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5 players suspended for 5 games in 2011 regular season (Appeal has been denied)

Buckeye2223;1841690; said:
How can you be embarrased by Gene? He's basically trying to get as much heat off the players as he can. He's willing to look like an idiot so the team has the chance to not suffer as much. I say well done Gene! And BTW I am new here and not sure if using the word "heat" while talking any Ohio sport is allowed because of LBJ. If it was bad then please forgive me and i wont use it again. lol


Well, he more than likely straight out lied about the reasons for the players violating the rules, and then he went on to make a completely unnecessary and stupid joke about adding a tattoo artist to the WHAC.

Before that he completely botched the handling of the divisions (You're the AD at the most important university in the Big Ten! Throw your weight around a little!).

Add to that the fact that he's a domer, and I am just not at all impressed with him.
 
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Buckeye Maniac;1841691; said:
Well, he more than likely straight out lied about the reasons for the players violating the rules, and then he went on to make a completely unnecessary and stupid joke about adding a tattoo artist to the WHAC.

Before that he completely botched the handling of the divisions (You're the AD at the most important university in the Big Ten! Throw your weight around a little!).

Add to that the fact that he's a domer, and I am just not at all impressed with him.

Im sure he lied about the reasons but isnt that his job? I definatly think the joke was out of line and not funny. And most importantly, What is a domer?
 
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Gene Smith is one of the most respected sports administrators in the country. Andy Geiger, that class act hounded out of his job on spurious allegations "loss of control", set the stage for a golden era in Ohio State sports. Under Gene Smith's administration, it has born fruit--not only in football and basketball but across the panoply of Ohio State sports.

Live long enough and you will see the circle of life more clearly. At a time when Ohio State University athletics is enjoying one of it's greatest golden eras, it is not surprising to see the bile that some folks seem so willing to spill.
As a boy, I sat in the barber shop on Oakland Park Avenue, listening to the old men talk down Woody Hayes. They all knew better than Woody.They were embarrassed when his teams did not win the Big Ten. They bayed for his job with a great passion, which would be exceeded by their impassioned grief whenhe stood before them with tears in his eyes "after dotting the i" and they remembered what they had done. I never forgot the things that they said and how they argued with my father while I waited for my haircut. How strange it was to hear how they remembered the things they said so long ago, when they told stories about their undying support for Woody and John Cooper "not getting it".

These great "Ohio State fans" spoke with even more passion about the need to fire Fred Taylor, Ohio State's first baseball All-American and coach of a national championship team. As I write, Fred Taylor stares back from a few feet away, as he was when I snapped the picture courtside during an Ohio State game. Looking at the picture reminds me of his incredible generosity but I also see a sadness in his eye and a weariness that I was too young to see as a child.


What might Taylor have achieved if Athletics Director Ed Weaver supported him after his team was attacked and beaten up at Minnesota? What would have been the destiny of the only coach who rivaled the great Adolph Rupp in his day?


How will Buckeye fans remember their behavior today when this golden era comes to its end, as all golden eras must?


For any fan to be embarrassed by Gene Smith's behavior is quite frankly ridiculous. Feeling that Smith's handling of this affair impugns one's self-image suggests a need to think clearly about the distinctions one makes between being a fan, on one hand, and the team, sport administrators, and University, on the other hand. We're talking about college sports here, one needs to keep perspective.


A friendly reminder. We do not allow bashing of Ohio State players, coaches, or sports administrators at BP. It is possible that briefings given to the players did not make the infractions clear. Can they sell a pair of their shoes? If Boom Herron buys a used car with his summer job earnings, can he sell it? Did the person who gave a particular brief just do a bad job on the day?


The point that I make is that there are a few folks riding very high horses on BP. As I read their posts, it seems very clear that none of them have any personal experience of what happened.


Do I personally think that the players must have suspected that what they were doing was wrong? Yes, but that is irrelevant. Do I think that Gene Smith may have been covering for his team by throwing his compliance team under the bus (possibly with their permission, they also are part of the team) and that he might have chosen a poor joke to bring the offense into perspective? Yes, it's possible, but that gives me no basis for questioning his integrity or, more importantly, intent.


