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2010 tOSU Offense Discussion

2nd and Long

The following is based on going through the play-by-play for each game, so there may be a mistake or three

Tressel-ball isn't dead; it's just wearing a good disguise.

Second and long is a passing down, right? Not to Bollman and Tressel.


The Buckeyes have faced 2nd down after no-gain or a loss on first down 35 times by my count (this includes two 2nd-and-goal situations, from the 6 and 7 yard-lines respectively). Of these 35 2nd-down plays, the play-calling went:
  • 14 Passes (On 6 of these series they eventually got a first down)
  • 21 Runs (On 10 of these series they eventually got a first down)
What's interesting is how it breaks down by how they arrived at 2nd-and-long (defined as no-gain or a loss on first down).
When 1st down was a sack or run
(clock running)
  • 7 Passes, one a shovel pass (3 eventual first downs)
  • 7 Runs (3 eventual first downs)
When 1st down was an incomplete pass
(clock stopped)
  • 7 Passes, 2 of which were at the end of a half when there wasn't much time for running the ball, 2 others resulted in sacks and another in a PI call (3 eventual first downs, all vs. EMU)
  • 14 Runs (7 eventual first downs)
  • Since the state of the clock has such a profound effect on the play-calling, it seems that Bolls and JT are still subscribing to the Tressel-ball principle of keeping the clock running.
Not only were there only 3 successful series that began with an incomplete pass and continued with a pass-play called on 2nd down, and not only did all 3 occur vs. EMU (as bolded above), not only was one of those 3 the pass-interference call on Posey; the other two (the last such downs faced by the Buckeyes) were the only passes this year on 2nd-and-10-or-more that were completed for more than 3 yards, with the sole exception being the 47 yard shovel pass to Boom vs. Miami (which is really an option play).

Conservative play-calling aside, the Buckeyes are moving the chains 50% of the time when they run on 2nd-and-10 following an incompletion. All things considered, the results have been pretty good.

EDIT:

The results of the plays:
When passing on 2nd and long after a rush or sack:
3-for-7
53 yards
No Sacks
When passing on 2nd and long after an incompletion:
4-for-4
32 yards
2 Sacks for -19 yards
1 PI call (on the defense)



When rushing on 2nd and long after a rush or sack:
7 rushes for 21 yards (3.0 ypc)
When rushing on 2nd and long after an incompletion
14 rushes for 56 yards (4.0 ypc)
(Sack yardage not included)

 
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Detroit Sports Talk Radio (1130 AM) was going on about the "classless" way OSU 'ran up the score' against EMU. Normally sean Baligian is a pretty good commentator, but I just don't think he saw the game.

a minute later his co-host was saying "it's impossible to call if running up the score if you are doing it in the third quarter" , even though the play they were focusing on, Hall's throw back to Pryor, occured in the Third Quarter.

I think they were just upset that OSU outscore scUM on Saturday.

I got to work and was going to email them but it's blocked by my employer!

I'll have to do it from home tonight.

The way they were talking about Tressel, you'd think he was Jerry Tarkanian.

I guess they just don't know what to make of OSU this year.

I'll make an early prediction for The Game: OSU 223-0!
 
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DBB - that's been my sense of it re:

Since the state of the clock has such a profound effect on the play-calling, it seems that Bolls and JT are still subscribing to the Tressel-ball principle of keeping the clock running.

I don't think Ohio State is running anything particularly different this season thus far. I just think they've been executing better. Sure, there have been a couple of "tricks" - the pitch to Boom that you mention, Hall to Pryor.... but Ohio State ran a couple similar things in years past too, so....
 
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UpNorthBuckeye;1781305; said:
Detroit Sports Talk Radio (1130 AM) was going on about the "classless" way OSU 'ran up the score' against EMU. Normally sean Baligian is a pretty good commentator, but I just don't think he saw the game.

WTF???? Did he watch the Michigan game??? Dick Wod went for it on 4th down from the 7 with 3 minutes left and and Gardner scored a TD to go up 65-21!
 
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I hope the running game picks up as the year goes on like last year. Seems like our main running threat is TP so far on broken plays. We have so much talent on the oline and at the running back position, not sure why we arent blowing teams off the line of scrimmage like late last year, even though I know JT likes to peak at the end of the season.

I would love to see us run more counter plays. Seems like that element gets lost too often. I also expect Saine to have a big game he is do. Hope we run for 300 on Illinois. Go Bucks
 
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I'm really at a loss for words at this offense. I love the production but I'm baffled by trying to forecast what this offense will look like in the next couple of weeks. Part of me thinks that JT has used these early games as a tune up for the passing game, particularly the protection and Terrelle's accuracy. We haven't really been targeting many people outside of Devier, Jake, and Dane.
Another part of me thinks that JT is simply taking what defenses are giving him. You want to load the box with 8 and stuff the holes with your LBers? Okay, we'll just pass the ball. I think that teams will continue to do this because of Terrelle's past tendancy to break down under pressure in the pocket while looking downfield.

I'd really like to see us establish the run because I think that like last year, we can dominate and cripple defenses with our rush attack. But at the same time, I'm not at all worried about this offense finding ways to score. We saw the hurry up last week. Holy shit, that would be so effective,even against better opponents. I'm just really looking forward to seeing where this offense moves from here.
 
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UpNorthBuckeye;1781305; said:
Detroit Sports Talk Radio (1130 AM) was going on about the "classless" way OSU 'ran up the score' against EMU. Normally sean Baligian is a pretty good commentator, but I just don't think he saw the game.

a minute later his co-host was saying "it's impossible to call if running up the score if you are doing it in the third quarter" , even though the play they were focusing on, Hall's throw back to Pryor, occured in the Third Quarter.

I think they were just upset that OSU outscore scUM on Saturday.

