Ohio State Football: A rational look

[Apache]

This may be perceived as a rational view of the Ohio State football program and it may not. Please feel free to add you perspective. Even though I am a die hard Buckeye fan, I had to take a deep breath last week prior to the game and analyze the entire view of Ohio State football and we the fans.

First, anyone would be hard pressed to argure that Ohio State at this point in football history is an elite team. Quite honestly there is an ebb an flow to the elites in college football, although some are more stable in their spots. Among those I view as an "elite" football team would include, USC, Florida and some others that ebb and flow in their rankings. L.S.U., Texas, Georgia, Ohio State, and others have their years but are not as consistent as the others.

Second, "THE GAME". It was quite obvious to me that the talent level was not as equal as we would like to believe. USC had better players and better coached players in the game itself. As I have said before, USC plays with reckless abandon and OSU plays with the meticulous nature of their coaches.
I believe that Ohio State was out-coached in that game. That is not to say as many pundits and fans would espouse that Ohio State should get rid of Jim Bollman, the entire defensive staff, start Pryor, get rid of the offensive line, send Boekman away, or find someone better than Jim Tressel. All football coaches, at one time or another, get out-coached. This has happened to USC too. I will point to last years USC-Stanford game. (It was last year wasn't it) Stanford was a 42 point underdog.

Third, the press manipulates the stories. Nothing was wrong with Ohio States Offense, Defense, Coaching Staff, in the preseason. Now suddenly, Jim Tressel, his staff, the senior quarterback, The offensive and defensive lines, etc. should be thrown aside. Todd Boekman(sp) did not play that badly. USC's front and the blitzes were in his face most of the game.

Okay. Let us take a deep breath here. Ohio State must live and learn and we fans must do so too. In every game, in every season, someone steps up and someone steps back. It is time for Ohio State to lick their wounds, learn from the experience, and get tougher, get better, coach better, get a better scheme or step back into mediocrity. Only time will tell.

The Buckeyes will rise again.

 

[BayBuck]

First, anyone would be hard pressed to argure that Ohio State at this point in football history is an elite team.

I think many people would find it very easy indeed to make such an argument, starting with the fact that not many teams ever make it to back-to-back national championship games (regardless of how badly they play in those games), and there are likewise not too many examples of one team's continued dominance of a major conference like we are experiencing at OSU currently. This is a team that has been to 5 BCS games in 6 years (all with top-5 finishes), has 68 wins in those 6 years, recruits nationally against the nation's best, and should still be expected to win out and go to probably the Rose Bowl.

Multiple NCs in the past few years, no, but 1337, heck yes.
:osu:

 

[matcar]

I think many people would find it very easy indeed to make such an argument, starting with the fact that not many teams ever make it to back-to-back national championship games (regardless of how badly they play in those games), and there are likewise not too many examples of one team's continued dominance of a major conference like we are experiencing at OSU currently. This is a team that has been to 5 BCS games in 6 years (all with top-5 finishes), has 68 wins in those 6 years, recruits nationally against the nation's best, and should still be expected to win out and go to probably the Rose Bowl.

Multiple NCs in the past few years, no, but 1337, heck yes.
:osu:

Perhaps your description qualifies for a great, but not elite team. We have proven over the last few years that when the odds are even, we are not likely to win.

I have been saying for 2 or 3 years now that "These truly are the good ol' days." And I still believe that. But I can also acknowledge that the Bucks have some work ahead of them to win another NC. Unfortunately, the difference was stark in the USC game. We were beaten at virtually every position on the field and it appeared that perhaps we were beaten on the sidelines and in the press box as well. I'll admit that I didn't really expect the Bucks to win Saturday, but I thought we'd stay in the game...I thought our talent and coaching would force that much. It didn't, and it hasn't in those big games for a few years.

Big Game Bob (Stoops) made a name for himself by winning those types of games early at OU. Then he went into a bad stretch...but I'll bet that OU comes out of that well. I think the same of JT and the Bucks...we'll come out of it well, but I can certainly look in the mirror of the past couple seasons and see that we've got work to do to get back to where we all thought we'd be this year.

 

[Buckeyeskickbuttocks]

Have to side with Bay here... It was another bad loss. But, it doesn't change a thing with regard to what Ohio State has done since 2002. Going forward, Ohio State is in great shape.

