BCS predictions/discussion/Knock Em' Off

[Mike80]

I like Brent. His ties don't borther me, and I think he's objective as possible. He plays up both teams as much as he can. I did enjoy his orange and blue tie this year, almost as if he was giving OSU fans something to complain about this year.

He probably did actually, just to rile people up for no reason. I'm sure he got a kick out of it too if anyone noticed

The difference between Brent and Kirk, is Kirk is seen as the expert. Brent just calls games. Kirk has lots of influence in the country b/c of his gameday position and high status at ESPN. Saying WVU has more team speed than OSU and that he's hoping for an OSU-USC Rose certainly works against OSU on a national basis.

Clarification: are we trying to influence the CFB fan or the Harris Poll voter?

If it's the CFB fan, screw them. Most of the minds were and have been made up for years now.

If it is Harris Poll voter, supposedly these people are "experts" in their own right. If they aren't voting based on what they see and perceive and what Herbie actually says, that's a problem.

 

[Mike80]

Which Herbie should I call? Local homer herbie, or national herbie? That's my main issue with the guy, and calling him is a pretty pointless endeavour.

Calling him out about this subject on his radio show might shed some light on the subject.

Hooley does the pot-stirring on 1460 with the cliff-jumping, emotional rants & devil's advocation. Herbie is usually the level headed, intelligent contributor to the broadcast. You can listen to Herbie every day for a week or two without hearing anything but constructive criticism at worst. During most ESPN saturday night broadcasts, he gets in subtle little shots at the conference like the one discussed tonight. Personally, I don't hear those same kinds of comments on gameday, and their random interjection into the game (esp earlier this year when OSU was not yet a NC contender) sure feels scripted.

I don't listen to 1460, so I'll have to take your word for it.

As for his "shots" at the conference, if that's his opinion, he's entitled to it whether you or I agree with it or not. I don't see what the problem is here.

 

[Zem]

<snip>Saying WVU has more team speed than OSU and that he's hoping for an OSU-USC Rose certainly works against OSU on a national basis.

He didn't actually say "WVU has more team speed." He said the game would come down to "power of OSU vs. the speed of WVU." That doesn't mean he thinks WVU is faster--just that their game is based on speed.

The one offensive touchdown the Buckeyes scored against florida was the result of power football. That doesn't mean that the gators were faster, it just suggests the better game plan was run the football at them. And the best game plan against WVU would probably be power football. How could they stop Beanie? Keep their offense off the field.

 

[MililaniBuckeye]

On a separate note, if anyone wants to talk about backdooring into the title game, how about a 2 loss Georgia team getting into the National Title Game by avoiding LSU because they couldn't even make it into the SECCG? That would be a huge shot in the balls for all those SEC fans whose seven word vocabulary is "SEC fast, Big 10 slow, championship game."

And will destroy the arguments that CCGs are necessary to determine "true" champions, and hopefully will shut up the knuckleheads saying the Big Ten needs to expand to 12 teams and install a championship game.

 

[lvbuckeye]

(maybe they should have a three way)

if you're talking about those two Sooner chicks, then i agree completely and would like to volunteer my services for said activities.

 

[cincibuck]

Hey guys, quick theory:

-Ohio State plays USC in the Rose Bowl.
-Missouri plays WVU in the National Championship Game.

Let us say that Ohio State beats USC. Tough test to say the least. Over the last 6 years, USC has not lost a game by more than 7 points. Tons of depth. Game would probably get higher ratings than the actual National Championship Game. Point spread would be below a touchdown for whatever team is favored (Ohio State).

Missouri beats WVU by 20+ points, or vice versa.

What are the chances of Ohio State winning an AP National Title?

The chances are excellent, but I refuse to go there. There is one BCS Championship game and the winner is the NC for that year, they get the crystal football and the rest is just "the current system sucks," "wait till next year," bull shit.

Just as I do not give USC credit for their AP NC, so I would not give OSU credit for one either.

I hope this ends for all time the discussion about why it's important to have Michigan win OOC games as well as other Big 10 Teams. OSU rankings are a reflection on the ENTIRE Big 10 and vice versa.

 

[cincibuck]

WOW let the Buckeye bashing begin. Anyone watching any of the late coverage tonight with Scott Van Pelt talking with Herbstreit or Mark May saying we're not deserving because we don't play a conference championship game. What will they be saying if we actually get to Nat'l Championship game?

They'll say what most folks believed all year long, that the NC slots belonged to USC and LSU unless Okie could find a QB. I don't know how they justify LSUs two losses, one at home, but there certainly is a lot of talent on the team and the SEC schedule is tough. USC gets a pass due to injuries as does Ok.

As for Mark May and a Big 10 conference championship game, who would you have us play this year and last? This post season crap started with ML baseball and has spread in the minds of idiots as something that settles the question of who really was better in a sport where round robin play isn't possible.

Just keep this in mind Mark May represents ESPN and ESPN needs product. Championship games give ESPN something to cover during a time frame that is owned by the NFL and CBS/Fox. Mark May has a real financial reason to promote the idea of a Big 10 CC game.

WTF am I doing up at 5:42?

 

[lvbuckeye]

He didn't actually say "WVU has more team speed." He said the game would come down to "power of OSU vs. the speed of WVU." That doesn't mean he thinks WVU is faster--just that their game is based on speed.

