Cavs 08-09 Season - Central Div Champs (official thread)

[OH10]

Blow up a 66 win team? I think that might be a bit of an overreaction. This team is close. It just needs to add a player or two.

Andy is probably gone. If the Cavs overpay for him, I'll be a little pissed. Ben Wallace is probably gone. Wally is gone. Sasha barely plays. Joe Smith is gone. Boobie is a nice role player, but we already have two shrimps on the perimeter in Mo and Delonte and Gibson was barely essential to anything.

Work with Mo, Delonte and JJ Hickson. But a lot of those guys are already gone or are going to be gone. It has to be blown up in some respects. I would love to get Z off the books at this point with his deteriorating skill-set.

 

[NFBuck]

You want to pay Andy 10 mil/yr?

Not at that price, no. If somebody's willing to pay him $10M a year, then you let him go.

If we could somehow convince someone to take Z's expiring deal, you wouldn't want him off the books at 10 mil/yr? Neither one of those guys is essential to this team at those prices.

Maybe. Z's the perfect team guy and has done right by the Cavs his whole career. You take care of a guy like that, plus he's still an effective offensive player (though ideally in he's limited to about 20-24 MPG). If his name would come up in a trade that could bring in a big time player, then yes, explore it.

I'm just saying "blowing up" this team is a little harsh and not necessary at all. That makes it sound like they're far away from a championship, which I think is far from true.

 

[Mike80]

Z is a backup at this point in his career. His body is going to break down further.

Cleveland should have some cap room to play with this year.

Invest in a legit #1 big guy and find some good role players who can knock down a jumper all day long.

 

[NFBuck]

Z is a backup at this point in his career. His body is going to break down further.

Cleveland should have some cap room to play with this year.

Invest in a legit #1 big guy and find some good role players who can knock down a jumper all day long.

Agreed on Z being limited now, but he's still an effective scorer and an asset if he can be limited minutes-wise.

That they do, the question is, do you go for it this year or in '10? It's going to be an interesting offseason. I'd love to be able to get a Bosh type player, but I don't know if it's necessary just yet (or feasible). This current team has great chemistry, how much do you want to mess with that? If they add a good post defender and a few other pieces to hopefully replace Pavs and Wally, I think they're right back in it next season. if that doesn't pay off, you go for broke in '10.

People have different philosophies and what you want depends on that. I trust Ferry is developing a plan and will do what's necessary to bring this team a title.

 

[OH10]

Not at that price, no. If somebody's willing to pay him $10M a year, then you let him go.

This is the NBA. Some stupid GM will pay him what he wants.

Maybe. Z's the perfect team guy and has done right by the Cavs his whole career. You take care of a guy like that, plus he's still an effective offensive player (though ideally in he's limited to about 20-24 MPG). If his name would come up in a trade that could bring in a big time player, then yes, explore it.

The Z thing is tough. But he's not a starter and he's making sidekick money. It's a terrible deal for the Cavs. He's a true Cav and I wanted to see him win a title more than anyone else on that team. But he makes too much and produces too little.

I'm just saying "blowing up" this team is a little harsh and not necessary at all. That makes it sound like they're far away from a championship, which I think is far from true.

I think when you really look at this team, the meat is limited to Mo, Delonte and King James. Everyone else truly is expendable for the right price.

 

[NFBuck]

The Z thing is tough. But he's not a starter and he's making sidekick money. It's a terrible deal for the Cavs. He's a true Cav and I wanted to see him win a title more than anyone else on that team. But he makes too much and produces too little.

Agreed, and maybe I'm a little sentimental towards him, but I still think he's an asset to the team, even at his current salary. The Cavs have wiggle room cap-wise, so his salary isn't hurting that much. Every team has players that are way overpaid, at least Z still provides something. He's old and slow, but he still has a good 15-18 foot jumper that draws guys out of the paint.

I didn't expect much to happen last offseason and Ferry went out and traded for an all-star. It wouldn't shock me if he did something like that again...maybe even on a larger scale. I just won't be upset if a blockbuster doesn't go down.

 

[purplehaze1213]

This current team has great chemistry, how much do you want to mess with that?

Well I think that these playoffs showed us that chemistry can only take a team so far. If I remember correctly, one of the reasons that Ferry turned down the deal for Shaq was because he felt it would mess with team chemistry. Well the Cavs may have kept their chemistry but they lost out on a player to stop Howard (which Shaq may have been able to do). Talent trumps chemistry in my opinion, and this team could use a talent upgrade even if it means breaking up their chemistry.

 

[OState29]

This is the NBA. Some stupid GM will pay him what he wants.

This is a recession, Andy is not an all star, he's not getting 10 mil.

 

[billmac91]

a bit risky, but I'd love to see the Cavs take a look at Rasheed Wallace. I think a starting 5 of Sheed, Anderson, LeBron, West, and Williams is a major upgrade over Z.

Keep Z as a back-up to Sheed, and let them spell each-other. JJ continues to develp behind Anderson. Sheed is a solid defender, and although his attitude and penchant for bitching is annoying, he is tough as nails. He would have bodied up Howard a hell of a lot more than Z. Z and Sheed could essentially split minutes in the regular season, and let Sheed get the meat in th eplayoffs, hopefully well rested. Z is a VERY GOOD regular season player, but when everyone else picks it up a notch for playoff basketball, Z just doesn't have another gear. It has happened 3 years in a row.

