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OSUBasketballJunkie
Never Forget 31-0
TheSportingNews.com
Packers Team Report
Posted: June 3, 2007
Tom Silverstein
For Sporting News
If minicamps and OTAs are any kind of barometer, MLB A.J. Hawk appears to be taking the necessary steps toward being a playmaker. Hawk's biggest weakness last year was man-to-man pass coverage, so it's significant when he intercepts a couple of passes in practice and looks more comfortable in the defense. If Hawk can master man-to-man, he could add a tremendous boost to the pass defense. Though he's not as tall and doesn't have the same wingspan as Brian Urlacher, he has the same kind of speed and that's something the club can exploit. Hawk has the body control to avoid pass penalties and the athletic ability to get in position for interceptions. He is being counted on this year to be more than just a solid player on defense. .
Continued......
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OregonBuckeye
Semper Fi Buckeyes
Where is A.J. Hawk's Place in Big-10 and CFB History?
I've been wondering where people feel A.J. ranks as a linebacker in both Big-10 and college football history. I can't say I've seen a better linebacker than him(even when trying to be as unbiased as possible) but I've also had limited exposure and experience. So for those that have been around a while and have seen some of the greats, please give me your opinion on how well A.J. stacks up with them.
I've been wondering where people feel A.J. ranks as a linebacker in both Big-10 and college football history. I can't say I've seen a better linebacker than him(even when trying to be as unbiased as possible) but I've also had limited exposure and experience. So for those that have been around a while and have seen some of the greats, please give me your opinion on how well A.J. stacks up with them.
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In Buckeye folklore, Andy Katzenmoyer and Chris Spielman come to mind. Not sure I'd place A.J. ahead of those two- rather put him beside them.
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msj2487
You bred raptors?
I wondered this same exact question right after the '06 ass-kicking we gave to the Irish. From my limited personal experience I would rank Hawk as better than the Big Kat simply because Hawk never really missed tackles, if he had a guy with his left pinky he wasn't going to let him pass. The Big Kat, however, struggled at times and would miss tackles, and I'm noticing it more and more as I go through the old Buckeye tapes of the '90's. Not just that, though, but Hawk really is the complete package at LB... he stops the run, defends the pass, makes the tackles, makes the big hits, and forces turnovers, his last name really couldn't fit him more perfectly, because he truly is a ball Hawk. The Big Kat obviously could also lay the big hits and stop the run and defend the pass, however, I still think his lack of playing consistently 100% of the time (like Hawk - who never seemed to have a bad game in his career) notches him just below Hawk's career. Don't get me wrong here at all, as I loved the Big Kat and think he was a terrific LB at tOSU, otherwise he wouldn't have won the Butkus, but I think Hawk was the more complete LB as well as the faster one.
Now I also questioned my dad, uncles, and grandfather about Spielman (as I wasn't privileged enough to see him play), and they all pretty much came to the consensus that if they had to rank these 3 guys in particular they would put it as 1) AJ Hawk 2) Chris Spielman 3) Andy Katzenmoyer (and as we all know the list could go on forever with guys like Marek, Gradishar, Cobb, Cousineau, Pepper, Tovar, Diggs, Wilhelm, Carpenter, etc. etc.). Anyways, the main reasoning behind them putting Hawk over Spielman was always something about his intensity. They said they had never seen a guy play like Hawk before, how he was always ready for the next play, and how he was always at each stop one way or another. Wherein the others made big plays, but didn't quite have the motors to do it throughout the entire game, with each small play that comes with every big play, like Hawk did. (Now, which one of the older folks around here is going to point out to me that Spielman's motor must have been running the entire time during the '86 scUM game??
)
Well, I'm pretty much rambling a bit here I guess, and my opinion is subjective at best, but take it for what you will, and please do not take this as me downgrading Spielman, the Big Kat, or any of the other great LB's in tOSU history. I value them all, like all former Buckeye players.
Finally, and to moreso answer the exact question at hand; "where people feel A.J. ranks as a linebacker in both Big-10 and college football history," I again can only do this from a limited standpoint, however, I'd say he's gotta be up in the top 3 (if not the top LB overall) in terms of the Big Ten, and as we all know, the Big Ten produces the nastiest, hardest-hitting, most awesome LB's in the nation... so that's gotta carry some weight with already being in the top 3, at least, of the best of the best...
