Who Owes Who?

[LostLassie]

http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-...-umpire-helps-save-woman-on-pittsburgh-bridge

Tumpane and the others held tight until emergency workers arrived and got the woman back over the railing. But Tumpane still didn't walk away.

"I went up to her, because, you know she said, 'You'll just forget me after this.' And I said, 'No, I'll never forget you.'"

Here's hoping she was wrong about that. Pretty sure the lady wasn't talking about him remembering to recount the story at high-end cocktail parties for years to come. I'd like to see a follow-up article a year from now about how the people who stopped her on the bridge had visited her in the hospital, had invested the time to listen to why she was ready to go, had stayed in touch, and had put in the effort to successfully connected her to resources that addressed her problems and gave her a reason to be here. There's more to saving a life than just keeping someone breathing.

I seem to remember a folk belief, sometimes attributed to the Chinese, that once you save a person's life, you are the one with the debt, not them. You've acted to keep them here. You are now responsible to them for the rest of their life.

(I know this article is already posted in JWinslow's thread. I'm following my own advice, and keeping the argumentativeness out of there. )

 

[ORD_Buckeye]

Whom

 

[BUCKYLE]

Whom'st'd've

 

[BUCKYLE]

 

[BUCKYLE]

But seriously, I remember reading something about suicide statistics and I believe that the gist of it is that when most people are not able to commit suicide easily, they usually don't.

https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/means-matter/means-matter/survival/


There's also the whole suicide barrier thing on bridges/tall structures. From what I remember, the building of barriers on popular sites for jumping reduced suicide rates in that area.

So it would seem to me that while the person attempting suicide may not necessarily owe their...rescuer (?) anything, the person whom'st prevented a suicide definitely doesn't owe anyone anything imo.

"Suuure, you saved me from killing myself but what have you done for me lately"

 

[buckeyebri]

But what have you done for me lately"

 

[LostLassie]

"Suuure, you saved me from killing myself but what have you done for me lately"

Guess it's a difference in perspective. I look on suicide in the same way I see euthanasia--a personal choice, if not a right.

I don't look on it so much as "saving" someone from killing themselves as I do forcing them to continue enduring a life they'd chosen to forfeit. In the same sense as euthanasia for a terminally ill individual, anyone other than the person choosing suicide isn't the one who has to live in that body, in those circumstances, with that pain. Who the hell are any of us to presume to decide for another what amount of anguish they have to bear? Once someone has intervened to prevent an end to another's life, I do think it a bit arrogant to pull them back from the brink and then walk away. "No escape for you, booboo. Now get back in there and keep experiencing the hell that drove you to the edge. I've decided you should have to, but don't expect any help from me to make your unbearable burden lighter. I'm gonna mosey along while congratulating myself on my good deed, and you can stay behind here being crushed under the agony that is your continuing life. You're welcome." So, yeah. You've taken on something of the responsibility of causing someone to be born into the world. There's a life here that wouldn't be here otherwise. I think you have some of the same responsibility to them that you do to an actual newborn. You don't get to abandon them once they're here.

Whom

Point taken.

Generally, I do tend to use language here in a more colloquial manner than formal, ya' know, 'cause I don't wanna come off sounding like an elitist prick.

 

[BUCKYLE]

The fact that an overwhelming majority of those who fail at suicide attempts do not end up dying of suicide seems to indicate that even if it's a personal choice, it's usually not a personal choice one makes again. If someone is seriously committed to taking their own life, they probably won't be stopped. The ones who try, fail, and never try again, would probably argue against letting folks off themselves.

 

[martinss01]

But seriously, I remember reading something about suicide statistics and I believe that the gist of it is that when most people are not able to commit suicide easily, they usually don't.

https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/means-matter/means-matter/survival/

reading through this a bit now. but i wonder if a slightly different possible theory is being missed here. when it comes to suicide i personally have always felt there are 2 core groups of persons who attempt suicide. people who legitimately want to die and people who are desperately seeking help but don't know how/where to get it. the first group is generally speaking pretty successful first time through. the second set never really wanted to die to begin with, rather they wanted help. in their "attempt" they either died, got the help/needed attention they were seeking, or realized how much this type of action wasn't going to help them get what they were seeking. so the likelihood of someone from group b repeating this type of action would almost certainly be extremely low. survivors from group a would likely be dictated by the severity of any injuries sustained in the attempt and or medical care provided as a result of the attempt.