PBS Special on Mormon Church

[t_BuckeyeScott]

Look, I believe I gave the doctrine that a church must have to be considered Christian by the mainstream Christian church.

Jesus Christ, the one and only, God became a man and died on the cross atoning for the sins of all that whomever shall believe in him shall not parish but have everlasting life.

Though some differences occur between different denominations such as between Baptists, Presbyterians, Methodists, Non-denominational, Lutheran they all hold to this basic thing. Baptists believe Methodists are saved and vice versa. None of these groups would think that LDS are saved because of the difference in one and only God. Its that simple.

 

[Deety]

I understand sources can be flawed, perhaps you can set me straight... it's been a few years since I studied their theology directly (so I took the lazy route via google). Do they believe there are many gods, and we can become gods ourselves? If so, how does one mesh that with the 'one and only' teachings of JC?

There's a reason I no longer try to sift through this... it gives me headaches. There are probably better materials, but here are three goodies to keep you busy...

Some relatively basic info
This one is by a Catholic priest
Additional articles on theosis

This is a scholarly site and you'll get different views depending on the scholars. If taken as such, it's considered a good authority.

What confuses me is why afgolfer will not address these inconsistencies. If it really is a problem of 'lenses' or 'semantics' then where are the rebuttals?

I'm not sure where the line is concerning discussing Temple matters, but I'm going to guess you may be asking afgolfer to step over it.

 

[sandgk]

anyone can go to the temple before it is dedicated. and the only requirement to get into one afterwards is by getting a recommend from the Bishop -- no more, no less

That seems a little too damned formal for a Christian Church.

"when two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I"

Who needs a hall pass from a Bishop for goodness sake to start or join a Christian church?

Never before realized that there was such presumption in the entry requirements. agolfer - thanks for sharing.

 

[Gatorubet]

Im not saying your being 'too mean' for pointing out what you, others, or myself think are flaws in his beliefs.. the answers of your poll pretty much tell the story. Your trying to be cute & funny, and its stupid. now most of the debate in here hasn't been bad at all, but you seem to have at least one stupid ass paragraph per post. You didnt start this thread to have an intelligent debate or discusson. I mean your response to an offended member of the LDS church was:

{ "Life of Brian" pictures }

Which is all fine and well, but i thought it to be an asshole jesture along with the poll, and a few more response you tossed in.

Well, in my reply I was apologizing, and adding the "Life of Brian" pics as a way of saying it is oK to kid around with mainstream Christian theology too, and I added that as a Gatorubet mea culpa. Granted, you might not think me funny, that my sense of humor is nonexistant, and that I'm as asshole. Wait a minute - you DO think I'm an asshole. Well, you are wrong. You see, because of Golf and you, I now know that it is immaterial what the group consensus is on as issue, as long as you say it is something else. So while you and the rest of the world say "asshole", I say "brilliant satirist".... Man, you and Golf are on to something

 

[Bleed S & G]

Well, in my reply I was apologizing, and adding the "Life of Brian" pics as a way of saying it is oK to kid around with mainstream Christian theology too, and I added that as a Gatorubet mea culpa. Granted, you might not think me funny, that my sense of humor is nonexistant, and that I'm as asshole. Wait a minute - you DO think I'm an asshole. Well, you are wrong. You see, because of Golf and you, I now know that it is immaterial what the group consensus is on as issue, as long as you say it is something else. So while you and the rest of the world say "asshole", I say "brilliant satirist".... Man, you and Golf are on to something

I don't think you don't have a sense humor nor do i think your an asshole. "asshole jesture" is what i said.. hypothetically if 99.9% of the world thinks your an asshole, by your logic then yes you are.

Look, i don't think anything less of you for your opinions.. this is a message board and thats what its for obviously.. sure you're a smart guy, wouldnt go as far as "brilliant" :) on second thought if you're sharp you wouldn't be a gator fan

 

[jwinslow]

There's a reason I no longer try to sift through this... it gives me headaches. There are probably better materials, but here are three goodies to keep you busy...

