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Buckeye Defense - 2004 (official thread)

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Say what you want about Dustin Fox's coverage abilities.... but he plays the screen pass better than most any corner I've watched lately. He's a sure tackler, he avoids the blocks pretty well. It's obvious we've really missed him on D.
 
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I hate to harp on this, but I think the youth of the defense and the coordinator is the cause for most of these problems.

The 2001 defense was just as bad, having parts in losses to 2 sub-500 teams. The next year, it led the Buckeyes to the title. Same players, same coach, more experience. D'Antonio was a rookie (1-A) DC with a bunch of young, talented players. Scott, Peterson, Smith, and Anderson had their growing pains too.

We're in the same situation this year with a young defense and a rookie DC in Snyder. Who's to say they won't make a similar leap in 2005. Heck, we don't even know if this unit is as bad as the 2001, 7-5 one.
 
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Our D really disappointed me. Like everybody's saying, we can't rely on them to win every game, but they sure didn't look right.

Somebody mentioned the pass defense- zone vs. man/bump & run. If this has been hashed out already, sorry, but I don't understand why we stick to a zone all the time when teams like this use it against us and kill us with short passes to eat up yardage. We give away 8-10 yds every time they throw the ball, and the way we've been missing tackles lately, the idea of closing quickly and stopping a big gain isn't working. Any ideas why we don't play more man?

With that plan, Purdue will eat us for lunch.
 
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Debuckeye/Buckeye fans

I'm with you Debuckeye I have no clue why we don't play more man? I think Snyder is trying to immulate what Dantonio did by "not getting beat deep" and living to play another down. Well thats fine if we can get enormous pressure and stop the run with just our front 4. With a zone coverage it totally depends on how good your lineman are, and right now we don't have that gift. So with some man it compensates for blitzing and with that we'd get alot of pressure considering the talent at Linebacker. I don't understand? Why not use this for a change of plan? Again, How many teams have gone deep on us over the years besides Wisconsin on the Lee Evans play? I don't recall any time where a team just took a shot deep? So my question is why are we so worried about getting beat deep if a team hasn't/won't try for the homerun in the first place. Its called taking what the defense gives you, and they have taken that phrase to a new meaning this year. Next year, Yeah it will most likly work with experience with our D-Line but this year we need to use our speed better. I just don't see where we take advantage of our speed?

My solution- (and tell me what you honestly think)

I think we need to totally destroy between the tackles with blitzes to make the running backs go wide on our defense and take the middle of the field away from there game plan.(which no one can still do). Doing this would make them play against our speed. Right now I don't see a problem with our linebackers so thats fine. However, I'd like to see them put pressure from the outside on 3rd down. In doing so it would force them to dump the ball of VERY quick and once again playing right into the speed factor. Now I know, what about when they did throw it quick on the screen routes? Yes well that brings me to my next point. When we blitz guys what does that tell us about what they'll do? They'll get rid of it quick. If we just switch it up alittle and play like 40% man coverage that will put our DB's right in the recievers face making him make a play on 3rd down, and I like our chances with the other teams Wr's trying to make plays against our Db's. Again this is where our speed comes into play. So what I'm basically getting at is take away the middle on the running game, Blitz outside on 3rd down, and play man coverage mixed in with Zone. We were very predictable last night IMO. Seriously what do you think they wouldv'e done if they come out on 3rd down and they are think'n hell yeah we'll jus throw that hitch for 11 yards and then the play starts and our recievers are jamming them and they can't make the play. What do you think they'd do? I don't know what they'd do because the pressure would be crazy good and again it would force them to MAKE plays, and I don't see that happening on any OSU defense thats this good.


GO BUCKS!!
 
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The defense of any team is entirely dependent on their front four. And we only have one, Simon Fraser. Without being able to stop the run, or get any type of pressure on the QB whatsoever, a defense is in trouble. Our D line appears to be completely ineffective, which ruins the scheme Snyder has in place. As such, without some major changes, this season might as well be over. If we play this same scheme, we will lose at least 2 more games this year, and maybe 4. Purdue and miSHITgan will take us apart. Either the coach needs to change his scheme, or the execution of the players needs to drastically improve. Drastically.
 
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I totally agree. I think we need to maybe no change our scheme but tweek it. We have to bring pressure and we have to use our speed to advantage and play up and just take some chances!! if they get behind us I have confidence that Ej or Fox for that matter can run them down and get to them. I wish they'd do it, but well they're the coaches and most likly they'll do the same things they've been do'n for the past 3 years. Even though we really can't with what we have to play with.
 
