Our 2012 bowl game - at Hawaii?? (Not as 13th game, per NCAA sanctions)

[ScriptOhio]

I thought that if you scheduled Hawaii you were allowed to add them as a 13th game? I remember hearing that somewhere but I dont know if its true or not.

It is still in the bylaws.....

Alaska/Hawaii, Additional Football Contest.​

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Member institutions located in Alaska and Hawaii shall be permitted to exceed, by one, the maximum number of football contests permitted under Bylaw 17.9.5.1 but otherwise shall conform to the same maximum number of contests and dates of competition permitted other members of the Association.​

1. Bylaw 17.27.2 Alaska/Hawaii, Additional Football Contest." (PDF). 2011?12 NCAA Division I Manual. NCAA. p. 305. http://www.ncaapublications.com/productdownloads/D112.pdf. Retrieved September 22, 2011.
2. ^ "Bylaw 17.9.5.2 (j) Annual Exemptions: Hawaii, Alaska, Puerto Rico. (FBS/FCS)" (PDF). 2011?12 NCAA Division I Manual. NCAA. p. 264. http://www.ncaapublications.com/productdownloads/D112.pdf. Retrieved September 22, 2011.

 

[BB73]

Guess we would have to see how Ohio State's sanctions are written.

From tOSU's NCAA sanctions published today:

The institution's football team shall end its 2012 season with the playing of its last
regularly scheduled, in-season contest and shall not be eligible to participate in
any postseason competition or take advantage of any of the exemptions provided
in Bylaw 17.9.5.2, to include an end-of-season conference championship game.

NCAA.rulebook

17.9.5.2 Annual Exemptions. [FBS/FCS] The maximum number of football contests shall exclude the fol-
lowing:
(a) Spring Game. [FBS/FCS] One contest at the conclusion of the spring practice period [see Bylaw
17.11.4-(a)], provided the contest is against a team composed of bona fide alumni or students or both;
(Revised: 1/10/90)
(b) Heritage Bowl. [FBS/FCS] Participation in the Heritage Bowl held between representatives of the Mid-
Eastern Athletic Conference and the Southwestern Athletic Conference, which shall meet the reporting
requirements set forth in Bylaw 30.9 in order to be exempt; (Adopted: 1/10/91, Revised: 1/10/92)
(c) Twelve-Member Conference Championship Game. [FBS/FCS] A conference championship game
between division champions of a member conference of 12 or more institutions that is divided into two
divisions (of six or more institutions each), each of which conducts round-robin, regular-season competi-
tion among the members of that division;
(d) Championship Subdivision Conference Tournament. [FCS] A conference-sponsored, season-end-
ing postseason tournament (one between teams that are not identified until the end of the preceding
regular season), not to exceed one contest for any member institution. This provision does not preclude
an institution from participating in a conference-sponsored season-ending postseason tournament and
additional postseason football opportunities (e.g., NCAA Championship, Heritage Bowl) during the
same season; (Adopted: 1/16/93 effective 8/1/93, Revised: 1/13/98 effective 8/1/98, 2/16/00, 12/15/06)
(e) Bowl Games. [FBS] One postseason game approved by the Championships/Sports Management Cabi-
net (see 30.9); (Revised: 11/1/07 effective 8/1/08)
(f ) NCAA Championship. [FCS] Games played in the NCAA Division I Football Championship; (Revised:
12/15/06)
(g) NCAA Championship Play-In Competition. [FCS] Competition in play-in contests conducted before
NCAA championships;
(h) NAIA Championships. [FBS/FCS] Games played in the National Association of Intercollegiate Athlet-
ics (NAIA) football championship;
(i) Gridiron Classic. [FBS/FCS] Participation in the Gridiron Classic held between representatives from
the Northeast Conference and the Pioneer Football League; (Adopted: 4/25/02, Revised: 4/27/06)
(j) Foreign Tour. [FBS/FCS] The football games played on a foreign tour, provided the tour occurs only
once in a four-year period and is conducted by the member institution in accordance with the procedures
set forth in Bylaw 30.7 (see Bylaw 17.29);
(k) Hawaii, Alaska, Puerto Rico. [FBS/FCS] Any football games played in Hawaii, Alaska or Puerto Rico,
respectively, either against or under the sponsorship of an active member institution located in Hawaii,
Alaska or Puerto Rico, by a Division I member institution located outside the area in question;

 

[k2onprimetime]

Do you really think he would do something cool like this?

 

[808 Buck]

against a second-rate program

Jeez, could we just say non-BCS qualifying?


And BB73 delivers the final nail to this idea.

 

[MililaniBuckeye]

From tOSU's NCAA sanctions published today:

A game with Hawaii on Dec 8th would be a regular-season game.

 

[MililaniBuckeye]

Hawaii might be fun for the fans, but I don't think the players would be too excited for a faux bowl against a second-rate program, especially if they are 11-1 heading into that game.

I'd love to see a poll amongst the players and see what the consensus would be for a season-ending game at Hawaii.

 

[BB73]

A game with Hawaii on Dec 8th would be a regular-season game.

It would be a 13th game that would not be allowed, per the sanctions specifically mentioning section 17.9.5.2.

tOSU would have to cancel a currently scheduled game in order to play at Hawaii next year, the NCAA will not allow it as a 13th game.

 

[Jake]

A game with Hawaii on Dec 8th would be a regular-season game.

You didn't read BB73's entire post. The bylaw specifically addresses adding a regular season game in Hawaii, and the NCAA specifically said we could not add a game under that bylaw.

