that time? You'd have to do away with non conference play. You might even have to do away with rivalry games. I can tell ya I'd be done with ending my regular season playing them.
If we weren't both in the conference championship then we don't play at all. scum that is.

 

[jwinslow]

I'd much rather have 5 or 6 semi super conferences than 4 super conferences. How on earth can you even determine who would be conference champion in that time?

You could have a Sun Belt (west) & Big East (east) add-on to the big four, with two at large teams, which would create headaches but less than 3-4 would.

If the B1G gets ND & Kansas, they could put them in the west, move the Indiana teams over, and bring the Michigan teams back where they belong.

 

[BigJim]

And now we move to the math portion of the issue, because here is where the playoff argument breaks down.

Let us say we were to pit a superior team against a "worthy opponent" and that said superior team was so good they would win 8 out of 10 times. That is pretty superior. 80% gets you 13 wins in the NFL and 130 win in MLB. Pretty impressive. Clearly deserving of a shot at the title.

Put that superior team in a NC game and they will probably win. As stated, 80% chance. But ask that team to play in a 4 game playoff and the chance they will come out on top drops to 64%. Make it 8 teams and we are right around 50%. Welcome Florida Marlins and New York Giants. So the more teams you add doesn't increase the chances of crowning the right princess. Rather it introduces a level of randomness that I am not a fan of.

So lets assume, as you state, that the goal is to give the best team in the country the best shot at coming out as the champion. Debateable, but seems fair to me and I personally agree.

Your math equation is missing a hugely important variable that imo balances out your issue, probably even swaying it toward mathematically favoring a playoff (given the above goal). In an average year (obviously this year is different), we will not be 100% certain that the best team is in the top two teams. It is reasonable imo to say, in an average year, the chances that the top 4 teams are most deserving of being the champion are something like:
#1 50%
#2 30%
#3 18%
#4 2%

Sticking with the 80% win% stat, it would only take a 20% chance that the best team in the country is not in the top two teams for a 4-team playoff to be exactly equivalent mathematically to a single game championship.

 

[BB73]

As they say beauty is in the eye of the beholder, and the wonder bra makes things seem larger than they appear. And I say bias runs rampant in college football. As I said I probably agree that LSU is the best team in the nation..right now. My problem is next year. Where and when will the bias start? Before anyone has ever played a down. With the meaningless yet all too important preseason poll. This is the biggest reason I feel there needs to be seperate polls. One for the BIG and whatever conferences..and one for the sec and whatever conferences. I have no doubt that LSU and Alabama will start off next year in the top 5. Does anyone doubt it? I've been known to make a bet or two in my day and I'd be willing to bet that Washington is in the top 25 on Sept 8th next year. Have you seen the LSU schedule? I am also willing to bet they will be 5-0 to start next year. And in doing so will be talked about how awesome they are and that the train just keeps rollin in baton rouge. Does anyone know why the bulk of the schedule in the SEC has not been revealed as of yet? Fact is neither do I. It makes me wonder though if it has something to do with how best to help the top teams in the SEC. Of course the pac and the small12 are the same way. The BIG is the only conference that has most of if not all of their games already posted. Why do SEC teams seem to schedule an out of conference sacrificial lamb towards the end of the season? This is where I think the SEC out does the BIG. This year isn't a good example and hopefully next year won't be for a different reason all together. Wouldn't it be beneficial for us to have a cupcake between PSU and tsun? I mean heaven forbid we ever again lose to either of these teams in the same season again but wouldn't that buffer victory look better in the pollsters eyes? Not so much for the buckeyes mind you but both PSU and tsun. Sure we might drop after the PSU loss but a win against a cuppie and a loss by a team higher than us brings us back up in the standings before the tsun game, hence better for tsun. Now if that seems off topic I apoligize but my point is that while you can say LSU is the best team right now, this year whatever, the fact remains that bama lost to them..and then scheduled georgia southern as a game to keep them from a possible 2nd loss in a row not to mention a breather before auburn. I figure at this point I'm either out of my mind, or I'm on to something. Either way I think that the BIG needs to start scheduling the same way asap. What does all of this have to do with a playoff you might ask. I'll say it now..An 11-1 BIG team is in the same boat as oOSU or an undefeated Boise St. team we are on the outside looking in at this point in time. And I'll ask again..If TOSU, Tex, ND, Oregon, maybe a Miami or FSU, and LSU or BAMA or Georgia all go undefeated in a single season what do you think our chances of playing for the NC game will be? I'm saying 20% and that went up because of Coach Meyer. Is it probable that all of these teams go undefeated..I'll say no..But it is possible and under the current way of doing things there is no good way for it to end.

http://www.fbschedules.com/

Somewhere in that wall of text is a comment about the preseason polls having too much influence on the BCS outcome. The effect of the preseason polls is vastly overrated - teams end up very close to where they deserve to be regardless of their preseason ranking. 2002 tOSU started 13th, 2010 Auburn started #22, 2008 Florida was #11 in early October. The reason so many teams that start high also end high is that they're very good teams. If teams that high lose a couple of games, they drop.

The difference between Okla St and Alabama this year is that Alabama lost at home to the #1 team, and Okla St lost on the road to a 6-6 team. Okla St also lost later in the year (when they controlled their own destiny), which dropped them below Stanford and Va Tech, and that distance to make up was partially why they didn't jump Bama in the human polls, along with the ESPN/CBS hype machines. Their preseason ranking didn't hurt them, they were up to #2 when they played Iowa State, and that's exactly where they belonged at the time, since LSU deserved #1.

Also, there's a question about why the SEC hasn't yet released their schedules. Well, they recently added aTm, and then Missouri, and the 14-team league is causing them to re-work those schedules. And since they have non-conference games spread throughout the year, it makes it much more difficult to re-work those schedules, as non-conference opponents may have to be contacted in order to shift some games.

 

[jwinslow]

My BCS playoff proposal:

I'd love to see them rotate the five bowls on the left & right, so that every NC run had to go through real football weather in Chicago & NYC, but they'd probably have to rotate all seven to appease everyone.

Wind - Chicago
Apple - NYC
Cowboy - Dallas

- Add three more BCS-level games, 3 more towns, and involve actual weather
- Create viewer interest for lower seeded teams (no more Pitt vs Utah snoozers)
- Preserve non-BCS bowl system & intrigue
- Return 2 former at-large teams to the bowl pool who really aren't BCS caliber teams (ie UM, VT)