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Big Ten Conference Divisions

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CHU;1753632; said:
Yes, they will continue.
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Remember that in a few years because I guarantee it's not going to happen.

There is not going to be the build up for a mid season cross divisional game that comes anywhere close to the type of hype that has surrounded The Game in the past.
 
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BB73;1753624; said:
But I think in the long run it'll cost the league money. Diminishing The Game will over time diminish the exposure of the Big Ten, will eventually impact recruiting and thus decrease the financial success of the Big Ten.

One year getting only 1 team in the BCS instead of 2 will cost the Big Ten about $4.5 million dollars. That would offset a decade worth of chances of getting a second TSUN-tOSU matchup in the CCG, which would probably occur twice (on average) in a 10-year period.
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With the current state of affairs in Ann Arbor, what does Michigan have to do with the possibility of only getting 1 team in the BCS instead of 2??? I don't claim to be not biased, but I think Nebraska showing up, on the rise as we are currently, provides a much better shot of getting 2 BCS invites than Michigan does.

I don't advocate that The Game goes away, don't even advocate that it changes to a different time in the season. I do agree though, with those that say that its importance lessening with a CCG following it is inevitable. And I don't think that the Big Ten not expanding was/will be a viable answer over the next few years. In terms of money, I think that a Big Ten CCG between, as an example, OSU and Nebraska - will bring in more money than any decrease in $$$ from The Game (since I can't imagine it not still always being played, just diminish somewhat in stature over time possibly, particularly when one team is WAY down as is the current state of affairs.) Trust me, interest NATIONALLY is already way down with Michigan in the dumpster (vs. interest from the two fanbases, which I understand is still high.)
 
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DallasHusker;1753638; said:
With the current state of affairs in Ann Arbor, what does Michigan have to do with the possibility of only getting 1 team in the BCS instead of 2??? I don't claim to be not biased, but I think Nebraska showing up, on the rise as we are currently, provides a much better shot of getting 2 BCS invites than Michigan does.

I don't advocate that The Game goes away, don't even advocate that it changes to a different time in the season. I do agree though, with those that say that its importance lessening with a CCG following it is inevitable. And I don't think that the Big Ten not expanding was/will be a viable answer over the next few years. In terms of money, I think that a Big Ten CCG between, as an example, OSU and Nebraska - will bring in more money than any decrease in $$$ from The Game (since I can't imagine it not still always being played, just diminish somewhat in stature over time possibly, particularly when one team is WAY down as is the current state of affairs.) Trust me, interest NATIONALLY is already way down with Michigan in the dumpster (vs. interest from the two fanbases, which I understand is still high.)
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Not to put words in his mouth, but I think what BB was saying is that the few extra million they work into the TV contract for a Ohio St v Michigan CCG basically would be given back the first year we don't get 2 teams in the BCS. Thus from our prespective if this is for monetary purposes, isn't enough money to mess with tradition.

Now, I do agree with you that there are ALOT of CCG combos that would bring a windfall in cash too.

And I tend to think that it will be rare to not get 2 teams in the BCS anyway since Big 10 fans travel so well, as long as a team is close to qualifying into the BCS will get picked.
 
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The only thing I think of is this... Even though UM is down right now they are 1B to OSU's 1A as far as potential to always be a national power house. Sooner or later UM will be good again, and if both teams take care of business it'll come down to OSU/UM like it should.

Change is always abound though, and while it sucks right now nothing can deminish THE GAME. Wether its in August or April for that matter when OSU lines up against UM it'll always be special. It'll just get time to get use to is all, but right now it does feel weird.
 
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DallasHusker;1753638; said:
With the current state of affairs in Ann Arbor, what does Michigan have to do with the possibility of only getting 1 team in the BCS instead of 2??? I don't claim to be not biased, but I think Nebraska showing up, on the rise as we are currently, provides a much better shot of getting 2 BCS invites than Michigan does.

I don't advocate that The Game goes away, don't even advocate that it changes to a different time in the season. I do agree though, with those that say that its importance lessening with a CCG following it is inevitable. And I don't think that the Big Ten not expanding was/will be a viable answer over the next few years. In terms of money, I think that a Big Ten CCG between, as an example, OSU and Nebraska - will bring in more money than any decrease in $$$ from The Game (since I can't imagine it not still always being played, just diminish somewhat in stature over time possibly, particularly when one team is WAY down as is the current state of affairs.) Trust me, interest NATIONALLY is already way down with Michigan in the dumpster (vs. interest from the two fanbases, which I understand is still high.)
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I don't think we're debating the wisdom of expanding to 12 (or more), or the financial plus/minus of having a CCG - that ship has sailed.

