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Breaking News: Yates found not guilty by reason of insanity

But it doesn't make the opinion a sham or a lie. It's still the informed opinion of a recognized expert in the field..

Wow, if you believe that, you are completely clueless and naive. There are doctors who go around the country giving "expert testimony" for money and that's it. that's how they make their living. I've seen anecdotes in medical journals that detail the ridiculous "opinions" that these guys will give for a hefty sum. It's not informed at all. It's amazing what 'recognized experts" will say outside the field of medicine and for a buck.
 
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Tibs is largely correct about this particular jury. Don't blame the defense for being good, blame the prosecution for being inept. Regardless, it's one thing to say "It's my opinion that so and so did it" and quite another to suggest the jury got it wrong. As SD - I think it was - said, the people on her jury were there with the express purpose of hearing a case, and they heard every piece of testimony, etc. Volumes more information than any one of us has heard.

You know how I feel about crimes against children, BL.. I'd just as soon light this bitch up, but I don't agree with the attack on the jury or the legal system.



I would like to believe that on the same facts, we'd see the same result. But, I'm not stupid. Chances are high a poor black single inner-city mom would not have prevailed on an insanity D... at least in my view... and that, to me, is an indictment of humans and their prejudice, not the system.

I know you BKB, I was never implying you were a fan of letting this woman go or are weak on child crime (I'm not saying that about SD or anyone else either)...this is more a general philosophical discussion.

My point is though that the prejudice of the people IS the system in jury trials though...which is why I don't feel that "trust the jury be default" is a valid line of reason, any more than I would trust 12 strangers to do anything else. I don't believe public opinion should dictate guilt or innocence...but I also don't believe that the public should stand silent at a perceived injustice (either for or against a defendant) just because "the jury said so" if you will.
 
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Wow, if you believe that, you are completely clueless and naive. There are doctors who go around the country giving "expert testimony" for money and that's it. that's how they make their living. I've seen anecdotes in medical journals that detail the ridiculous "opinions" that these guys will give for a hefty sum. It's not informed at all. It's amazing what 'recognized experts" will say outside the field of medicine and for a buck.

Not to mention the psyciatric "experts" who will make up a mental disorder about absolutely anything.
 
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Wow, if you believe that, you are completely clueless and naive. There are doctors who go around the country giving "expert testimony" for money and that's it. that's how they make their living. I've seen anecdotes in medical journals that detail the ridiculous "opinions" that these guys will give for a hefty sum. It's not informed at all. It's amazing what 'recognized experts" will say outside the field of medicine and for a buck.

And their rates can be absolutely astounding. Well in excess of $1,000 per hour (including non-testimony prep hours) for Drs. whose skills aren't even especially rare (i.e., they're not Chief Neurologist at a major medical school hospital or something)
 
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Wow...touchy much? Never said a thing about you personally...no need to make it that way when it wasn't.

Apologize if I came off harsh. But I really dislike the perception that attorneys get guilty people off if they have enough money.

Part A of what I have bolded above...my question is by who? By the attorneys? By the judge? They aren't making the decision. The jury is 12 "regular" people. They make up their own standards, and if they believe what they want to believe (a la OJ) then it doesn't matter what the "professional standards" are.

Most experts are medical, and are held to a professional standard... not by judge or jury, but by their profession.

Part B above...you and I will just have to disagree, but that's not surprising since my experience is from a different angle regarding the mental health "experts" than yours (not passing judgement, just saying we're in different places).

My experience is limited to what i've seen. And I've never "seen" an expert give a false opinion just because he was getting a lot of money for it. Never seen it. I've seen experts get a lot of money for their opinion and come back with a contradictory opinion, then have to disclose it to the other side. Devastating - wish you could buy your way out of it when it backfires like that.

As far as mental health experts go, your guess is as good as mine. But experts aren't allowed to testify on a subject unless they establish their qualifications. They aren't allowed to testify to theories or opinions unless they're medically accepted. And they're not supposed to testify dishonestly, both from a legal and professional perspective.