The one offensive touchdown the Buckeyes scored against florida was the result of power football. That doesn't mean that the gators were faster, it just suggests the better game plan was run the football at them. And the best game plan against WVU would probably be power football. How could they stop Beanie? Keep their offense off the field.

which reinforces the football adage that the best way to negate defensive speed is to run right at it. i honestly don't recall getting beat to the corner at all this year. Illinois' success came by running straight ahead. Penn State's success came from running straight ahead. i think that the Buckeyes match up far better against WVU than they did against Illinois. the Illini run up the middle. WVU does not run the ball between the tackles. they run it on the edges.

 

[lvbuckeye]

I hope this ends for all time the discussion about why it's important to have Michigan win OOC games as well as other Big 10 Teams. OSU rankings are a reflection on the ENTIRE Big 10 and vice versa.

it's a bullshit double standard. where is the penalty for the SEC when 'Bama loses to UL-Monroe? the argument goes, "but 'Bama sucks this year." great. and? why does Bama sucking not reflect poorly on the SEC, but TSUN sucking is an indictment of the entire Big Ten?

 

[Palpie]

it's a bullshit double standard. where is the penalty for the SEC when 'Bama loses to UL-Monroe? the argument goes, "but 'Bama sucks this year." great. and? why does Bama sucking not reflect poorly on the SEC, but TSUN sucking is an indictment of the entire Big Ten?

Well scUM did manage to go 6-2 in the big10 while Bama was only 4-4 in the SEC. I don't think think OSU should be punished for the sins of scUM or the rest of the big10 (I'm looking at you, Minnesota). Nor do I think UGA or LSU should be punished for Bama's sins (UGA should be punished for being evil incarnate though). You can't really control your confrence schedule and non-confrence games can go from playing a top opponent to an also ran between the game being scheduled and played (see OSU/Wash and USC/NEB, or the upcoming OSU/Cryami series if Cryami doesn't get better quick). With 119 1-A teams and only 12 games to judge them by there is never going to be any objective way to compare everybody. So unfortunately subjective comparisons that hold teams responsible for the effort of their opponents is all we have.

re: the Herbie stuff. I thnk he's always tried hard not to be too pro-OSU on Gameday/ESiPN stuff. Someone mention how he seems to get uncomfortable when the discussion turns to OSU and I agree with that. He's also seems much looser doing non-OSU game with Brent. When he talks OSU on a national stage he seems to try real hard not to come off as a OSU fan. I'm not sure if I think this is better or worse that the blatent cheerleading you get from guys like Holtz, who can't bring himself to ever say anything but sunshine and NC games for NoD. Living in the south, I can tell you EVERYONE down here thinks Herbie is a total OSU/Big10 homer. I can't imagine what they'd say if the guy actually pimped OSU/the Big10 the way the CBS studio crew pimps the SEC. This despite Herbie constantly hyping the SEC.
Herbie comes on with one of the afternoon shows in Atlanta on mondays and he's much more of an OSU guy with them than he is when he's on Gameday or ESPiN's national radio spots. So it could just be that Herbie is spouting what the Disney overlords want him to. That would explain wanting OSU in the Rose Bowl, which ESPiN/ABC still broadcasts. I wouldn't be surprised if a Buckeye/Trojan Rose Bowl outdrew a Mizzou/WVU title game.

 

[BuckeyesFever]

Maybe USC fans didn't like the fact that their home stadium doesn't host for national championship every year or every other year like they used to due to BCS. They also lost some profits? They also lost to OSU several times at the Rose Bowl. USC and OSU have about equal numbers of champions and Heisman Trophies. They like everyone know Ohio produces many great players. So, maybe they saw a great opportunity to pay Herbie for him to influence BCS men not to pick our team to play for NC and have cheap USC possibly beat us at their home base? They know they'll have better recruits if they beat us? It's just an opinion, not fact. Who knows?

:osu2:

 

[cincibuck]

it's a bullshit double standard. where is the penalty for the SEC when 'Bama loses to UL-Monroe? the argument goes, "but 'Bama sucks this year." great. and? why does Bama sucking not reflect poorly on the SEC, but TSUN sucking is an indictment of the entire Big Ten?

Bull shit double standard or no, it's reality. Michigan loosing to App State, while ranked #5 and picked to be the best in the conference says more than 'Bama, picked to imporve, but settle int he middle of the SEC, loosing to UL-Monroe. Add to that Mizzou knocking off Illinois, Minnesota going to hell in a hand cart, Wisconsin struggling with a number of weak OOC games and OSU's offense playing stumble dick against YSU and the outsider's look at Big 10 football, already reeling from the bowl games, and find fertile ground to say, "they ain't shit." Look back on the posts two/three years ago when LSU came up short because their OOC was so weak and SEC teams had been outplayed in the bowls.

 

[THEWOOD]

Add to that Mizzou knocking off Illinois, Minnesota going to hell in a hand cart, Wisconsin struggling with a number of weak OOC games ...

I do not understand how this reflects poorly on the BigTen? Illinois almost won that game.

 

[Lockup]

I do not understand how this reflects poorly on the BigTen? Illinois almost won that game.

It doesn't or let's say it shouldn't.

The problem with CFB is most of the talking heads have no clue what they are talking about. They still spout off the same BS they have been for years. Anyone remember the talk when OSU played Miami? I am sure you all remember the OSU cannot handle their speed and four or five years later it is the same BS. OSU didn't help the argument either by looking like they were playing in mud against Florida last year.

And get off Herbie already the man is intitled to his opinion. He does need to be on OSU's jock 24/7. He has a job to do and I am sure it is not part of his contract to promote OSU all the time.

 

[cincibuck]

Illinois almost won that game.

Horseshoes and hand grenades... and we almost beat Illinois...