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- Thread starter crazybuckfan40
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MrEd said:
Agreed. tOSU has been on the CFB scene much longer than when ESPN was a bong session discussion in the early 70's. When ESPN folds, declines, or just basically implodes...the "I" will still be dotted. Let them come to C-bus....but with a special reception....
No signs....
No noise....
Huge crowd but no cheering....
Nothing, nada...just an interruption to the usual great tailgating
Guys, I know its a pipedream...but why stoop to their level? Let's inform them that we are larger than can even dream of becoming.
They NEED us...we do not need nor desire them.
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LightningRod
Legend
I don't see the point in allowing these people to set up a stage where the trashing will continue. Fuck them - they should have thought about this before they clmbed up on that high horse. Let Corso go to Ann Arbor.
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rocketman
flying low
Now, I don't want anyone to take this the wrong way, but I'm curious to know just how many Buckeye fans at that game would share the same strong negative feelings towards ESPN as we do on this forum (assuming ESPN does nothing else to tarnish our image). It seems like a large majority of viewers of any media outlet only criticize what goes on in the story. They don't judge (or even pick up on) the slant that the media outlet puts on the story.osugrad21 said:
The way I see it, when Gameday comes, the crowds will be there cheering for their team, both Buckeye and Longhorn fans, at the Gameday stage. A minority of OSU fans will either voice their opinion of ESPN with signs and whatnot, OR just not show up to the Gameday stage. What I think will happen within the next 8 months or so (and I believe this opinion was expressed by someone else here) is a gradual change of tone whenever ESPN addresses OSU football...nothing will happen, and they have no news to report (assuming they don't FABRICATE news, which pisses me off to no end). No "mushroom cloud" will erupt over Columbus cause there's no nuclear weapon to set it off.
IMO, if ESPiN continues to abuse their semi-monopoly on TV and print media to serve their own purposes (a la MoC issue), and that we must dissent against ESPiN, it would be in our best interest to just not show up to the Gameday stage. There's no news when there is nothing to report.
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LightningRod
Legend
The former Buckeye represents the interests of ESPN when the camera is on. Nobody is stopping him from making his living. Let him do it for the time being in Ann Arbor. It's not like they are being run out to Utah again. I know what he sentiments are at the gamewatch facility in DC, and if that is any indication, then there will be a scene in Columbus if gameday shows up.
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OK. Some of you need to lay off the Kool-Aid.
There is no conspiracy.
The bigger issue with whether or not GameDay shows up will be determined by logistics, security, and the new, incoming AD. I can't imagine that a new AD's first executive decision with a talented football team primed for a NC run will be to burn the bridge with ESPN. I'm inclined to think whoever is at the helm in fall-2005 will bend over backwards to mend the ties with ESPN.
ESPN will be given an opportunity to do the same, by setting up their Home Depot GameDay set between the rotunda and St John Arena, as they always do, and showcase Buckeye pride from daybreak til sundown, as they did when Michigan came here in 2002, and Wazzu, etc etc ...
ESPN would not run a negative report during the GameDay broadcast, and that's the best publicity The University could get right now. Ultimately, I doubt the majority of Buckeye fans even care anyway.
Also, following on the heels of bowl game performances, I would say that it would also be in OSU's interest to have GameDay there to set a stage for a Heisman campaign. Vince Young doesn't need any pub - in fact he's probably on the short, short list of finalists already barring a total implosion next season, but I think the exposure would almost certainly benefit Teddy Ginn Jr, especially if he brings his A game as he did against MSU and OSU.
Remember the chants of "Maurice Heisman" after the Wazzu game in '02? Without GameDay, MoC was merely a really, really good freshman RB - with GameDay he was a phenom and a Heisman candidate. TG Jr and the Bucks (sadly) need GameDay here.
There is no conspiracy.
The bigger issue with whether or not GameDay shows up will be determined by logistics, security, and the new, incoming AD. I can't imagine that a new AD's first executive decision with a talented football team primed for a NC run will be to burn the bridge with ESPN. I'm inclined to think whoever is at the helm in fall-2005 will bend over backwards to mend the ties with ESPN.