But to be embarrassed about his behavior? Think about what you are saying folks, just think about it. Perhaps a few people of like mind are repping you but how will you rep yourself years from now?


If you have objective information that proves Gene Smith lied about the content of the briefings given to players, then by all means bring it forward for us all to see. If not, and you'd like to bash Ohio State players, coaches, or administrators, then I suggest you take the discussion to that other board or ESPiN. This is not the place.
 
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Steve19;1841708; said:
Gene Smith is one of the most respected sports administrators in the country. Andy Geiger, that class act hounded out of his job on spurious allegations "loss of control", set the stage for a golden era in Ohio State sports. Under Gene Smith's administration, it has born fruit--not only in football and basketball but across the panoply of Ohio State sports.

Live long enough and you will see the circle of life more clearly. At a time when Ohio State University athletics is enjoying one of it's greatest golden eras, it is not surprising to see the bile that some folks seem so willing to spill.
As a boy, I sat in the barber shop on Oakland Park Avenue, listening to the old men talk down Woody Hayes. They all knew better than Woody.They were embarrassed when his teams did not win the Big Ten. They bayed for his job with a great passion, which would be exceeded by their impassioned grief whenhe stood before them with tears in his eyes "after dotting the i" and they remembered what they had done. I never forgot the things that they said and how they argued with my father while I waited for my haircut. How strange it was to hear how they remembered the things they said so long ago, when they told stories about their undying support for Woody and John Cooper "not getting it".

These great "Ohio State fans" spoke with even more passion about the need to fire Fred Taylor, Ohio State's first baseball All-American and coach of a national championship team. As I write, Fred Taylor stares back from a few feet away, as he was when I snapped the picture courtside during an Ohio State game. Looking at the picture reminds me of his incredible generosity but I also see a sadness in his eye and a weariness that I was too young to see as a child.


What might Taylor have achieved if Athletics Director Ed Weaver supported him after his team was attacked and beaten up at Minnesota? What would have been the destiny of the only coach who rivaled the great Adolph Rupp in his day?


How will Buckeye fans remember their behavior today when this golden era comes to its end, as all golden eras must?


For any fan to be embarrassed by Gene Smith's behavior is quite frankly ridiculous. Feeling that Smith's handling of this affair impugns one's self-image suggests a need to think clearly about the distinctions one makes between being a fan, on one hand, and the team, sport administrators, and University, on the other hand. We're talking about college sports here, one needs to keep perspective.


A friendly reminder. We do not allow bashing of Ohio State players, coaches, or sports administrators at BP. It is possible that briefings given to the players did not make the infractions clear. Can they sell a pair of their shoes? If Boom Herron buys a used car with his summer job earnings, can he sell it? Did the person who gave a particular brief just do a bad job on the day?


The point that I make is that there are a few folks riding very high horses on BP. As I read their posts, it seems very clear that none of them have any personal experience of what happened.


Do I personally think that the players must have suspected that what they were doing was wrong? Yes, but that is irrelevant. Do I think that Gene Smith may have been covering for his team by throwing his compliance team under the bus (possibly with their permission, they also are part of the team) and that he might have chosen a poor joke to bring the offense into perspective? Yes, it's possible, but that gives me no basis for questioning his integrity or, more importantly, intent.


But to be embarrassed about his behavior? Think about what you are saying folks, just think about it. Perhaps a few people of like mind are repping you but how will you rep yourself years from now?


If you have objective information that proves Gene Smith lied about the content of the briefings given to players, then by all means bring it forward for us all to see. If not, and you'd like to bash Ohio State players, coaches, or administrators, then I suggest you take the discussion to that other board or ESPiN. This is not the place.


Well said.
As for suspending them for the bowl, I've been thinking about what has been said and I have a conspiracy theory for everyone.

I think we can all agree that 6 games would be too many right?

If the NCAA is insisting that these guys play in the bowl game, it's presumably for the economic interests of sponsors and the NCAA.

If Tress suspended them for the game (that he's not going to has been covered, but hypothetically), why would the NCAA, who Tress just royally pissed off by explicitly going against their "orders", be lenient on these players?

IMO, if we suspended them, the NCAA would be petty (hard to imagine I know) and punish these players more by not only not reducing the suspension on appeal, but also not counting the bowl game towards it.

