Big Ten and other Conference Expansion

[TheRob8801]

It's a small and minor point, but the three schools of Syracuse, Pittsburgh and Rutgers in relation to the Director's Cup standings keeps popping in my head. Small point meaning it can be construed as how strong your total athletic department is and it can't be.

Big Ten teams have an average ranking of about 29.53 over five years (including 2009-10 through April 8). Those three schools have an average ranking of: Syracuse (82.40); Pittsburgh (83.40); Rutgers (84.20).

Lowest Big Ten team is Iowa at an average of 54.60. Very big difference in terms of performance of all athletic programs.

Like Gator sort of mentioned...

I feel like if those schools were to move to a conference where they began to receive more funding via whatever routes the performance of those school's smaller athletic ventures would increase over time...

 

[kn1f3party]

Maybe some of the old timers can help us out a little on this one. Where would Penn State have fit, and even Michigan State, in terms of overall athletic performance prior to joining the Big Ten? How long before they broke the bubble?

 

[jwinslow]

Maybe some of the old timers can help us out a little on this one. Where would Penn State have fit, and even Michigan State, in terms of overall athletic performance prior to joining the Big Ten? How long before they broke the bubble?

College Football Data Warehouse

 

[SloopyHangOn]

The BTN airs a ton of those small sports though, so it could be a realistic factor, even if it is a smaller one.

I agree. I even think that a move to the Big Ten could help certain schools' smaller athletic programs grow over time.

Also, I'm not a huge fan of hockey, but I do watch on occasion. Do conference affiliations such as the Big Ten, ACC, etc. even matter? Aren't there divisions like that in D-1 hockey already?

 

[cincibuck]

Maybe some of the old timers can help us out a little on this one. Where would Penn State have fit, and even Michigan State, in terms of overall athletic performance prior to joining the Big Ten? How long before they broke the bubble?

Michigan opposed the entry of MSU. Notre Dame signed the Spartans onto their schedule giving both teams a serious upgrade to their SOS and leading to the entry of MSU's entry to the Big 10. As for overall sports strength, not much getrs measured beyond B-Ball and football 'cause nothing else makes money.

 

[muffler dragon]

Like Gator sort of mentioned...

I feel like if those schools were to move to a conference where they began to receive more funding via whatever routes the performance of those school's smaller athletic ventures would increase over time...

Which, IMO, is fine for one "project" school; however, I want the higher percentage of schools that are expansion considerations to be proven.

 

[OSU_D/]

If you can move to 14, it should be about the same to grab 16, and that would let them gamble on Rutgers or Syracuse.

Virginia and Texas don't fit the academics or culture of the sec.

Oklahoma & Florida St do.

I'd say the opposite is true for those teams and the big ten.

Well, we'll just try to get by with our own opinions about what fits our conference and the reasons for and against.

We can settle the fit of one of these schools and the SEC very easily...

Power brokers: How tagalong Baylor, Tech crashed the revolt

That left the SEC as a possible relocation target for the Longhorns ? until Berdahl let it be known that UT wasn't interested because of the league's undistinguished academic profile. Only two of 12 schools in the SEC were American Association of Universities members and UT officials saw admissions standards to SEC schools as too lenient.

"We were quite interested in raising academic standards," Berdahl says. "And the Southeastern Conference had absolutely no interest in that."

Just for the fun of it... my current dream 5 for the Big 10 which I know won't come to fruition
Texas
Toronto - seriously. They could probably participate in most sports immediately. Then bring them along through FCS and then FBS football
ND
Missouri
Rutgers/Syracuse or someother Eastern school

 

[BuckeyeInTheBoro]

Just for the fun of it... my current dream 5 for the Big 10 which I know won't come to fruition
Texas
Toronto...

Toronto, eh? Now that's a new name on the list!

 

[OSU_D/]

Toronto, eh? Now that's a new name on the list!

Actually I have seen there name thrown out there... its just not going to happen. Still, the academics are great and the market that would come with it would be huge. Its also closer than NYC and Austin.

 

[Gatorubet]

We can settle the fit of one of these schools and the SEC very easily...

There are indeed only two members of the American Association of Universities in the SEC. Texas wanted the Pac-10, and the article said that distance (and Stanford and possibly UCLA objecting) were a no-go. The Big -10 was a good fit, met the academic excellence and time zone needs of Texas, but that the Big-10 was not interested.