ESPN will be given an opportunity to do the same, by setting up their Home Depot GameDay set between the rotunda and St John Arena, as they always do, and showcase Buckeye pride from daybreak til sundown, as they did when Michigan came here in 2002, and Wazzu, etc etc ...
ESPN would not run a negative report during the GameDay broadcast, and that's the best publicity The University could get right now. Ultimately, I doubt the majority of Buckeye fans even care anyway.
Also, following on the heels of bowl game performances, I would say that it would also be in OSU's interest to have GameDay there to set a stage for a Heisman campaign. Vince Young doesn't need any pub - in fact he's probably on the short, short list of finalists already barring a total implosion next season, but I think the exposure would almost certainly benefit Teddy Ginn Jr, especially if he brings his A game as he did against MSU and OSU.
Remember the chants of "Maurice Heisman" after the Wazzu game in '02? Without GameDay, MoC was merely a really, really good freshman RB - with GameDay he was a phenom and a Heisman candidate. TG Jr and the Bucks (sadly) need GameDay here.
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No apology, no ESPiN
Don't have a major problem with Lee's or Herbie's stance on this whole thing. Maybe not what I'd do, but I understand their position. ESPiN on the other hand is a whole different enchilada. I personally also take the hardline against them. I respect what everyone else on the other side of the issue is saying but to me its a similar situation to the following. You guys remember the response of the Nascar Craftsman truck series driver when asked what he thought about Toyota being able to race in the series since their trucks were made wholly in the US? His response was "Those are the SOB's that bombed Pearl Harbor". ESPiN started this witch hunt, should be up to them to make the first move to right this situation. Some things should not be overlooked/forgiven until amends have been made. ESPiN has not done so to this point. Until they do, screw 'em.
Don't have a major problem with Lee's or Herbie's stance on this whole thing. Maybe not what I'd do, but I understand their position. ESPiN on the other hand is a whole different enchilada. I personally also take the hardline against them. I respect what everyone else on the other side of the issue is saying but to me its a similar situation to the following. You guys remember the response of the Nascar Craftsman truck series driver when asked what he thought about Toyota being able to race in the series since their trucks were made wholly in the US? His response was "Those are the SOB's that bombed Pearl Harbor". ESPiN started this witch hunt, should be up to them to make the first move to right this situation. Some things should not be overlooked/forgiven until amends have been made. ESPiN has not done so to this point. Until they do, screw 'em.
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Clearly, there are two opinions here. One says, let ESPiN come and do GameDay. Show them we're bigger than they are and just move on. Give Herbie a little support. I'd like to perhaps join those expressing an alternative opinion.
First, I must agree that I don't believe in an ESPiN conspiracy against Ohio State. But that does not mean that I don't believe that this entire affair was a carefully considered smear campaign.
I find it very difficult to believe that ESPiN didn't have a series of editorial meetings before they ran the Clarett story. That's the basics of journalism. Evaluating the source of the information, finding confirming evidence. But, ESPiN also is an entertainment business, so I also would find it very hard to believe that, given the size of the story and importance of the fan base to the business, management didn't carefully consider the risks of running the story very carefully. If it were me, I certainly would have sat down with my marketing managers and marketing researchers and thought carefully about the possible effects of the story.
Saying that ESPiN management didn't carefully consider the legal and commercial risks of running this campaign is tantamount to saying management weren't paying attention to their fiduciary responsibilities to their stockholders, and I don't believe that.
Now, you might argue, "wait a minute", this is about journalism and the business case is irrelevant. And I would have to ask you if that was you or the Kool-Aid doing the talking.
In my opinion, I have difficulty finding the journalism in ESPiN's mix of sports journalism and entertainment. Apparently, so do they. Just take a look at their new 2004 annual report. ESPiN is repeatedly referred to as entertainment but not once as a journalistic news outlet in their latest annual report, available for download at https://www.moultoncommerce.com/disney/view.php?ebizcatalogsid=152e020d87bf359b2c8bbf56b7bf1849.
So, knowing that professional entertainment media strategists carefully plan content, I have difficulty not thinking that ESPiN will have very clearly examined the potential impact on their bottom line with their marketing research people, thought about the potential reactions from our fan base, and carefully considered exit strategies for various scenarios as the story developed. The predictable musings about Clarett's decision making is clearly the scenario they will take if the NCAA clears Ohio State, and they appear to be going down that road already.
