Illinois Fighting Illini (you'll see)

[ThaKid101]

I don't know that I can agree he has shaken off the "Great recruiter, bad coach" label just yet. Yeah, his team beat #1 Ohio State, in the Shoe.... but.. Let's see him sustain it first. Don't get me wrong, I think Zook if fine for Illinois, and I don't mean that to be condescending. I mean it in the same way you mention replacing Spurrier. He was screwed before he showed up. In the opposite way, he's a King in Champaign because the previous several years were SOOOOO horrid.

I understand everything you're saying. That's why I said for the most part. I still think a lot of people aren't convinced (And some will never be), but a lot will be this upcoming year IMO. I think he will do more than sustain it. JMHO...also forgot to mention, I hope either PSU, OSU, or UM gets Pryor...talent needs to keep coming to the B10...

 

[Buckeyeskickbuttocks]

I understand everything you're saying. That's why I said for the most part. I still think a lot of people aren't convinced (And some will never be), but a lot will be this upcoming year IMO. I think he will do more than sustain it. JMHO...also forgot to mention, I hope either PSU, OSU, or UM gets Pryor...talent needs to keep coming to the B10...

Well, it won't be PSU or UM.

 

[NFBuck]

This thread has become ridiculously awesome. Definately bookmarking this bad boy now.

 

[buckiprof]

That is basically the sum of what I think...

I have read your posts and at this point in time in your brief tenure here at BP, I would have to say that the above quote gives as good of a working definition of null set as any other I have seen.

 

[shetuck]

I understand everything you're saying. That's why I said for the most part. I still think a lot of people aren't convinced (And some will never be), but a lot will be this upcoming year IMO. I think he will do more than sustain it. JMHO...also forgot to mention, I hope either PSU, OSU, or UM gets Pryor...talent needs to keep coming to the B10...

Run along now, and don't come back until you're ThaMan, k?

 

[jwinslow]

-Illinois is going to start churning out a lot of pro prospects...very Miami esque. Starting with the 2009 NFL Draft. Vontae Davis, "barring injury or just a horrible campaign is a 1st round pick", Will Davis (Could be another with the really big year some are expecting), Xavier Fulton (Tons of upside...just starting playing LT last year...), etc. are just some of the names for next year. It REALLY takes off with the 2010 NFL Draft (Benn, Wilson, etc.) and after.

No, not Miami-esque. Miami-esque is having 6 first rounders drafted in one year. Or a close second for Ohio State with 5 in 06... or the 4-6 they could have next year, even with gholston skipping out early on that draft class.

You're pretty excited that there's life in the Illinois program. Nothing wrong with that. But, building a legit every year top 10 program takes time and effort... Hell, even with as successful as Ohio State has been since 2002, it's not uncommon for them to begin the year, or even end it on occasion, outside the top 10.

Likewise, and I am just saying this, with an increase in prowess on the field, comes an increase in pressure from the media, etc. It's not as easy as putting talent on the field. It's a big part of it, but it takes a man who can manage it too. Jury is out on if Zook is that guy. He was unable to do it at Florida. He might get it done at Illinois.... but, right now, all he has to do is go .500 and he's loved. See what I'm saying?

Well stated. I love Juice and his potential, but he did not play every week like vs OSU, and the lifeblood of the O & D are playing on sundays (Mendenhall & Leman). Illinois is on the upswing, but certainly not at the point to be confidently predicting breezing through the competition like Greg Oden vs Ekpe Udoh.

 

[The Man]

Run along now, and don't come back until you're ThaMan, k?

sorry that moniker is already taken.

 

[The Man]

Okay we'll see. Just know I don't say stuff like this just to say it. A lot of it is what the coaches think and some NFL types think (That I read through an insider on Scout, Frank Frangie). We can debate stuff. I'm a homer (Understatement) but at the same time I can debate with people if they disagree. I'll break down why I think something, you can debate why you think something.

actually you do. I have seen your posts on the Illinois scout board and they are embarrassing. Being a homer is understandable, however you are so over the top it is ridiculous. I don't know of anyone that takes you seriously.

 

[shetuck]

sorry that moniker is already taken.

Shoulda known...

 

[crazybuckfan40]

I can dismiss the big ten championship talk and NC talk, because well that it what it is...A pipedream...

But what I can't get over is Zook being a great talent evaluator because he has pulled a couple 2 stars/3 stars that have been solid players...