 

[tsteele316]

a few points about the last several posts here:

1. cleveland does not have any cap room to play with. they have their mid-level exception and biennial exception and that is it. it doesn't matter how many potential guys come off the books. cleveland is $32 million over the cap right now.

2. Z is not a valuable trading chip right now, and probably won't be, unless its a trade deadline deal to a team looking for a salary dump.

3. AV turned down $6.2 million this year. He's not going to settle for much less than $8-$9 million per. Recall how well things went with dickhead Feagan last time. LBJ may like AV, but he's going to run himself out of town.

 

[NFBuck]

1. cleveland does not have any cap room to play with. they have their mid-level exception and biennial exception and that is it. it doesn't matter how many potential guys come off the books. cleveland is $32 million over the cap right now.

What does Wallace's salary potentially do if he does retire? I'll admit to not being totally up on the salary cap rules...I was under the impression there was some wiggle room with him possibly taking a buyout/retirement. Maybe I was misinformed.

2. Z is not a valuable trading chip right now, and probably won't be, unless its a trade deadline deal to a team looking for a salary dump.

Agreed.

3. AV turned down $6.2 million this year. He's not going to settle for much less than $8-$9 million per. Recall how well things went with dickhead Feagan last time. LBJ may like AV, but he's going to run himself out of town.

Which sucks because his offensive game really took a step forward in the post season IMO and energy guys like him are great to have.

 

[crazybuckfan40]

I give AV 8-9 or so...

Outside of Mo and LBJ he is the most important piece IMHO...He continues to develop that jump shot, he does all the dirty work, and I honestly think eventually he could end up playing alongside a guy like Bosh/another PF and be able to play at the C position, or if we go small with LBJ at the four...

I would like to upgrade and get an athletic 3/4 that can stretch the D, and put the ball on the floor...This would allow us to go athletic with Mo/West/athletic 3/4/LBJ/Andy...

We also need to find a way to get some bench scorers to where LBJ can afford to go to the bench for at least 8 minutes or so, and even in close games...and Mike Brown needs to use the end of 1st and 3rd quarters like Phil did with Jordan and does with Kobe...

That is if he is still here...Even after his coach of the year season I would still axe him...

 

[jlb1705]

a bit risky, but I'd love to see the Cavs take a look at Rasheed Wallace. I think a starting 5 of Sheed, Anderson, LeBron, West, and Williams is a major upgrade over Z.

Keep Z as a back-up to Sheed, and let them spell each-other. JJ continues to develp behind Anderson. Sheed is a solid defender, and although his attitude and penchant for bitching is annoying, he is tough as nails. He would have bodied up Howard a hell of a lot more than Z. Z and Sheed could essentially split minutes in the regular season, and let Sheed get the meat in th eplayoffs, hopefully well rested. Z is a VERY GOOD regular season player, but when everyone else picks it up a notch for playoff basketball, Z just doesn't have another gear. It has happened 3 years in a row.

If the Cavs got Sheed then when they face Orlando next year they could just skip the basketball and go directly to a best of seven contest of wild elbows and hissy fits between him and Dwight Howard. That might be as entertaining as they thought a LeBron-Kobe matchup would be.

 

[OState29]

I give AV 8-9 or so...

Outside of Mo and LBJ he is the most important piece IMHO...He continues to develop that jump shot, he does all the dirty work, and I honestly think eventually he could end up playing alongside a guy like Bosh/another PF and be able to play at the C position, or if we go small with LBJ at the four...

I would like to upgrade and get an athletic 3/4 that can stretch the D, and put the ball on the floor...This would allow us to go athletic with Mo/West/athletic 3/4/LBJ/Andy...

We also need to find a way to get some bench scorers to where LBJ can afford to go to the bench for at least 8 minutes or so, and even in close games...and Mike Brown needs to use the end of 1st and 3rd quarters like Phil did with Jordan and does with Kobe...

That is if he is still here...Even after his coach of the year season I would still axe him...

Completely agree, especially the bold. He's a great deffensive coordinator, little more. He never seems to get upset with how they play, but rather just gives the other team credit, a coach shouldn't accept losses, their job is to win. Bring back Fratello or pick up Jeff Van Gundy. I'm sure they could find some plays for crunch time other than "LeBron, make something happen." They would also help in his developement of his low post game and use of the pick. I bet they would be better with matchups, and rotations (that inconsistancy would piss me off as a player) as well.

 

[purplehaze1213]

Completely agree, especially the bold. He's a great deffensive coordinator, little more. He never seems to get upset with how they play, but rather just gives the other team credit, a coach shouldn't accept losses, their job is to win. Bring back Fratello or pick up Jeff Van Gundy. I'm sure they could find some plays for crunch time other than "LeBron, make something happen." They would also help in his developement of his low post game and use of the pick. I bet they would be better with matchups, and rotations (that inconsistancy would piss me off as a player) as well.

I agree with this. However, there's no way the Cavs are going to fire him the year before LeBron hits the market. That just sends all the wrong signals about the stability of the organization and the direction that it's heading in.