Furthermore, if we are to believe this is about news, then why did ESPiN avoid coverage of the various people who said they were misquoted by ESPiN? Why did they continue to print as truth, elements of Clarett's allegations that they knew the NCAA already had investigated and cleared Ohio State? Why did they cite themselves as sources or their own journalists, as if they were outside credible sources? Why did they so eagerly grasp at the Smith story as "proof" when they knew the allegations were that many, many players were guilty and that the other allegations were previously disproven?
Need something more? Then explain why Iowa has gotten off so lightly despite having so many more arrests and trouble? If your answer is because it isn't as big a program, you're arguing a business case, not a news case. And, what about all that manure down in the SEC?
Why haven't the slew of things that appear in another thread on BP received equivalent coverage?
How do you think an Ohio State lineman who publicly fondled himself would have been treated by ESPiN?
So, I must agree and disagree. This is not a conspiracy to ruin Ohio State. A conspiracy would suggest that ESPiN had a premeditated desire to hurt Ohio State specifically. Actually, it rather appears that they don't care who they hurt, so long as the current chump on the stage has a big fan base that they can attack. That gives them the chance to see OSU fans enter the site to see the latest allegations every day and then to see the compliments as they back their way out of the story and move on to the next chump.
Who's the next chump? Look at today's top programs and look at the size of their stadiums.
So, I can agree that there is no conspiracy but I sure as hell don't believe that this wasn't premeditated. This disgusting and sleazy campaign has damaged the University, its teams, its alumni and its fans. They have clearly damaged Andy Geiger's life and that of a few others along the way without any recompense.
I have no problem with GameDay coming, provided that ESPiN clearly run the list of allegations and show that they are not true and give the story the same prominence they gave it in the first place. I don't want to see one or two "not guilties" but, "hey, we exposed Smith", because they didn't even know they were looking for Smith. They argued for widespread corruption that was so bad that people needed to be fired and they knew at the time that the allegations were almost entirely untrue. They need to apologize for what they have done.
If ESPiN don't apologize and run the truth, then it seems very likely that they will come to Ohio Stadium and repeat the wonderful coverage they gave us in the Alamo Bowl.
If we're stupid enough to open ourselves to that, then I think it may be that we have been drinking too much of that Kool-Aid.
First, I must agree that I don't believe in an ESPiN conspiracy against Ohio State. But that does not mean that I don't believe that this entire affair was a carefully considered smear campaign.
I find it very difficult to believe that ESPiN didn't have a series of editorial meetings before they ran the Clarett story. That's the basics of journalism. Evaluating the source of the information, finding confirming evidence. But, ESPiN also is an entertainment business, so I also would find it very hard to believe that, given the size of the story and importance of the fan base to the business, management didn't carefully consider the risks of running the story very carefully. If it were me, I certainly would have sat down with my marketing managers and marketing researchers and thought carefully about the possible effects of the story.
Saying that ESPiN management didn't carefully consider the legal and commercial risks of running this campaign is tantamount to saying management weren't paying attention to their fiduciary responsibilities to their stockholders, and I don't believe that.
Now, you might argue, "wait a minute", this is about journalism and the business case is irrelevant. And I would have to ask you if that was you or the Kool-Aid doing the talking.
In my opinion, I have difficulty finding the journalism in ESPiN's mix of sports journalism and entertainment. Apparently, so do they. Just take a look at their new 2004 annual report. ESPiN is repeatedly referred to as entertainment but not once as a journalistic news outlet in their latest annual report, available for download at https://www.moultoncommerce.com/disney/view.php?ebizcatalogsid=152e020d87bf359b2c8bbf56b7bf1849.
So, knowing that professional entertainment media strategists carefully plan content, I have difficulty not thinking that ESPiN will have very clearly examined the potential impact on their bottom line with their marketing research people, thought about the potential reactions from our fan base, and carefully considered exit strategies for various scenarios as the story developed. The predictable musings about Clarett's decision making is clearly the scenario they will take if the NCAA clears Ohio State, and they appear to be going down that road already.