And we're not comparing the CCG to The Game - we're discussing the timing of The Game and whether or not tOSU and TSUN belong in the same division.

I'm saying that the diminishing of The Game (by moving it away from the last game of the season and splitting the teams into separate divisions, instead of leaving it at the end and having tOSU-TSUN in the same division), will over time lessen attention, interest, and prestige in the Big Ten overall. And that will affect all teams in the Big Ten to some extent, lessening their strength, and making it more likely for the Big Ten to have a year in which only 1 team gets a BCS bid.

There are 10 BCS bids. A year in which they go to the 6 AQ winners, ND, 1 non-AQ team like TCU/Boise St, and 2 at-larges for an SEC team and the Texas-Oklahoma loser will happen; and the diminishing of The Game makes it more likely to occur. And that will cost the league $4.5 million, which I believe is more than any benefit they perceive that they'll get from moving The Game from the end of the season and hoping for a rematch.

I'm looking at things long term, over several years. TSUN's current struggles are a problem, but they're a traditional power that will right themselves, as Nebraska did after the Callahan fiasco.
 
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I think it's pretty misleading to group those rivalries together and state the overarching conclusions you're getting from them. My comments in red on a game by game basis...

BB73;1753556; said:
The addition of the CCG will have an impact on The Game. But it needs to be protected as much as possible to keep it special.

Let's look at other rivalries that have been affected by conference and divisional changes:

Bama-Auburn: In the same division, kept as the season-ender, and they hate each other about as much as ever Status quo

Bama-Tenn: In separate divisions, they kept the 3rd (or 4th) Saturday in October traditional schedule, but most folks outside the South don't even know this is a protected rivalry game Status quo

Fla-Georgia: In the same division, kept the WLOCP location and timing, and it's still a great tradition and a game that matters Status quo

Okla-Neb: split into separate divisions, didn't retain the protected rivalry status of playing every year, and a game that was once in the top-5 of all college football rivalies pretty much withered away Downfall of this rivalry has A LOT more to do with them not playing every year

Okla-Texas: placed in the same division, kept its traditional timing and location at the Texas State Fair, and has blossomed into one of the top-5 college rivalries Satus quo

Fla St-Miami: placed in separate divisions (most fans can't tell you which team is in Coastal and which is in Atlantic), and the timing of the game was moved from the second half of the season to the opener in order to allow the losing team to have a chance to recover for an NC run, and to have time between the first game and a possible CCG rematch; the timing of the game has been moved again (I'd have to look up when they play this year), and they've yet to meet in the ACC CCG Possible case study, although I think the rivalry dimishing has a lot more to do with the quality of these two teams since ACC formed

USC-UCLA: Ask most fans in LA about the placement of the teams in PAC-12 divisions in the next couple of years and they'd say "Whoa, did the Pac 10 expand?" I LOL'd at this, but it's irrelevant as a case study

So, to sum up:

Same division: Bama-Auburn, Fla-UGA, Tex-Okla - all are still a big thing

Separate divisions: Okla-Neb, FSU-Miami, Bama-Tenn - none of them are what they once were

I think it shouldn't take a PhD in Astronomy to figure out what to do with TSUN and tOSU.
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No one is arguing that keeping the game at the same time might diminish the rivalry (aside from the fact that a CCG might do that). Everyone pretty much knows that status quo couldn't hurt, which is all that I think your comments here help support. The question is whether an alternative could be just as good or better. The only example I see that is a good possible case study is the Miami/FSU one.
 
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Nobody seems to note that having it as the last regular season game gives a team that might not have a shot of getting to the CCG something to look forward to and play for. For all the hype of the 2006 game, I still remember the 2001 game more. All those years when 7-5 Michigan spoiled our 11-0 seasons may have been bitter, but it was better for the rivalry as a whole, and I can appreciate it. Now, they are talking about taking the late season drama out of the game? When 1-3 Michigan play 2-2 Ohio State in late september, what are we going to have to look forward to the rest of the season?
 
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