 

[afgolfer]

Afgolfer, why didn't you address this? You claim this is what you want, a direct answer about what Christianity is... and why LDS does not fit the criteria (or come close).

Matthew 3:17 And lo a avoice from heaven, saying, This is my bbeloved cSon, in whom I am well pleased.

what is your interpretation of this verse -- if God came to earth as Jesus and they are the same IE the trinity, what is the meaning of this?

 

[Gatorubet]

Look, i don't think anything less of you for your opinions.. this is a message board and thats what its for obviously.. sure you're a smart guy, wouldnt go as far as "brilliant" :) on second thought if you're sharp you wouldn't be a gator fan

Define "Gator Fan"....

 

[afgolfer]

Mark 9: 7. 7 And there was a cloud that overshadowed them: and a voice came out of the cloud, saying, This is my beloved Son: hear him.





Luke 9: 35 (34-36). 35 And there came a voice out of the cloud, saying, This is my beloved Son: hear him.



as to the many gods, we worship one God and his son Jesus Christ -- who through his atonement , we may return to live with our heavenly father.

 

[afgolfer]

That seems a little too damned formal for a Christian Church.

"when two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I"

Who needs a hall pass from a Bishop for goodness sake to start or join a Christian church?

Never before realized that there was such presumption in the entry requirements. agolfer - thanks for sharing.

there is a simple list of questions they ask you like are you honest in your dealngas with your fellow man, are you chaste if you are ingle, or are you true to your wife if you are married, do you obey the words of wisdom (no drinking, smoking, illegal drugs)

Think about it, would you want to let someone in whos intent were to defile the temple or someone who would go in to cause a ruccuss? look at some of the streets in Utah during different events and the anti mormon demonstrations.

 

[Gatorubet]

there is a simple list of questions they ask you like are you honest in your dealngas with your fellow man, are you chaste if you are ingle, or are you true to your wife if you are married, do you obey the words of wisdom (no drinking, smoking, illegal drugs)

When Jesus changed water into more vino, was he wisdom deficient?

Think about it, would you want to let someone in whos intent were to defile the temple or someone who would go in to cause a ruccuss? look at some of the streets in Utah during different events and the anti mormon demonstrations.

Good point! Jesus made it a habit of only hanging out with the very best people.
And really, why would anyone want to enter a church except to defile it or cause a ruckus?

 

[afgolfer]

When Jesus changed water into more vino, was he wisdom deficient?



Good point! Jesus made it a habit of only hanging out with the very best people. And really, why would anyone want to enter a church except to defile it or cause a ruckus?

Water in that time was not really healthy to drink as thier as no way to purify the water effectively so a common substitute was juice -- due to the limit ways to keep it fresh it would ferment naturally, but the Wine of his time is not the same as wine of our time -- it is still the persons decision to make --

second point - what does that have to do with who we associate with? did i condemn anyone or say that we only associate with the best? Anyone can enter our church and attend meetings, sacrement, sunday school, and priesthood.

The temple and the church are two separte places with separate purposes. There is no restiction placed on who can attend our church

 

[Deety]

From what I understand, the restrictions on who enters the Temple are more accurately compared to those of marriage. There are in many religions privileges and responsibilities associated with marriage that are not (morally) available to those who have not entered into that covenant. Temple entry is similar - available to all believers, but requiring the appropriate covenants.

While the arguments and comparisons between religions are interesting, they strike me as highly unnecessary in this particular debate. If you believe Joseph Smith was a Prophet of God, then whatever is offered as restoration/revelation/etc. has to be accepted, and figuring out how everything fits together is an appropriate pursuit. If you don't, argument about the setup or doctrine of the Church is useless, because there is no basis for any of it.

 

[kinch]

. . . due to the limit ways to keep it fresh it would ferment naturally. . .

So are you arguing that Jesus could not turn water into fresh wine?

I'd expect more from my god.

 

[afgolfer]

who is to say that the term wine is not refering to juice (I know many will disagree with this, but think about it)