Honestly he is pulling guys that we are not going after in Ohio...He is offering any kid that has any type of interest from big ten schools...I like his approach in Ohio, as a way to build some depth at Illinois and occasionally grab the big one like Cordale Scott, Melvin Fellows (if you hold on) but if you can honestly tell me that Zook would rather have the guys he is pulling from Ohio than the ones that we are then you are solely mistaken...I mean if you guys are going to Miami-esque, they better just but some NFL jerseys on our backs and we will go win the superbowl...

I mean come on be realistic...Zook is offering all these guys earlier than us, because he knows that is his best chance to pull these guys, and he knows those are the types of kids that he really wants...So we are taking Zooks first and second choices, while you are getting his third choices that we aren't sending offers too...You guys may pull guys like Studlein, Mason, Harris, guys that we don't offer...

Yes I know Zook is pulling guys from other states as well, but other than Illinois he is not pulling the top dogs...Yes I know stars don't tell the story all the time, but they are a good gauge...So for being ranked in the the 20-30 range in terms of recruiting class, and saying you are going to start churning out prospects like Thug U is a little over the top and it is even more crazier when you put it into context that you are trying to tell a board full of buckeye fans about this considering we have been recruiting better than Zooker and Illini for years and we don't even claim to put out talent like that...

BTW if you could let me know where you got that stuff I could really use some...

 

[OAR21]

Hey guys, new member here. Illini fan as well. I've been following the site for a while ever since it used to get linked back on the scout boards for the very helpful recruiting forums back in '05 maybe. Anyway, thought I'd register cause it's pretty civil and more and more Illini targets are also OSU targets.

So, I know Kid has been pretty homerish in the thread, and I'm not gonna follow his lead, but I'll back him up on a couple things. First off, with his recruiting info, it's pretty spot on for the most part. He knows a lot about the CPL(Chicago Public League) recruits(Drummond/Moffett, others too in the past), and he really is kind of "in the know" about our recruits. Sure, there may be a lot of bias towards Illinois, but the info is pretty solid FWIW. He called Regis Benn/Martez Wilson/Josh Brent...all those guys in 2006 and 2007, he called them to Illinois before anyone. A lot of people talked a ton of **** about him and gave him a really hard time saying how stupid/dumb he was gonna be (mostly ND fans, a couple OSU fans with Brent, and many others). He obviously proved everyone wrong with that. I know I'm rambling, but I'm backing him up cause he does have solid info along the recruiting lines, so don't totally disregard him. He might be the equivalent(maybe not quite), of an RB07OSU(?) or maybe a HotMic as far as recruiting info.

Also, I'm not gonna go as far as Kid, but I do think Illinois can/will have a legit shot at a BCS/NC game appearance in 2009. For 2008, I think we go either 7-5 or 8-4. The combination of the tough schedule and the loss of Mendenhall and Leman will be pretty tough. I really do think we get better in a lot of areas though. For one, Juice was really making strides at the end of last year, and we will have one of the better recieving corps in the BigTen with Benn, Cumberland, Gamble(so long as he doesn't move to S), we'll also have some real good freshmen in Scott and probably the best AJ Jenkins. I think that will really help the passing game. The running game with probably be a committee between FR Jason Ford, Daniel Dufrene(disputed fumble call vs. OSU), and Troy Pollard. Pollard was really doing good last year as a freshman, but tore his knee up. The running game is a concern going into the season, mostly because no one has ever been a starter and someone will need to step up. The OLine will be good too, just as good as last year IMO.

Defensively, I really think we have one of the best DLines in the conference with a lot of proven starters and some really good young talent(not to boast or anything, but I think after this year you will hear Brent's name among the best in the country at DT). Linebacker is a concern as we lose Leman and Antonio Steele. Brit Miller will move to MLB for 2008 and Martez Wilson will take over a OLB spot for sure. The other spot is up for grabs. In the secondary, we'll have quite a bit of depth and a stud in Vontae, and a good CB in Dere Hicks(had an INT vs. OSU). Special teams will be good except for we lose K Jason Reda who was really solid.