So now the Big-10 is interested. The article made very clear that the wishes of Texas were not the deciding factor. Baylor and A&M lobbyists (and other political influences) were also of paramount importance.

So I look at it like this: A&M had an interest in the SEC. For Texas to go big-10, the Big-10 has to take A&M. Since 1994, the SEC has risen in athletic prominence, and is a more attractive conference than it was in 1994 for pure athletics. There are, unfortunately, still only two AAU members in the SEC. But remember that Texas and the other Texas schools were willing to join the Big-12, which had only four AAU members instead of the Big-10's 10.

So I am not arguing that our academics are akin to the Big-10. I am saying that since 1994 the SEC has inked the CBS/ESPN deal - with far, far more money than it used to have. Also, while it was a strong conference before, for good or ill, true or not, we are viewed nationally by many fans and writers as the premier Football conference. Not saying either of those trump the academics, but I am saying that both of those factors may impact any decision in 2010 in a different manner than in 1994.

My main point is that it does not matter if the Horns want the Big-10 or if the Big-10 wants the Horns....if TA&M and/or Baylor have a say in the Texas Legislature's funding. Leaving little brother high and dry is not as easily done as said. So maybe, just maybe, the SEC is the less bright but still wealthy friend to the smart babe that Texas and his brother A&M want to date.

The the two Texas guys might be coerced into double dating two fast SEC girls, but the stuck up Big-10 girl will only agree to date one Texas guy, making it virtually impossible for the smarter Big-10 gal in the big wool sweater to hook up with the one forlorn guy in the large cowboy hat. :p

So if the Horns want smarts, then so does the SEC...but even more so because we have less braniacs over here, and it would be a coup for Mike Slive. The SEC might be able to play its cards right (Texans are pathologically disposed to want to prove themselves best, and the SEC run of BCSNCs and the recent Bama win may make it important for them to show us how better Texas is), and get both smart brothers (doubling our AAU membership), even if only one of them really wants to go out.

 

[Steve19]

If this major realignment takes place, Texas legislators may decide to ignore the little brothers,

 

[Gatorubet]

If this major realignment takes place, Texas legislators may decide to ignore the little brothers,

Yep yep yep Steve, not saying that is not a very real possibility.

Just saying that people do not always make the "right" or expected decision despite a ton of facts in favor of it. I agree with everything said, but still am not willing to write Mike Slive off yet. He's a sneaky bastard!

 

[jwinslow]

If they're adding 3 or 5, especially if Missouri extends the footprint west (and to central time), it's even easier to bring a&m along.

Gator, you keep talking about aau numbers, but it's the billions in CIC revenue that Texas' struggling academic programs could really use.

I think the sec being on top is something of a plus for the big ten.

1) at the height of your conference's hype, success and brand new tv deals... and the basement of the b10's reputation (including watchability)... the tv revenue streams are about the same. Espn and CBS just inked long term deals... the btn has a ton of room for growth, especially if they add some huge markets like st louis or the biggest market of all... The republic of Texas.

2) they're smart enough to know that cfb is cyclical. In about one calendar year (maybe only 2 months depending on your viewpoint), the SEC went from being way below the mighty big ten to becoming the official religion of espn and a NC-berth locked up for any champ without huge flaws.

 

[Gatorubet]

2) they're smart enough to know that cfb is cyclical. In about one calendar year (maybe only 2 months depending on your viewpoint), the SEC went from being way below the mighty big ten to becoming the official religion of espn and a NC-berth locked up for any champ without huge flaws.

We were below the Big-10??? Really??

I had no idea!

(perhaps before football started in 1990?????? :p)

FWIW, Missouri, A&M, Texas, Rutgers and Syracuse would all be AAU members with various other things to bring to the table. If you go big, this is my guess.

Plus, you get to fuck the Irish out of the big $$.

 

[jwinslow]

We were below the Big-10??? Really??

No, but that was the stupid perception... just like the perception of the conference in 09 (when really the big ten was pretty comparable if not deeper) and the revisionary perception of the big ten in 06 (including the laughers about the SEC vs B10 that year).

We've had 5 "dynasties" in one decade... Da U, OU, USC, OSU*, UF... and we're close to adding Bama. If the NCAA keeps looking the other way, how long before drama queen has them dominating again with his recruiting? Texas is pretty close to being elite as well, and should've been in the title game the last 2 years.

* - OSU didn't get there, but everyone was well on their way to enshrining them all fall in 06, especially with their buddies in the Schott hogging headlines as well.