Furthermore, if we are to believe this is about news, then why did ESPiN avoid coverage of the various people who said they were misquoted by ESPiN? Why did they continue to print as truth, elements of Clarett's allegations that they knew the NCAA already had investigated and cleared Ohio State? Why did they cite themselves as sources or their own journalists, as if they were outside credible sources? Why did they so eagerly grasp at the Smith story as "proof" when they knew the allegations were that many, many players were guilty and that the other allegations were previously disproven?
Need something more? Then explain why Iowa has gotten off so lightly despite having so many more arrests and trouble? If your answer is because it isn't as big a program, you're arguing a business case, not a news case. And, what about all that manure down in the SEC?
Why haven't the slew of things that appear in another thread on BP received equivalent coverage?
How do you think an Ohio State lineman who publicly fondled himself would have been treated by ESPiN?
So, I must agree and disagree. This is not a conspiracy to ruin Ohio State. A conspiracy would suggest that ESPiN had a premeditated desire to hurt Ohio State specifically. Actually, it rather appears that they don't care who they hurt, so long as the current chump on the stage has a big fan base that they can attack. That gives them the chance to see OSU fans enter the site to see the latest allegations every day and then to see the compliments as they back their way out of the story and move on to the next chump.
Who's the next chump? Look at today's top programs and look at the size of their stadiums.
So, I can agree that there is no conspiracy but I sure as hell don't believe that this wasn't premeditated. This disgusting and sleazy campaign has damaged the University, its teams, its alumni and its fans. They have clearly damaged Andy Geiger's life and that of a few others along the way without any recompense.
I have no problem with GameDay coming, provided that ESPiN clearly run the list of allegations and show that they are not true and give the story the same prominence they gave it in the first place. I don't want to see one or two "not guilties" but, "hey, we exposed Smith", because they didn't even know they were looking for Smith. They argued for widespread corruption that was so bad that people needed to be fired and they knew at the time that the allegations were almost entirely untrue. They need to apologize for what they have done.
If ESPiN don't apologize and run the truth, then it seems very likely that they will come to Ohio Stadium and repeat the wonderful coverage they gave us in the Alamo Bowl.
If we're stupid enough to open ourselves to that, then I think it may be that we have been drinking too much of that Kool-Aid.
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LightningRod
Legend
I suppose I am guilty of drinking kool aid when I read a women's basketball issue on the college football webpage. I must be drinking kool-aid when I listen to Bram Weinstein go off on Ohio State this past weekend in the DC market on ESPN radio 980 AM as being the most corrupt program ever when the women's basketball team is investigated for having received free braces. I confess - it's all in my imagination.
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LightningRod said:
And, mind you, when the two players bring it to the attention of the sports admin people when it would not have affected them one way or the other much anyway (i.e., the health insurance would have paid the bill anyway). Yep, the ESPiN expose is on the way, "Crooked teeth at Crooked U." Stay tuned.
And one final point: Would you want bringing GameDay to Columbus to be your first decision in the largest sports admin job in the country?
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Folanator
Brawndo's got electrolytes...
Dude you are smokin crack. I would bet $'s to doughnuts that they do a BUNCH of crap about MC, TS and whatever else they can dredge up from the bottom of their Bristol cesspool. They spent half of the OSU OSU game doing it. They have proved time and again to be their percepton of a winning formula to attract viewers. They will do is again in a big way.Dryden said:
Fuck em. Throw their shit in the river.
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Some in-game and post-game commentary from the luxury of the broadcast booth is a far cry from delivering a prepared report over the monitors on the GameDay set with 10,000 Buckeyes looking on. If they dredge up anything at all, it will be some crappy "how they've moved on" retrospective. It's not like there is going to be anyone worth interviewing left on the team who ever met MoC, aside from Troy. Come April, or shortly after, once MoC is in (or not) the NFL and Geiger's successor has been named, the story will die, and that will be that (aside from a possible hiccup or two once Troy is or isn't reinstated).Folanator said:
OSU is among the most marketable universities in the country, and ESPN's ratings are up like Bob Dole on Viagra whenever they broadcast a Buckeye game. The 2005/2006 sports year is building towards something very, very special with the mens and womens basketball programs, football, and so on. ESPN won't derail the gravy train.
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