While we will improve, everyone else will as well. OSU will be tops in '08 no doubt. Laurinaitis, Jenkins, Beanie, all sure-fire first rounders. The game in Champaign will be a good one, but I don't think it determines the title. OSU will be undefeated and we probably will have 1-3 conference losses. Hopefully you guys can bring a NC back to the Big Ten where it belongs. Otherwise, in 2009, we might have to do that

Hope I wasn't too bad haha

 

[BengalsAndBucks]

-Illinois will win the B10 and go to a BCS this year, setting up a HUGE 2009 when they win it again and win a NC. I can also see them not winning the B10 this year, but I doubt it. I think Illinois will just be too fast, too hungry (ESPECIALLY after that Rose Bowl...a lot of players are as hungry as you can imagine), too tough, too aggressive as well as disciplined for a lot of teams. Any game where they could be unusually undisciplined, they can win just by talent and hunger IMO. I definitely have them winning the B10 and NC (Well I should change that and just say I think they will be undefeated in 2009...you never know how things could go in the BCS...).

So um, yeah about that NC. Illinois went 9-4. They made it into the Rose Bowl by default, because the Rose Bowl didn't want to lose the support of the Big Ten. Realistically, there were 2 or 3 teams that should have gone to a BCS bowl before you. You beat tOSU, and the referreeing is no excuse for us- your boys wanted it more. Juice played the best game of his life. But that was ONE game. Except for that one game, your season wasn't that great. 9-3 in a mediocre Big Ten is nothing to write home about.

I am all for Illinois getting better, and I love the players that Zook is getting there. I think, in a few years, that Illinois will have the talent to compete for a Big Ten title consistently. Whether or not Zook can consistently coach that talent to its potential year in and year out remains to be seen. Remember his overall record at UI is 13-23. Thats not just bad, thats putrid (Yeah I know, Ron Turner blah blah blah, but still. 13-23?). I understand the enthusiasm surrounding the program, but lets give him a couple more years to prove he can coach this team before we start crowning them national champions.

And as for your too hungry bit, I understand that. But tell me, who in college football is going to be more hungry than 2 players who passed on becoming top-10 draft picks so that they could come back for their senior year and try to avenge 2 consecutive national championship losses? Not to mention the entire rest of the team, or a coach who can't stand to lose, who thinks about those losses every day, and who just happens to be one of the best in college football. Your too hungry team is only the second hungriest team in its conference.

 

[OrangeRoughy]

Ah yes. The infamous Kid. Love the enthusiasm, Kid, but you're doing more harm than good over here.

I think you're an example of the "old" Illini fan Roughy. I've read some of your posts and you seem to kind of back down to OSU fans and such who don't think Illinois can become anything more than a 2nd tier B10 school. You try to defend Illinois and stuff, but it seems like you're backing down a little often. I guess being "realistic" as you'd probably put it. But I'm telling you, watch how it takes off. I was being dead serious when I made those comments.

Old Illini fan? Maybe. 35 is the new 61.

I'll say this, Kid. I've been an Illini football fan for 25 years. As a student, I sat shirtless in the stands at Memorial Stadium with a giant N on my chest as I watched Kerry Collins lead PSU on a 96 yard drive with 2 minutes left to overcome our upset bid in 1994. I've touted the names Eric Jefferson and Mack Jacobs and Jeff Hecklinski and Lonnie Hurst and a hundred other can't-miss Illini recruits that missed. I've sat in Memorial Stadium with only 39,000 fans and watched 1-star recruits from San Jose State take down my beloved Illini. So excuse me if I'm reluctant to claim that our fringe top-20 classes will lead us to National Titles.

Orange, this is not your old Illini squad.

I fully understand that, Kid. If you read my posts earlier in this thread, I've stated repeatedly that Zook's recruiting is the best I've seen in my 20 years of following such, and that we FINALLY seem to have things on track. And if you were paying attention, you would have seen me make an 8-5 season prediction after the spring game last year, causing many on the Illiniboard to ask me to seek help. I know Zook is finally awakening the sleeping giant, but you're way, way, WAY overboard in assuming that we are becoming Miami North or Defensive Secondary U.

Last season was the worst thing that could happen to you, Kid. You talked smack all year about how Benn, Wilson, and Brent would propel Illinois from 2-10 to Big Ten title contention, and then it happened. And you got so excited that you don't know what to do for your next trick. So you jump overboard with statements about 2-star recruit Ugochukwo Uzodinma and pro potential. There is absolutely no factual basis for stating that other than the large glass of orange Koolaid sweating beside you. If Ugo has NFL potential, then there are literally thousands of football players in the 2008 recruiting classes around the country that one can claim are "sleepers" with "huge upsides". The only reason you're saying that about Ugo and not Josh Jelesky, another 2-star defensive end who is headed to Vanderbilt (and who is ranked as the 94th best DE by Scout - Ugo is not ranked for his position), is because Ugo picked Illinois.