I got to work and was going to email them but it's blocked by my employer!

I'll have to do it from home tonight.

The way they were talking about Tressel, you'd think he was Jerry Tarkanian.

I guess they just don't know what to make of OSU this year.

I'll make an early prediction for The Game: OSU 223-0!

Jealousy...plain and simple and oh yeah Baligian=pole smoker.

That is all.
 
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guys. we have a running game. it just looks different than in years past because this year isn't a tailback centered running game. this is a Terrelle Pryor centered offense, and Terrelle Pryor IS part of the running game. who ultimately moved the chains on the ground to run out the clock in the Rose Bowl? Terrelle Pryor. who moved the chains on the ground to run out the clock against Miami? Terrelle Pryor. the Buckeyes currently rank 14th in the nation in rushing offense at 240 yards per game. make no mistake about it. we can run the ball.
 
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lvbuckeye;1782011; said:
guys. we have a running game. it just looks different than in years past because this year isn't a tailback centered running game. this is a Terrelle Pryor centered offense, and Terrelle Pryor IS part of the running game. who ultimately moved the chains on the ground to run out the clock in the Rose Bowl? Terrelle Pryor. who moved the chains on the ground to run out the clock against Miami? Terrelle Pryor. the Buckeyes currently rank 14th in the nation in rushing offense at 240 yards per game. make no mistake about it. we can run the ball.

I don't think TP's ability to run the ball has ever been in question. But it is a concern simply because of the hits QBs take and their overall value to the offense. Tressel said it himself that he doesn't want his QB rushing the ball more than 10-12 times a game. As we have seen in years past, this offense is predicated upon long drives and being more physical than other teams. We don't want our QB being the one dishing out or receiving big hits.

It would be nice if we could count on our running backs to put us in good situations on second and third downs to convert and renew the drive. I've said that our running game didn't really get going until Illinois last year and that I think we will be able to pick things back up when needed. But it's still somewhat of a concern because we don't want to solely depend of Terrelle to carry this team.

Right now, it looks like the passing game has arrived. But lets see how things shape up if teams stop GIVING us the pass. Like I said, we're gonna keep throwing until teams show us they will respect it. Whether we can run the ball at that point is a valid concern, but I think we will be just fine. In fact, I think we will be better than last year. Why the hell wouldn't we be? It's not like our guys have gotten worse for crying out loud. The same people that are now crying about Saine getting carries over Herron are the same people that were crying about Herron getting carries over Saine. Jordan Hall and Jaamal Berry will get their looks, but we shouldn't go blow our loads over what they do when the game is in hand, the other team is demoralized, etc.
 
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cbrian815;1781830; said:
I would love to see us run more counter plays. Seems like that element gets lost too often. I also expect Saine to have a big game he is do. Hope we run for 300 on Illinois. Go Bucks

We ran a counter on the 4th and 1 play in the first half. Me likey.
 
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284 yards of offense against Ill. I am confused and refuse to make excuses for such a bad performance. We were not playing the 2009 USC Trojan defense. I am sure it was just the wind keeping all that 5 star talent bottled up or that amazing coach Ron Zook. I was really hoping the play calling and execution had found something this year. I am sure it was just because Zook had 2 weeks to prepare. Didn't we look at the Mizzou film? We put 30 on them last year in a monsoon. This was a step backward for a staff and offense that should be punishing teams. Go Bucks
 
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1. TP threw a really bad INT
2. TP got hurt
3. Bauserman is no kind of answer, for sure
4. It was really windy

With all that, and the defense controllig them really well after that first drive, JT just decided to make sure to win the game, stats be damned.

It took Herron a while to get going. The outside cuts were there all along for the most part. I think once he got the feel that their edge players were crashing down to the inside, he started to bounce it out on those last 2 drives, and had good success.

The only thing that really had me scratching my head is: why go for 4th and 1 and then not try to score? Is it worth that much risk just to run another couple of minutes off the clock?
 
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NightmaresDad;1784551; said:
The only thing that really had me scratching my head is: why go for 4th and 1 and then not try to score? Is it worth that much risk just to run another couple of minutes off the clock?

at that point in the game, absolutely. illinois was going to be down by more than a field goal no matter what happened, so the more time you run off the clock the fewer drives illinois was going to get. plus if illinois scores on their next drive following a missed FG, you still have time for a drive to win it or tie.

if you don't go for it on 4th, illinois probably has another extra drive in the game to work with. Forget it Nightmare. It's Tresselballtown.
 
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NightmaresDad;1784551; said:
1. TP threw a really bad INT
2. TP got hurt
3. Bauserman is no kind of answer, for sure
4. It was really windy

With all that, and the defense controllig them really well after that first drive, JT just decided to make sure to win the game, stats be damned.


Exactly. I think that with the wind and just how the game was flowing, at some point Tressel said fuck this I'm just gonna get out of here with a win and live to play another day...

Smart move. We all know how good we can be guys...
 
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Electron Boy;1784763; said:
at that point in the game, absolutely. illinois was going to be down by more than a field goal no matter what happened, so the more time you run off the clock the fewer drives illinois was going to get. plus if illinois scores on their next drive following a missed FG, you still have time for a drive to win it or tie.

if you don't go for it on 4th, illinois probably has another extra drive in the game to work with. Forget it Nightmare. It's Tresselballtown.

If you're running out the game, like against scUM south, then sure.
But you need points in this case. There was still too much time left for another 3 downs to take enough time off - unless you score more points there. (which thankfully we did)
You're only up by 4, and last I checked, a TD is worth more than that for the other team. Why give the other team a scenario where they can win?

I was all for going for it on 4th down. Then I would have tried my hardest to score a TD and put the game out of reach.
If IL would have scored a TD instead of a FG there at the end, you'd be singing a different tune.
 
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