5 players suspended for 5 games in 2011 regular season (Appeal has been denied)

[3074326]

This is crap. I'm so disappointed. Not so much in the players, but the NCAA. With reason, think about this. If I gave you a ring. And you wanted to buy a necklace for your mother, or for yourself, it really doesn't matter. And you sold it for the money, am I going to raise a stink? No. It's yours, that is why I gave it to you.

1) How can you not be disappointed in the players that much?
2) Getting a ring from a stranger is nothing like getting gold pants for beating your school's biggest rival, getting a sportsmanship trophy for playing on one of the biggest games in all of football or getting a ring for winning the Big Ten title.
3) Selling gifts is selfish and disrespectful, especially when it affects the future of 80 teammates.

I'm so disappointed in these guys. Lost a lot of respect for them. Far more disappointed in them as people than I am that they won't be playing next year for a handful of games.

I've always been sad when seeing players sell stuff like this. At other schools too.

 

[osucollegebuck]

The only time gold pants should ever change ownership is for a player to give it to their mother or close family member.

 

[greyscarlet]

So let's think about what Ohio State will likely do to mitigate the damage (from a monetary perspective as is always the case).
1) Sit the players for the bowl game- Ohio State and the big ten will still get the bowl money. The ratings may drop but that impacts the network and bowl, as well as a small hit to future payouts to the schools and conferences.
2) Appeal- It is very reasonable to expect one game next year to be reduced regardless and the bowl game to count as 2 or even 3 games towards next year, which makes the hit to next year only 1 or 2 games. The 3rd game is @ Miami and everyone, including the NCAA, wants that game to get high ratings for the money (much like they are trying to push for the bowl game). tOSU in BCS bowls is a cash cow for all involved and few people will attempt to block that likelyhood over tattoos and selling of trinkets.

As an additional mitigating factor in good faith Ohio State should maintain possession of all reward items (rings, pants, trophys, etc) until the end of a players career with the school, no need to shove the apple of temptation into their hands.

 

[buckford]

The disparity between the Cam Newton situation and Tatoo-gate is laughable. Hustling a ballplayer vs ballplayers hustling their jewelry. I am not defending either. I just wonder about NCAA credibility.

 

[ysubuck]

The NCAA seems to be the institution that is taking the real beating in all of this (which is a welcome change from the talking heads ripping the coach, players, etc.).

I don't have a problem with players selling their "mementos" as much as other people. Those items (gold pants, championship rings) always seem to hold more sentiment with fans than they do to those who actually earned them on the playing field. They belong to the players and the players should be able to do with them what they want.

It's kind of like wins and losses. Wins and losses always affect the fans more than they do the players involved in those contests. Fans want the players to be as emotionally involved in their team as we are and that just isn't the case. Many of us care WAY more about those gold pants than the guys who own them.

It's what makes us fans.

 

[3074326]

The NCAA seems to be the institution that is taking the real beating in all of this (which is a welcome change from the talking heads ripping the coach, players, etc.).

I don't have a problem with players selling their "mementos" as much as other people. Those items (gold pants, championship rings) always seem to hold more sentiment with fans than they do to those who actually earned them on the playing field. They belong to the players and the players should be able to do with them what they want.

It's kind of like wins and losses. Wins and losses always affect the fans more than they do the players involved in those contests. Fans want the players to be as emotionally involved in their team as we are and that just isn't the case. Many of us care WAY more about those gold pants than the guys who own them.

It's what makes us fans.

I don't understand how it could mean less to the people who put all that time and effort into something as important as a win in The Game. I don't think The Game itself means any less to the players than it does the fans, why would the rewards from them?

Apparently it means less to some of them though.. disappointing.

EDIT: I'm not really disagreeing with you here, just trying to understand what the fuck these guys were thinking. It's one of those things that I just can't understand. Never will, either. I can't imagine giving up certain things I own. Like my first guitar. It's an awful guitar, but the sentimental value it holds makes it something I'll own forever.

 

[yt6]

So I have been a Buckeye fan since birth, played college athletics and professional athletics for 14 years. There are clearly two sides to the idea of awards and the value of the actual trophy,ring or award.