You have to understand that if you're going to make these claims, then there are 35 other teams in the country that can make the exact same claims because they have equal or greater talent than us. I always run things through was I call "The Iowa Test". Before I post something making a claim about some Illini recruit starting as a freshman and making first team All Big Ten, I try to think of my reaction if I went to the Iowa board and read the exact same thing. And if my reaction would be to roll my eyes or LMAO, I don't post it.

Look, Kid, I've always kinda liked you. And I really enjoyed when you posted the inside information about Miami Thomas on the verge of a commitment, only to be laughed at, only to throw it back in their face when he committed two days later. Your inside info for a 17 year old kid is impressive. But don't completely ruin your rep by going off the deep end. We're gonna need devoted fans like you when the going gets rough again. And it will.

 

[shetuck]

I understand this is the general CFB discussion part of this board, but what's with the intra-illini flame war?

TIFWIW, but it's not a pretty thing. Just sayin'... :ohwell:

 

[NFBuck]

Ah yes. The infamous Kid. Love the enthusiasm, Kid, but you're doing more harm than good over here.



Old Illini fan? Maybe. 35 is the new 61.

I'll say this, Kid. I've been an Illini football fan for 25 years. As a student, I sat shirtless in the stands at Memorial Stadium with a giant N on my chest as I watched Kerry Collins lead PSU on a 96 yard drive with 2 minutes left to overcome our upset bid in 1994. I've touted the names Eric Jefferson and Mack Jacobs and Jeff Hecklinski and Lonnie Hurst and a hundred other can't-miss Illini recruits that missed. I've sat in Memorial Stadium with only 39,000 fans and watched 1-star recruits from San Jose State take down my beloved Illini. So excuse me if I'm reluctant to claim that our fringe top-20 classes will lead us to National Titles.



I fully understand that, Kid. If you read my posts earlier in this thread, I've stated repeatedly that Zook's recruiting is the best I've seen in my 20 years of following such, and that we FINALLY seem to have things on track. And if you were paying attention, you would have seen me make an 8-5 season prediction after the spring game last year, causing many on the Illiniboard to ask me to seek help. I know Zook is finally awakening the sleeping giant, but you're way, way, WAY overboard in assuming that we are becoming Miami North or Defensive Secondary U.

Last season was the worst thing that could happen to you, Kid. You talked smack all year about how Benn, Wilson, and Brent would propel Illinois from 2-10 to Big Ten title contention, and then it happened. And you got so excited that you don't know what to do for your next trick. So you jump overboard with statements about 2-star recruit Ugochukwo Uzodinma and pro potential. There is absolutely no factual basis for stating that other than the large glass of orange Koolaid sweating beside you. If Ugo has NFL potential, then there are literally thousands of football players in the 2008 recruiting classes around the country that one can claim are "sleepers" with "huge upsides". The only reason you're saying that about Ugo and not Josh Jelesky, another 2-star defensive end who is headed to Vanderbilt (and who is ranked as the 94th best DE by Scout - Ugo is not ranked for his position), is because Ugo picked Illinois.

You have to understand that if you're going to make these claims, then there are 35 other teams in the country that can make the exact same claims because they have equal or greater talent than us. I always run things through was I call "The Iowa Test". Before I post something making a claim about some Illini recruit starting as a freshman and making first team All Big Ten, I try to think of my reaction if I went to the Iowa board and read the exact same thing. And if my reaction would be to roll my eyes or LMAO, I don't post it.

Look, Kid, I've always kinda liked you. And I really enjoyed when you posted the inside information about Miami Thomas on the verge of a commitment, only to be laughed at, only to throw it back in their face when he committed two days later. Your inside info for a 17 year old kid is impressive. But don't completely ruin your rep by going off the deep end. We're gonna need devoted fans like you when the going gets rough again. And it will.

We had a very similar (same?) Texas poster a couple years back named xrayrandy (hence the jokes). He came on spouting how superior the athletes Texas had were, how every one of them were future all-americans, how they were all gonna be playing on Sundays one day, etc., etc., etc.. The difference is, his team was coming off an MNC victory, not a Rose Bowl shellacking. He predicted they were gonna whoop us by four touchdowns in the 2006 game. Of course his team followed up all that talk with a big loss to us, a couple of 3 loss seasons and failed to get back to a BCS Bowl. I hope this dude sticks around. This board always appreciates a good laugh.