I would agree that Ohio State better have learned something from USC, and I hope the implement it, but to say Ohio State is not elite is a little ridiculous. Including Florida in that status seems odd as well, considering the 2006 season was the only "dominant" season in any sense of the word over the same course of years (2002-2007) Observe:

2002: 8-5
2003: 8-5
2004: 7-5
2005: 9-2
2006: 13-1
2007: 9-4
Total 54-22

 

[Buckeyeskickbuttocks]

So... Oklahoma's elite then?

2002: 12-2
2003: 12-2
2004: 12-1
2005: 8-4
2006: 11-3
2007: 11-3

66-15

But, Ohio State is something else?

2002: 14-0
2003: 11-2
2004: 8-4
2005: 10-2
2006: 12-1
2007: 11-2

66-10

Sorry, guys... it was a loss to 3 teams who are also "elite" for the season we played them, two of whom became national champions and one of which still might.

There is no shame in losing to a better team (LSU and USC), and I can forgive OSU for screwing the pooch against Florida in 06. But, "better" does not connote that Ohio State is now something other than still among the elite. The numbers don't back up any other theory, as far as I'm concerned.

 

[Buckeyeskickbuttocks]

As for "Stark differences" there is only one I can think of....

USC plays every down like it's their last. Ohio State gave up after the Holding Pen. brought back Robo's TD. If Ohio State finnished their drives, the score is 14-14 at the half.

Things got out of hand after OSU laid down. THAT is the problem with this team... laying down. It happened against Florida and it happened again last Saturday. At least they played hard all game against LSU... but LSU was simply better.. big shock.. wasn't 07 a "rebuilding" year?

 

[matcar]

So... Oklahoma's elite then?

2002: 12-2
2003: 12-2
2004: 12-1
2005: 8-4
2006: 11-3
2007: 11-3

66-15

But, Ohio State is something else?

2002: 14-0
2003: 11-2
2004: 8-4
2005: 10-2
2006: 12-1
2007: 11-2

66-10

Sorry, guys... it was a loss to 3 teams who are also "elite" for the season we played them, two of whom became national champions and one of which still might.

There is no shame in losing to a better team (LSU and USC), and I can forgive OSU for screwing the pooch against Florida in 06. But, "better" does not connote that Ohio State is now something other than still among the elite. The numbers don't back up any other theory, as far as I'm concerned.

I don't think I said OU WAS back, but that I thought they'd get there. As I said the same of OSU...but I don't think we're there now.

 

[matcar]

As for "Stark differences" there is only one I can think of....

USC plays every down like it's their last. Ohio State gave up after the Holding Pen. brought back Robo's TD. If Ohio State finnished their drives, the score is 14-14 at the half.

Things got out of hand after OSU laid down. THAT is the problem with this team... laying down. It happened against Florida and it happened again last Saturday. At least they played hard all game against LSU... but LSU was simply better.. big shock.. wasn't 07 a "rebuilding" year?

I think a position by position analysis would indicate that USC held an advantage at almost every position (not every position, but darn close), including all special teams positions. That is stark to me. And I think JL would take exception to the notion that he layed down. Free as well. Jenks? Don't think so. Perhaps a few did, some have speculated that O-linemen did...I don't know, but I saw a lot of folks still hustling out there.

 

[Buckeyeskickbuttocks]

I don't think I said OU WAS back, but that I thought they'd get there. As I said the same of OSU...but I don't think we're there now.

Fair enough, I misread you there.

I think a position by position analysis would indicate that USC held an advantage at almost every position (not every position, but darn close), including all special teams positions. That is stark to me. And I think JL would take exception to the notion that he layed down. Free as well. Jenks? Don't think so. Perhaps a few did, some have speculated that O-linemen did...I don't know, but I saw a lot of folks still hustling out there.

I'm not in the player ranking business. Is Brian Cushing better than Marcus Freeman? Maybe. Maybe not. I really can't tell you, and if I could, I'd easily be Detroit's GM. I can tell you this, though. USC is not impenatrable. USC is not invincible. They have weaknesses. Ohio State exposed exactly none of them. I don't see how you didn't notice the air come out of the team after the Holding on Robo's six... But, maybe it's just me.

In any case, don't misunderstand me to say "everything is fine" while the ship slowly takes on water. Ohio State absolutey needs to improve. But.. we already knew that. I'll tell you something else about USC.... they think they need to improve as well.

 

[redbenn]

I know it's been said before, but even our "Bad Losses" since 2005 have been to:

• #1 USC
• Nat'l Champion LSU
• an Illini team that went to the Rose Bowl
• Nat'l Champion UF
• an 11-1 PSU team
• Nat'l Champion Texas

I'd say those are some pretty good teams to have your only losses to.