Now I also questioned my dad, uncles, and grandfather about Spielman (as I wasn't privileged enough to see him play), and they all pretty much came to the consensus that if they had to rank these 3 guys in particular they would put it as 1) AJ Hawk 2) Chris Spielman 3) Andy Katzenmoyer (and as we all know the list could go on forever with guys like Marek, Gradishar, Cobb, Cousineau, Pepper, Tovar, Diggs, Wilhelm, Carpenter, etc. etc.). Anyways, the main reasoning behind them putting Hawk over Spielman was always something about his intensity. They said they had never seen a guy play like Hawk before, how he was always ready for the next play, and how he was always at each stop one way or another. Wherein the others made big plays, but didn't quite have the motors to do it throughout the entire game, with each small play that comes with every big play, like Hawk did. (Now, which one of the older folks around here is going to point out to me that Spielman's motor must have been running the entire time during the '86 scUM game??
)Well, I'm pretty much rambling a bit here I guess, and my opinion is subjective at best, but take it for what you will, and please do not take this as me downgrading Spielman, the Big Kat, or any of the other great LB's in tOSU history. I value them all, like all former Buckeye players.
Finally, and to moreso answer the exact question at hand; "where people feel A.J. ranks as a linebacker in both Big-10 and college football history," I again can only do this from a limited standpoint, however, I'd say he's gotta be up in the top 3 (if not the top LB overall) in terms of the Big Ten, and as we all know, the Big Ten produces the nastiest, hardest-hitting, most awesome LB's in the nation... so that's gotta carry some weight with already being in the top 3, at least, of the best of the best...
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One other thing about Big Kat is that he was so spectacular as a frosh, that he never really improved significantly from there. A.J. got better with each season. I've been watching Buckeye games since the mid eighties. I was very young when Spielman was playing, but I can remember him as a very special player. As far as my experience goes, I'd rank A.J. 1.a with Spielman 1.b followed by Big Kat. Of course there is all the others that msj mentioned above, but I can't speak to them from personally witnessing their play...gonna have to leave that to the "old timers".
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fourteenandoh
My swing feels like an unfolding lawn chair.
msj2487;874748; said:
as a young (college age) buckeye fan i often wondered how good AJ really was. for me, it always came down to the same thing you mention. if he could get a finger on someone, that guy was going down. it wasn't just AJ though. those two years our whole defense seemed to play like that. i kinda took it for granted until last season when i realized how hard it is for a defense to play like that. the open field tackling of the 04 and 05 teams was pretty impressive. as for spielman, i can't really comment b/c i was way too young. as for the big Kat, he was nasty, but IMO not as fundamentally sound as AJ.
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OregonBuckeye
Semper Fi Buckeyes
Best Buckeye;874773; said:
I'm not including pro career, if that's what you're getting at.
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OregonBuckeye
Semper Fi Buckeyes
Best Buckeye;874777; said:
In my best djtidebuck impression, please explain.
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Here's a thread on LB's from a couple of years ago.
bp-greatest-buckeye-linebackers
I went with the order of:
Spielman, Hawk, Gradishar, Cousineau, Marek, and Katzenmoyer in order; and I still have Hawk in the #2 spot.
It's an embarrassment of riches, and very tough to rank those guys.
bp-greatest-buckeye-linebackers
I went with the order of:
Spielman, Hawk, Gradishar, Cousineau, Marek, and Katzenmoyer in order; and I still have Hawk in the #2 spot.
It's an embarrassment of riches, and very tough to rank those guys.
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OregonBuckeye;874790; said:
I didn't see some of these guys play in college, but I would have to place these guys further up on the list of college LB's:
Dick Butkus, Illinois
Chuck Bednarik, Penn
Tommy Nobis, Texas
Lee Roy Jordan, Alabama
Lawrence Taylor, North Carolina
Brian Bosworth, Oklahoma
In my mind, AJ is somewhere in the next group of guys, with:
Mike Singletary, Baylor
Jerry Robinson, UCLA
Jack Ham, Penn State
Cornelius Bennett, Alabama
Randy Gradishar, tOSU
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OSU SPORTS
All-American
OregonBuckeye;874717; said:
I don't think you realize how many great LB's there have been in the Big Ten and in college football. As much as I like A.J. Hawk, I think Randy Gradishar was the best LB to ever play at OSU. He was the heart of a defense that registered 4 shutouts and only gave up 64 points. Woody called him the greatest linebacker he ever coached at OSU. Randy spent 10 years with the Denver Broncos and earned 7 pro bowls. I would put A.J. next on the OSU list of LB's.
The list of other LB's, outside of OSU, would be too long to include in this post. Let me give you just one example of another Big Ten linebacker. Dick Butkus had 23 tackles against OSU in the Shoe in 1963 in a tie game. He went on to lead his team to the Big Ten tiltle as a linebacker. He was voted the most valuable PLAYER in the Big Ten that year. Notice I said player, not linebacker. It's all a matter of opinion but there is one fact. There are TONS of great linebackers who have played the game in college.
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