First, you work very hard for them and they represent something a very significant accomplishment in your life. They represent team work, success and memories of a great season you had.

Second, however, at the end of the day they are not as valuable as family and relationships. If your family is struggling in some way, and you feel the urgency around helping the needs of those you love, you look for ways to help them. The stuff you have pales in comparison to the needs of your loved ones.

Now if anyone reading this won a great award at work, and were honored with a valuable prize for it. And then lets say your wife or kids becomes sick and needs help, there is not a single person reading this that would not sell everything they had or needed to sell to help the ones you loved. You would not leave a 1,000 watch or award on your shelf while your family struggles to make it through a trial.

Now, realize that these kids are 19 years old, their hands are completely tied to making money, working etc. They had a way to help their families and a way to step into the needs of the people they love. It doesn't seem like they knew they were violating a rule by selling this stuff to help their families. If they did, I would imagine they would not have done it,

These awards mean far more to these players than to you and I. Trust me, I love beating Michigan and winning championships as much as the next guy. But these are the guys that put in the blood and sweat and time to win these things. So none of us should start to assume these things are not valuable to them.

I would just remind you that you and I would sell whatever we had to help our family when they are need. to say otherwise is untruthful

 

[Tlangs]

They served the same punishment.

The difference is that Green's suspension started immediately. Your guys can play in the bowl game. Granted, Green's issue was discovered right before the season started, and not in late December.

Your guys got one more game because they continued to hide what they had done from your compliance people after they (the players involved) learned - for sure learned - that what they had done was prohibited.

Mark May is an idiot, and what he says may not be accurate, but the Green case is not a good example of why tOSU got treated unfairly. The real value of the A.J. Green case is that after the ruling came down suspending the star receiver, EVERYBODY knew that it was improper to sell your stuff and that it would lead to a suspension.

Your guys kept mum. That is why they got the extra game suspension.

I'm not familiar with the AJ Green story. So am I to beleive that AJ Green knocked on the Athletic Directors door and said, "I think I did something wrong and sold my Jersey". Or were there internet reports, tv stories, and news articles that said something is wrong in Athens which started an investigation, then came clean.

Unless AJ knocked on the door and brought it up himself with no external pressure, he should have gotten the extra game for not coming clean.

In my IMO, the additional game is bogus. No one is coming clean to get a 4 game suspension when the penalty for not coming clean is only 1 additional game. I'd roll the dice on not getting caught as well. Thee NCAA should have a whistle blower clause. If you realize you did something wrong and turn yourself in, 2 game suspension, pay it back and include in the rule if bowl games are to be included in the suspension or not. I don't care either way, but at least have the rule in writing that the bowl game is to be included, is not to be included, or is at the discretion of the university/conference comish.

 

[greyscarlet]

I don't understand how it could mean less to the people who put all that time and effort into something as important as a win in The Game. I don't think The Game itself means any less to the players than it does the fans, why would the rewards from them?

Apparently it means less to some of them though.. disappointing.

EDIT: I'm not really disagreeing with you here, just trying to understand what the fuck these guys were thinking. It's one of those things that I just can't understand. Never will, either. I can't imagine giving up certain things I own. Like my first guitar. It's an awful guitar, but the sentimental value it holds makes it something I'll own forever.

Surely here are a vast array of feelings on these things amongst the players, as there are with the fans, after all we're humans. I'm sure many players don't care about "things", they will always have the memories. Some players play the game for love, others for money (to be rich or simply a means to support a family and put food on the table), others for school, others for fame. What one person sees as important another sees as meaningless. If the helping the parents thing is true, I don't have a problem with it at all, even if it is against the ncaa rules. If the ncaa cared so much they simply wouldn't allow the items to be distributed until leaving the schools.

 

[Diego-Bucks]

I don't understand how it could mean less to the people who put all that time and effort into something as important as a win in The Game. I don't think The Game itself means any less to the players than it does the fans, why would the rewards from them?

Apparently it means less to some of them though.. disappointing.

EDIT: I'm not really disagreeing with you here, just trying to understand what the fuck these guys were thinking. It's one of those things that I just can't understand. Never will, either. I can't imagine giving up certain things I own. Like my first guitar. It's an awful guitar, but the sentimental value it holds makes it something I'll own forever.