Now, if these guys all jump, they will avoid punishment. It's important to note that Tress wanted to suspend them for the bowl. This would've been fair and appropriate. We don't live in an ideal world, and they're doing what they think is best for everyone involved.

What the kids did was wrong, but it wasn't 6 games wrong.

Sorry if this has been rehashed a few times, but I didn't recall seeing this point anywhere.
 
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MaxBuck;1841646; said:
I'm left wondering why you haven't been banned. This is inflammatory, uncalled for and insulting. Gene Smith is, after all, a Buckeye.

I disagree. Smith has been roundly criticized both outside of and within the university for his performance at that press conference. It was an embarrassment, and I don't see why he can't bee held accountable here. Karen Holbrokk was, as with Smith solely by virtue of her paycheck, a buckeye, yet there was far harsher invective directed towards her in these forums than Gene Smith has endured.
 
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Buckeye2223;1841690; said:
How can you be embarrased by Gene? He's basically trying to get as much heat off the players as he can. He's willing to look like an idiot so the team has the chance to not suffer as much. I say well done Gene! And BTW I am new here and not sure if using the word "heat" while talking any Ohio sport is allowed because of LBJ. If it was bad then please forgive me and i wont use it again. lol

How? By throwing loyal university employees who work quietly for a fraction of his salary under the bus in a national press conference. Please don't excuse the man's incompetence in that press conference for some form of misguided nobility.
 
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Buckeye2223;1841690; said:
How can you be embarrased by Gene? He's basically trying to get as much heat off the players as he can. He's willing to look like an idiot so the team has the chance to not suffer as much. I say well done Gene! And BTW I am new here and not sure if using the word "heat" while talking any Ohio sport is allowed because of LBJ. If it was bad then please forgive me and i wont use it again. lol

Steve19;1841708; said:
Gene Smith is one of the most respected sports administrators in the country. Andy Geiger, that class act hounded out of his job on spurious allegations "loss of control", set the stage for a golden era in Ohio State sports. Under Gene Smith's administration, it has born fruit--not only in football and basketball but across the panoply of Ohio State sports.

Live long enough and you will see the circle of life more clearly. At a time when Ohio State University athletics is enjoying one of it's greatest golden eras, it is not surprising to see the bile that some folks seem so willing to spill.
As a boy, I sat in the barber shop on Oakland Park Avenue, listening to the old men talk down Woody Hayes. They all knew better than Woody.They were embarrassed when his teams did not win the Big Ten. They bayed for his job with a great passion, which would be exceeded by their impassioned grief whenhe stood before them with tears in his eyes "after dotting the i" and they remembered what they had done. I never forgot the things that they said and how they argued with my father while I waited for my haircut. How strange it was to hear how they remembered the things they said so long ago, when they told stories about their undying support for Woody and John Cooper "not getting it".

These great "Ohio State fans" spoke with even more passion about the need to fire Fred Taylor, Ohio State's first baseball All-American and coach of a national championship team. As I write, Fred Taylor stares back from a few feet away, as he was when I snapped the picture courtside during an Ohio State game. Looking at the picture reminds me of his incredible generosity but I also see a sadness in his eye and a weariness that I was too young to see as a child.


What might Taylor have achieved if Athletics Director Ed Weaver supported him after his team was attacked and beaten up at Minnesota? What would have been the destiny of the only coach who rivaled the great Adolph Rupp in his day?


How will Buckeye fans remember their behavior today when this golden era comes to its end, as all golden eras must?


For any fan to be embarrassed by Gene Smith's behavior is quite frankly ridiculous. Feeling that Smith's handling of this affair impugns one's self-image suggests a need to think clearly about the distinctions one makes between being a fan, on one hand, and the team, sport administrators, and University, on the other hand. We're talking about college sports here, one needs to keep perspective.


A friendly reminder. We do not allow bashing of Ohio State players, coaches, or sports administrators at BP. It is possible that briefings given to the players did not make the infractions clear. Can they sell a pair of their shoes? If Boom Herron buys a used car with his summer job earnings, can he sell it? Did the person who gave a particular brief just do a bad job on the day?


The point that I make is that there are a few folks riding very high horses on BP. As I read their posts, it seems very clear that none of them have any personal experience of what happened.