Wow, if you believe that, you are completely clueless and naive. There are doctors who go around the country giving "expert testimony" for money and that's it. that's how they make their living. I've seen anecdotes in medical journals that detail the ridiculous "opinions" that these guys will give for a hefty sum. It's not informed at all. It's amazing what 'recognized experts" will say outside the field of medicine and for a buck.

Well Tibor, I wouldn't expect you to make a point without being an a__. But since you brought it up...

I can't speak for the law in Texas, but in Ohio, a medical expert has to dedicate a large portion of their medical income to out-of-court practice in order to even be competent to testify.

Funny, as a police officer, I find that it tends to revolve around whether or not the prosecutor has a tee time. If so, better give a sweet deal so there's no risk of going to trial. The problem is that prosecutors who get a rep for cutting deals get bullied by defense attorneys, no matter how solid the case.

I personally don't see how giving crack cocaine dealers/spouse beaters/thieves with multiple convictions judicical release helps society at all. They have shown that they shown no remorse by repeating the crime or another. This has nothing to do with this case, it's just my little rant.

As far as this case is concerned, I don't see how a woman who drowned her children can contribute anything positive to society...she certainly didn't even look out for her own children.

Well, I don't know what prosecutors you're dealing (Franklin County probably), but deals get cut so that the docket can stay clear. Otherwise, the wheels of justice would probably move slower than they already do.

As far as looking out for her children, apparently according to her statement and testimony of her expert(s), she was insane enough to think she was looking out for them.
 
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Uh, right...no one should ever speak out about perceived injustice...or at least, not unless it agrees with you :shake:

As awful as it was, the jury system works most of the time.

What torture would sate your desire for revenge, because that's all it is!

I lost my niece to a drunk driver. As much as that angered me, I am satisfied that the court system works.
I have served on several juries. I have seen how the system works.
 
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As awful as it was, the jury system works most of the time.

What torture would sate your desire for revenge, because that's all it is!

You don't know a goddamned thing about me, so get off your goddamned high horse and stop passing judgement on my supposed "desire for revenge" or anything else. I happen to be against the death penalty...but when I see an injustice perpetrated on innocent children like I believe this is, I am going to get mad, and I am going to speak out. If you think the only reason to want to see Andrea Yates punished is for some sort of primal bloodlust, you are utterly fucking clueless. I am rational with you most fo the time Taos, but right now you are pissing me off.
 
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actually as I said before

Seems strange that 12 people would all find her guilty, then 12 people all find her not guilty at a later trial.

I don't know the specifics, but I do know that there was some testimony at her first trial thrown out by the Texas appellate court (which in itself says something). But not only did the appeals court deem the testimony inadmissible, but it determined that it wasn't "harmless error" - which means the court believed it had a potential effect on the outcome.
 
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Seems strange that 12 people would all find her guilty, then 12 people all find her not guilty at a later trial.

I don't know the specifics, but I do know that there was some testimony at her first trial thrown out by the Texas appellate court (which in itself says something). But not only did the appeals court deem the testimony inadmissible, but it determined that it wasn't "harmless error" - which means the court believed it had a potential effect on the outcome.

I believe it was falsified testimony by an "expert" witness, so no doubt that the first case should have been tossed. Problem is it would seem improbable to think you could find 12 more who didn't know that ahead of time, or what the result of the last case was, or a number of other things that might cloud their judgement.
 
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I believe it was falsified testimony by an "expert" witness, so no doubt that the first case should have been tossed. Problem is it would seem improbable to think you could find 12 more who didn't know that ahead of time, or what the result of the last case was, or a number of other things that might cloud their judgement.

You'll have that problem in any highly publicized case. It's not foolproof, but that's where the voir dire process comes in.
 
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You'll have that problem in any highly publicized case. It's not foolproof, but that's where the voir dire process comes in.

True...and maybe that testimony was from an investigator, I forget which...but it was definitely false. And the ends don't justify them means by any stretch...that was a no-brainer to toss out.
 
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