I understand where you are coming from. But I think its not right to expect other people to share a viewpoint (i.e. the value of trophies) and then judge them when they don't have that viewpoint.

For me, I was raised in some difficult financial circumstances, not as bleak as some, but plenty difficult. Bankruptcies, multiple moves for financial reasons, living above our means so I could go to a better public school system. I would sell my diploma (the piece of paper) if there were a good market for it. Its just physical material that is meant to remind somebody what they achieved. And at the end of the day the bills don't pay themselves.

I won't fault these 5 guys for selling there trophies when I'd do it as well, and many of us would in certain circumstances.

However, they violated rules and need to serve an appropriate punishment. I'd start with the bowl game and probably do the first 2 or 3 games of 2011. 5 games is very harsh for a rule that defines what isn't deemed acceptable private property to sell and that has much ambiguity. The fact of the matter is, they probably were aware they ought not to do it due to a rulebook; but they disagreed that they had the right to sell what they owned.

 

[Ryan36_1]

I read that the appeal will last into the Summer. Which is really helpful to the players who have to declare by Jan 15th. I realize that these players are reaping what they sowed(sew?), but this like a state governor telling an inmate scheduled to be executed next week that he will consider the appeal in a few months.

On a somewhat related note, what happens to juniors that declare in Jan, if the CBA is not renewed when it expires in March? Will it be like basketball rules and be whether they hire an agent or not, or are they ineligible and in limbo for a year?

 

[Nutriaitch]

This is crap. I'm so disappointed. Not so much in the players, but the NCAA. With reason, think about this. If I gave you a ring. And you wanted to buy a necklace for your mother, or for yourself, it really doesn't matter. And you sold it for the money, am I going to raise a stink? No. It's yours, that is why I gave it to you.
I don't understand how they can be penalized for what they do with items under their possession.

simple.

allowing them to sell this stuff opens the door to all kinds of potential problems.

if TP was allowed to sell his gold pants, an agent (or booster) can give him 50 grand for them. Throw down another $100k for one of his rings, etc. etc.

your average 3rd string OL might get 75 bucks for the pants.

makes it way to easy to abuse the system and pay these kids big $$ "legally"

 

[greyscarlet]

simple.

allowing them to sell this stuff opens the door to all kinds of potential problems.

if TP was allowed to sell his gold pants, an agent (or booster) can give him 50 grand for them. Throw down another $100k for one of his rings, etc. etc.

your average 3rd string OL might get 75 bucks for the pants.

makes it way to easy to abuse the system and pay these kids big $$ "legally"

Definetely opens the door to Boosters, can you imagine what the SEC players (or parents there of) could make off their rings?

 

[cincibuck]

Random thoughts centered, I think, on the issue:

1. It would seem that gold pants don't mean squat when Michigan isn't Michigan.

2. When the Athletic Department prostitutes itself by letting Nike dictate the uniform to be worn for a Michigan game you have to believe the players feel the right to profit too.

3. It's confusing to remember that the NCAA owns the teams, but the BCS owns the bowls.

4. Why, if you're coaching kids, wouldn't you post no - nos along with all the motivation signs? And why wouldn't you have the compliance folks in to give a detailed - 'you can do this, you can't do this,' talk to the team and their parents?

 

[buckeyefool]

Random thoughts centered, I think, on the issue:

1. It would seem that gold pants don't mean squat when Michigan isn't Michigan.

2. When the Athletic Department prostitutes itself by letting Nike dictate the uniform to be worn for a Michigan game you have to believe the players feel the right to profit too.

3. It's confusing to remember that the NCAA owns the teams, but the BCS owns the bowls.

4. Why, if you're coaching kids, wouldn't you post no - nos along with all the motivation signs? And why wouldn't you have the compliance folks in to give a detailed - 'you can do this, you can't do this,' talk to the team and their parents?

They do this, they go over the rules focusing on different things. Can't really post the rules n teh wall when there are thousands of them. OSU basicly said in the presser yesterday, we didn't focus on this particular rule enough before a certain time, and then we started to focus on it.