 

[JCOSU86]

I think a position by position analysis would indicate that USC held an advantage at almost every position (not every position, but darn close), including all special teams positions.

You obviously didn't read the game preview.

 

[Buckeyeskickbuttocks]

I know it's been said before, but even our "Bad Losses" since 2005 have been to:

• #1 USC
• Nat'l Champion LSU
• an Illini team that went to the Rose Bowl
• Nat'l Champion UF
• an 11-1 PSU team
• Nat'l Champion Texas

I'd say those are some pretty good teams to have your only losses to.

Exactly!

Lets look at some LSU losses in that time frame (not intended to be all inclusive):
Kentucky? Auburn (in a 7-3 game)? 5-6 Tennessee? These to go along with Arkansas and Florida (Eventual Champion)

How about USC:

Stanford, obviously... Oregon State... 7-6 UCLA... to go along with Oregon (with Dixon and Stewart)

Eh.. I don't know.. would you rather lose to the teams on Redbenn's list or get taken down by a 41 point dog every now and then? Want to tank against a Tennessee team which is sub 500, or screw the pooch against a Rose Bowl qualifier?

Seems easy enough to me.

And again, I expect Ohio State to make changes to get even better. We were not the better team on Saturday September 13. OK... fine... it's not the end of the world, and it doesn't indicate some sort of smoke and mirrors since 2002.

 

[OHSportsFan]

Third, the press manipulates the stories. Nothing was wrong with Ohio States Offense, Defense, Coaching Staff, in the preseason. Now suddenly, Jim Tressel, his staff, the senior quarterback, The offensive and defensive lines, etc. should be thrown aside.

Good post, but...of course nothing was wrong in the preseason, we hadn't played a game! Now that we played a few, we can at least begin to see what's wrong.

Everything is great during the offseason. Trust me, I know, I'm a Browns fan.

 

[Buckeyeskickbuttocks]

Actually, another word on the "stark differences"

Here's another difference which I would call stark, and it comes from the booth.

USC looked at Anderson Russell and said "He will jump the inside handoff leaving the TE wide open" and... that's exactly what happened. That is to say, USC exposes weakness. They don't line up and say "We're USC, and we run this set of plays and we'll beat you with them" they say "We are going to attack your weakness untill you fix it, and then we're gonna take it to whatever whole that fix created."

Ohio State seems to be of the mind "This is what we do. We do it well. And it's what we're going to do to you... even if that goes straight in to your teeth.. we think we're better than you, we have faith in our system... lets go play."

There's nothing wrong with Ohio State's philosophy, to tell the truth... afterall, it has won many ballgames over the years. But... I'd really like to see Ohio State try the hit em where they aint approach from here out. It probably wont happen, but I have hope that lesson has been learned.

Edit: The other thing I've noticed is that OSU reacts to situations. When OSU gets down, they react... in a defensive posture. I'd like to see Ohio State remain aggressors from both sides of the ball, all game long. It seems to me the difference between Dantonio's attacking defense in 02 and Heacock's more passive approach are best summed up this way....

It's 4th and goal, in OT in the NC game....

Dantonio says "Go get the quarterback, Cie"
I think Heacock would be saying "Don't let em get open"

Dantonio forced the issue... Heacock seems to try and defend what he thinks is coming. Again, there isn't anything "Wrong" with Heacock's philosophy, if it's as I describe... I'd just like to see it change in to a true strength for Ohio State and I believe we have the talent to play more aggressively.

 

[matcar]

Actually, another word on the "stark differences"

Here's another difference which I would call stark, and it comes from the booth.

USC looked at Anderson Russell and said "He will jump the inside handoff leaving the TE wide open" and... that's exactly what happened. That is to say, USC exposes weakness. They don't line up and say "We're USC, and we run this set of plays and we'll beat you with them" they say "We are going to attack your weakness untill you fix it, and then we're gonna take it to whatever whole that fix created."

Ohio State seems to be of the mind "This is what we do. We do it well. And it's what we're going to do to you... even if that goes straight in to your teeth.. we think we're better than you, we have faith in our system... lets go play."

There's nothing wrong with Ohio State's philosophy, to tell the truth... afterall, it has won many ballgames over the years. But... I'd really like to see Ohio State try the hit em where they aint approach from here out. It probably wont happen, but I have hope that lesson has been learned.

As I said, the differences were stark in terms of the positions on the field, AND on the sideline. You post essentially acknowledges that.