The institution's football team shall end its 2012 season with the playing of its last
regularly scheduled, in-season contest and shall not be eligible to participate in
any postseason competition or take advantage of any of the exemptions provided
in Bylaw 17.9.5.2, to include an end-of-season conference championship game.

and

17.9.5.2 Annual Exemptions. [FBS/FCS] The maximum number of football contests shall exclude the fol-
lowing:

Hawaii, Alaska, Puerto Rico. [FBS/FCS] Any football games played in Hawaii, Alaska or Puerto Rico,
respectively, either against or under the sponsorship of an active member institution located in Hawaii,
Alaska or Puerto Rico, by a Division I member institution located outside the area in question;

 

[808 Buck]

A game with Hawaii on Dec 8th would be a regular-season game.

It would be scheduled after the probation was handed down. They let USC play because the game was scheduled prior to their punishment.

 

[MililaniBuckeye]

You didn't read BB73's entire post. The bylaw specifically addresses adding a regular season game in Hawaii, and the NCAA specifically said we could not add a game under that bylaw.

The institution's football team shall end its 2012 season with the playing of its last regularly scheduled, in-season contest and shall not be eligible to participate in any postseason competition or take advantage of any of the exemptions provided in Bylaw 17.9.5.2, to include an end-of-season conference championship game.

and

17.9.5.2 Annual Exemptions. [FBS/FCS] The maximum number of football contests shall exclude the following:

Hawaii, Alaska, Puerto Rico. [FBS/FCS] Any football games played in Hawaii, Alaska or Puerto Rico, respectively, either against or under the sponsorship of an active member institution located in Hawaii, Alaska or Puerto Rico, by a Division I member institution located outside the area in question;

I did read his entire post. Rule 17.9.5.2 Annual Exemptions deals only with the maximum amount of games, so that you can play a 13th game in a 12-game season, or a 12th game in an 11-game season. Also, there is nothing in the top quote about a 14-week window, just the bolded statement addressing that the games must be regular-season games. Now, we may have to drop Miami (Oh) or Central Florida so that we can argue that the UH game is our 12th regular season game and that we weren't trying to get a 13th game under rule 17.9.5.2.

I would inform the NCAA that we intend to play UH on either Dec 1st (if UH dropped the Soutern Alabama game), or on Dec 8th, on the condition we cancel one of our first two games so that we stay at 12 regular season games, and then make the NCAA specifically deny it. From that point on, legal action could be taken if wanted...

 

[Jake]

I did read his entire post. Rule 17.9.5.2 Annual Exemptions deals only with the maximum amount of games, so that you can play a 13th game in a 12-game season, or a 12th game in an 11-game season. Also, there is nothing in the top quote about a 14-week window, just the bolded statement addressing that the games must be regular-season games. Now, we may have to drop Miami (Oh) or Central Florida so that we can argue that the UH game is our 12th regular season game and that we weren't trying to get a 13th game under rule 17.9.5.2.

I would inform the NCAA that we intend to play UH on either Dec 1st (if UH dropped the Soutern Alabama game), or on Dec 8th, on the condition we cancel one of our first two games so that we stay at 12 regular season games, and then make the NCAA specifically deny it. From that point on, legal action could be taken if wanted...

Do you honestly believe the NCAA didn't write that bylaw - and cite it in its decision on tOSU - to specifically preclude the actions you're suggesting? You're reading into it what you want to read into it.

I would love to see it, but it's not happening.

 

[Oh8ch]

I believe I am the bearer of sad tidings.

The NCAA findings read:


4. The institution's football team shall end its 2012 season with the playing of its last regularly scheduled, in-season contest and shall not be eligible to participate in any postseason competition or take advantage of any of the exemptions provided in Bylaw 17.9.5.2, to include an end-of-season conference championship game.

Bylaw 17.9.5.2 section k is one of the exemptions and reads:

(k) Hawaii, Alaska, Puerto Rico. [FBS/FCS] Any football games played in Hawaii, Alaska or Puerto Rico, respectively, either against or under the sponsorship of an active member institution located in Hawaii


Link to the bylaws for anyone who wants to try for a different interpretation

http://www.ncaapublications.com/productdownloads/D110.pdf

 

[MililaniBuckeye]

Do you honestly believe the NCAA didn't write that bylaw - and cite it in its decision on tOSU - to specifically preclude the actions you're suggesting? You're reading into it what you want to read into it.

I would love to see it, but it's not happening.

Did they actually cite the bylaw in its ruling? They specifically said that we could not change any of our schedule next year? Again, based on what BB73 presented above, we can still play at UH provided it is a regular season game and it is within the 12-game limit.

 

[MililaniBuckeye]

I believe I am the bearer of sad tidings.

The NCAA findings read:


4. The institution's football team shall end its 2012 season with the playing of its last regularly scheduled, in-season contest and shall not be eligible to participate in any postseason competition or take advantage of any of the exemptions provided in Bylaw 17.9.5.2, to include an end-of-season conference championship game.

Bylaw 17.9.5.2 section k is one of the exemptions and reads:

(k) Hawaii, Alaska, Puerto Rico. [FBS/FCS] Any football games played in Hawaii, Alaska or Puerto Rico, respectively, either against or under the sponsorship of an active member institution located in Hawaii


Link to the bylaws for anyone who wants to try for a different interpretation

http://www.ncaapublications.com/productdownloads/D110.pdf

JFC. Again the lead-in paragraph for Bylaw 17.9.5.2 is "The maximum number of football contests shall exclude the following:".

Note the words maximum number. All this by-law does is keep us from scheduling Hawaii as a 13th game, but if we dump someone on our current schedule and replace them with UH, then we are at 12 games and thus the by-law becomes moot.

 

[ScriptOhio]

There is no way they will cancel a home game and lose close to $10M (i.e. (105,000 x $70) + $15 parking + concessions) for a game in Hawaii.

Never going to happen. :(