Coronavirus (COVID-19) is too exciting for adults to discuss (CLOSED)

[jwinslow]

can’t wait for all the tik tok dance videos from all the overwhelmed healthcare workers we got in April and March.

Well we're off to a really nice start.

my dad had a heart scare in April. i could not visit him. he said the hospital was virtually empty in his 3 day stay.

Which isn't particularly relevant to the approach to electives now, other than to trivialize the seriousness.

just my .02. not denying the virus or anything like that. just saying what he saw and how many fucking dance videos the overwhelmed had time to do.

There are actual reports about hospitals right now if anyone cares to read them. Or we could make this about single observations 6 months ago and how easy the healthcare workers have it because of which trivial thing they did for 60 seconds instead of posting on BP, checking facebook or texting a friend.

tl:dr version: there are many hospitals at capacity or approaching it, particularly rural ones. Arguably the larger threat is being able to staff them effectively over the next few months, with so many in quarantine already.

Meanwhile, so far the death rate continues to be much, much lower than in the spring, as treatment, testing improves (though the latter is still a huge issue, a friend of mine had to wait 4.5 days to get tested last week in central ohio).

 

[Honor&Glory]

Well we're off to a really nice start.
Which isn't particularly relevant to the approach to electives now, other than to trivialize the seriousness.
There are actual reports about hospitals right now that have nothing to do with whether someone had the audacity to record a video instead of tweeting, or posting on BP or doing a host of other meaningless things that take twenty seconds.

so pointing out an empty hospital at a time when were told they were overwhelmed is trivial and meaningless because this time they really mean it??

sorry for being offended that docs and nurses where so overwhelmed in April that they had time to choreograph dance videos between rounds. how dare me.

 

[Bucklion]

Nobody other than teachers talk so much about the workload. A pandemic ..your a health care worker..this should be what you live for. Firefighters fight fires. Soldier fight wars. If you don’t like this healthcare workers you’re in the wrong occupation.

Yeah who doesn’t live for 16-hour shifts where you are fully garbed in Hazmat-level PPE and can’t eat or pee while you take care of a lot of people dying alone for a year.

You might as well say first responders “live for 9/11” while you’re at it

 

[Taosman]

What do people need to see to understand the apocalypse we are about to enter? Right now we are seeing about 1000 deaths a day. After Thanksgiving we will be seeing 3000 deaths a day. There will be no hospital beds or care available. You get sick badly enough you will die. Please, wear a mask and social distance.

 

[jwinslow]

so pointing out an empty hospital at a time when were told they were overwhelmed is trivial and meaningless because this time they really mean it??

Are you interested in discussing the current situation in hospitals? Or just mockery?

sorry for being offended that docs and nurses where so overwhelmed in April that they had time to choreograph dance videos between rounds. how dare me.

What exactly is the permissible activity from healthcare workers to avoid inciting such anger for eight months and counting?

 

[jwinslow]

Which ones and how are they "overwhelmed"?

https://www.google.com/search?q=hos...j0i20i263j0.2113j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

https://www.beaconjournal.com/story...-hospitals-capacity-dewine-update/6392454002/

As of Monday, 4,358 Ohioans remained hospitalized with COVID-19, including 1,079 in ICUs and 573 on ventilators, state data shows. Just over 75% of ICU beds were filled across Ohio on Monday.

“We have reached a defining moment in this pandemic as our hospitals in rural and metropolitan areas are aggressively managing capacity needs," John Palmer, spokesman for the Ohio Hospital Association, said via email. "This steep climb creates a severe strain on our caregivers who are braving the frontline of this pandemic."

Dr. Andrew Thomas, chief clinical officer at Ohio State University Wexner Medical Center, said hospitals are now being forced to take patients for each other in order to balance their workload where they have capacity. Thomas said that at least seven of the more than 40 hospitals in central Ohio already are delaying some elective surgeries and other services.

"Until we see cases peak and start coming down in a sustained way, we're going to see hospitalizations rise," Thomas said. "I think in the next few weeks every hospital in the state is going to have to start making tough decisions about how to staff its beds."

At University of Cincinnati Health, COVID-19 patients could soon displace those who are there for something other than virus care, CEO Dr. Richard Lofgren said. The hospital already has started looking at delaying surgeries that require an inpatient stay, Lofrgren said.

Everything has led to health-care staffs being stretched thin, he said.

"These shortages on our workforce cannot be overstated … this issue around burnout is very real," Lofgren said. "The workforce is exhausted. The exhaustion is actually palpable."

https://radio.wosu.org/post/coronav...force-another-elective-surgery-delay#stream/0

In Lima in western Ohio, coronavirus patients are entering St. Rita's Medical Center faster than other patients can be safely discharged, said Mercy Health-Lima president Rhonda Lehman.

In southwestern Ohio, hospitals are approaching the point where the number of COVID-19 patients will outnumber non-coronavirus patients, said Dr. Richard Lofgren, president and CEO of the University of Cincinnati HC Health system.

https://abc6onyourside.com/news/loc...hire-more-borrow-staff-to-meet-covid-19-surge

Union County has hired at least six staffers, including an epidemiologist, contact tracers, and testing coordinators. The county’s COVID response has cost almost $500,000, much of that money was not in the budget.