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They are not playing man defense because either the Coaches or the players themselves (the previous is my guess though) are not totally confident that these new/young Db's can stack up or man to man or have enough experience yet. Thats also why they are playing zone at this point. If you remember in OSU history we have run man to man when we have experienced and great Db's like Shuan Springs or other greats that were veterans and could handle being out there all by themselves with no help. Some of these Db's are still young and green themselves.
 
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Nah, they aren't playing man D because then one mistake can change the outcome of a game, a la Shawn Springs v. miSHITgan (96 I think?). Classic Tresselball. BUT, without pressure on the QB, a zone is a huge detriment. If you blitz safeties and/or LB's (more than one LB), you can't play a zone...it's obviously the scheme. This scheme has always worked in the past (last couple of years), but again, an aggressive and talented D line was the foundation. The scheme needs to change. Any QB that has 4-6 seconds to throw against a zone will have tremendous success. So we either need to man up, blitz, or both.
 
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FKAGobucks877, respectfull you just made my point there but you disagreed too. haha They don't man D because of the possibility of mistakes, and new and young Db's make errors and bad decisions sometimes that could (as you stated) "change the game". Coach Tressel is a stickler for reducing errors and good decision making. Thats why he will not go with Man Defense until these new and young Db's can stand alone 1v1 .
I do agree that it would be so nice to see our Defense getting more pressure on the QB's and being more agressive but man D won't come until Coach Tressel thinks that these young and green DB's can handle going 1v1 in man D. I too hope that day comes soon but its not going to happen YET under Tressels watch.
 
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FKAGobucks877,
I agree in that OSU's D needs to be more aggressive but do you honestly think Coach Tressel is going to change his methods of play ?? He has a system that has gotten us to something like 35-7 (I forget it thats right but its close haha) and he's not going to change that. I am not saying it doesn't make my stomach turn at times but its reality.
Coach Tressel will work on reducing the errors and fundamentals and make the proper adjustments in the Zone defense until he 100% feels that these Db's can handle man Defense. That may come down the road but I bet you it won't happen next week. In all fareness to your comments though I also hope that the Db's come around and that along the way we have Db's good enough to do man D . That would be awesome but do you honestly think that Tressel will change the whole defense now when there were so many mistakes made by both the offense and Defense ?? I would not mind being wrong my freind, and to seeing the Db's pick off balls and be able to man up would be amazing l but i dunno if thats gonna happen any time soon. Who knows though. I hope yor right.
 
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Well-- the one thing I've noticed is that 'the book' on beating our D right now seems to consist of 3 step drops and moving the QB out of the pocket....

I tend to think the problems we're having is that we're not faking our looks well enough... (Showing Man, and dropping into zone) zone blitzing and whatver else... we also need to be more mindful of taking some shots at the QB when he rolls to his throwing hand... We got to do better making them check out of their first option.


Also- What the heck happened to bringing everyone including the Kitchen Sink when the opponent is in the Red Zone... Make them go to Max protect or kill their Quarterback? There'e no reason not to play man when the back of the End zone is the Safety.
 
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If we don't change our D scheme Purdue is going to tear us apart. Purdue is like NW with talent. Heck, Wisci will probably tear it apart too... if they complete a few passes they might be able to run for 10 yards a pop.

Mili made a good point about Snyder getting up to the booth. That might be what's going on here. I wonder what they're thinking when they're watching the game film today. Is it, "That worked because he was out of position" or "That worked because he missed a tackle" or are they honest enough to say "That worked because we were in a soft D and they knew exactly where to run/throw against it".
 
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StoRM - yeah, I do think Tressel will change things up a bit. The scheme he has played for the last couple of years is no longer working. It would work, if we could get some pressure on the QB. So I think he will either change the look of the zone, allowing more positions to blitz, and/or switch out of that zone coverage more often. Yes, this would include putting trust in the CB's, but I think he'll do it. Don't get me wrong, I don't believe he's going to start running bump-and-run every play, but even if we run a straight up man coverage, say, every third obvious passing down, it will greatly help. tOSU's problem on D this year has been the vanilla scheme, with no surprises. When the D line can't pressure the QB on their own, and anytime we blitz it's an obvious, readable blitz (and the secondary stays in that soft zone), you aren't going to have a whole lot of defensive success. I firmly believe that Tressel will implement new looks, different blitz packages, and maybe get out of that damn zone more often. Tressel lives and dies by his defense, so if it isn't working (such as giving up 33 to Northwestern, 21 to Marshall, etc.), I do think he'll change things up a little.
 
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I tend to think the problems we're having is that we're not faking our looks well enough... (Showing Man, and dropping into zone) zone blitzing and whatver else...
Click to expand...

Exactly...I'd also like to see MORE games with the DL since they cannot generate pressure naturally...loops, twists, X's, and especially some ZONE blitzing


Anything besides this base look that is being ripped up....
 
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