Do I personally think that the players must have suspected that what they were doing was wrong? Yes, but that is irrelevant. Do I think that Gene Smith may have been covering for his team by throwing his compliance team under the bus (possibly with their permission, they also are part of the team) and that he might have chosen a poor joke to bring the offense into perspective? Yes, it's possible, but that gives me no basis for questioning his integrity or, more importantly, intent.


But to be embarrassed about his behavior? Think about what you are saying folks, just think about it. Perhaps a few people of like mind are repping you but how will you rep yourself years from now?


If you have objective information that proves Gene Smith lied about the content of the briefings given to players, then by all means bring it forward for us all to see. If not, and you'd like to bash Ohio State players, coaches, or administrators, then I suggest you take the discussion to that other board or ESPiN. This is not the place.

We'll have to agree to disagree on gs and what kind of legacy he's inherited or is building. One question though. Even if the compliance was incompetent in this regard, doesn't the buck for that failure stop at the ad's desk? It is one of hisl departments, so a slight bit of personal responsibility on the part of the ad would be somewhat reassuring.
 
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Colvinnl;1841776; said:
Too bad Archdeacon does not seem to know that Lou Holtz has been on tv saying this is a different situation, defending playing the players in the Sugar Bowl and arguing that the punishment is excessive.

Why would anyone listen to what Lou Holtz had to say about doing right relating to NCAA violations. He left a trail of colleges on probation everywhere he went. Instead of "do right rule" Holtz should have followed the "don't be stupid rule" I always thought it was stupid that he got all those schools in trouble as I believe him to be a very good football mind and coach and never needed to break/bend the rules. But he did it anyway. Everywhere, like he couldn't help himself. ESPN is dumb for even letting him comment on other schools rule violations.

If you take all the statements made by everyone and combine them into one theme and must stick some heads on a pike, it seems to me the several compliance personnel would nee to be the place to look. If the players really didn't know the rules, then look to those charged with making sure they do. As I understand it, there are 3-6 people (I've seen both numbers reported) charged with making sure the players know the rules and don't break them. Tough job with a bunch of kids, but hey, that's what they get paid for.

The players always need time to appeal and I believe that is why they didn't get banned from the bowl game. I don't know how the word got out as to what they did, (i know they were old violations but when did the authorities find out and how) but it wasn't like watching them KO someone after a game on national TV. Therefore it must have been someone reporting them, they have a right to know who and a chance to present their side of the story and appeal the case.

If JT or GS know more than what is reported, then it is up to them to do what they think is right. They are good guys who aren't cheaters, I'm willing to let it sit with them.

As for the players leaving for the NFL, that is possible and you can't make a kid stay even if they need to. But...Pryor isn't ready, Herron probably is, but really hasn't had the opportunity to really show what he can do, Adams had a less than stellar year and has yet to live up to his unbelievable potential, and DP has had a couple big drops in big games this year and unless he really puts it together in the bowl game should come back. If we lose them its probably their loss not tOSU's and best of luck to them. IMO football, for most of them, is part of the education they need to complete before being successful at the next level.
 
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Well said.
As for suspending them for the bowl, I've been thinking about what has been said and I have a conspiracy theory for everyone.

I think we can all agree that 6 games would be too many right?

If the NCAA is insisting that these guys play in the bowl game, it's presumably for the economic interests of sponsors and the NCAA.

If Tress suspended them for the game (that he's not going to has been covered, but hypothetically), why would the NCAA, who Tress just royally pissed off by explicitly going against their "orders", be lenient on these players?

IMO, if we suspended them, the NCAA would be petty (hard to imagine I know) and punish these players more by not only not reducing the suspension on appeal, but also not counting the bowl game towards it.

Now, if these guys all jump, they will avoid punishment. It's important to note that Tress wanted to suspend them for the bowl. This would've been fair and appropriate. We don't live in an ideal world, and they're doing what they think is best for everyone involved.

What the kids did was wrong, but it wasn't 6 games wrong.

Sorry if this has been rehashed a few times, but I didn't recall seeing this point anywhere.
The sponsors have already sold their ads for the Sugar Bowl. Our players playing or sitting has nothing to do with money, as hard as it is for even me to believe.
 
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