Orcena said CARES Act money was a huge help, along with money from the state and county.

“We are entirely dependent on both the governor's additional funding and the county commissioners’ support at this time to continue our response.”

The stats are that larger systems with lots of options are getting tighter but can still move pieces around for now. Rural systems are the ones getting tighter, and Ohio isn't nearly as bad so far as other states in that regard.

https://www.10tv.com/article/news/h...rise/530-2b8908ed-ea54-4da0-b0c7-e6cebe273fc8

We have to be able to take care of COVID patients and still provide vital health care for those who have heart attacks and strokes and other medical conditions, which require hospitalization," Gastaldo said. "The worst-case scenario - and we are nowhere near this - is there is not enough bed capacity to do both."

These concerns are felt not only in urban areas but in rural hospitals too.

Stacey Gabriel, President and CEO of Hocking Valley Community Hospital, said they're at 65-70% capacity right now. Before this, capacity was closer to 45-50%.

Rural hospitals often transfer patients to bigger facilities, but with space tight nearly everywhere, that is tough. On top of that, money is tight.

"Back in the spring when this all hit, we saw an automatic decline in 50% of our revenue literally overnight," Gabriel said.

While Gabriel said they are starting to recover financially, many rural hospitals cannot take another hit. They rely on elective procedures for revenue.

https://www.cleveland19.com/2020/11...s-impact-covid-pandemic-health-care-services/

Dr. Boutros, Dr. Mihaljevic, and Dr. Megerian provided an update on the hospital capacity, as of Monday morning:

• Cleveland Clinic: About 450 beds, or approximately 8% to 9%, of the hospital system’s capacity are occupied by COVID-19 patients.
• MetroHealth System: Approximately 80% of the hospital network’s capacity are occupied.
• University Hospitals: Just over 200 hospital beds, or approximately 9%, are in use; the system is currently at about 83% full.

According to Dr. Megerian, hospitalizations could quadruple in rate by Christmas if the current pace continues.

Dr. Mihaljevic said a large-scale emergency shutdown and disruptions could likely be avoided if individuals simply wore face masks, sanitized regularly, and avoided informal gatherings or socially-distanced in certain scenarios.

“Our contact tracing shows that we are not getting infected at work, but instead out living our daily lives,” Dr. Boutros suggested.

In Ohio:
Staffing is a major issue.
Capacity is a looming/potential one.
Funding is the elephant in the room.
Deaths are not a major one yet (relatively speaking) but the above can change that.

 

[Taosman]

‘We’re Drowning’:
COVID Cases Flood Hospitals In America’s Heartland
After pounding big U.S. cities in the spring, COVID-19 now has engulfed rural and small-town America.

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/covid-cases-flood-hospitals_n_5fbd255cc5b66bb88c619fe3

 

[jwinslow]

Here's a chart estimating ICU beds:
https://healthdata.gov/dataset/covi...capacity-state/resource/82e733c6-7baa-4c65#{}

So far, Ohio is not like these:

The Air Force is sending 60 healthcare workers to North Dakota to address a staffing crisis as the state has just 13 ICU beds open

The state has 13 staffed intensive care unit beds available across all of its hospitals, and 211 standard inpatient beds, according to the latest figures from the Department of Health.
...
In the seven days ending with November 15, North Dakota recorded the world's highest COVID-19 mortality rate, according to an analysis by the Federation of American Scientists. About 1 in every 1,000 people in the state have died from the virus, with the state recording 818 deaths and a population of about 762,000, according to the latest census estimate.

https://abcnews.go.com/Health/hospital-icus-running-space-due-covid-19-surges/story?id=74169792

In Wisconsin, hospitals have reached a "tipping point," so much so that they won't be able to save everyone who is sick, state health officials warned this week, according to the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel.
...
The Minnesota Department of Health is estimating that ICUs in the Twin Cities metro area are at 97% capacity, ABC Saint Paul, Minnesota, affiliate KSTP reported.

Hospitals in the area normally operate at 80% to 85% capacity, occasionally close to 90% capacity during flu season, Helen Strike, president of Allina Health's Regina and River Falls hospitals, told KSTP. Now, hospital capacity in the state is at "some of its highest levels ever," Strike said.

Jackson Mississippi is out of beds

 

[Thump]

Which ones and how are they "overwhelmed"?

Al of them.

Many hospitals are having to ship patients to other hospitals with ventilators.

 

[Bucklion]

Al of them.

Many hospitals are having to ship patients to other hospitals with ventilators.

Didn’t you hear? None of this is real. The report of 1000 caregivers out sick at the Cleveland Clinic alone? Just a lot of vacations. The doctor from a rural county on tv here last week saying he had to call 11 hospitals to try and find someone with the necessary equipment to take care of a non-COVID patient after a severe heart attack? Must have just been a lot of people out making TicTok videos. Everyone saying nationwide that PPE and space aren’t the problem now, it’s staffing because caregivers weren’t sick during the initial outbreak like they are now? Just lazy and entitled people not doing their jobs.

First rule of virus denial...never talk about virus denial

 

[Honor&Glory]

Al of them.

Many hospitals are having to ship patients to other hospitals with ventilators.

really? thought i had read 6 weeks ago that ventilators are seldom being used to treat patients as they found out early on ventilators were actually doing more harm than good? ill see if i can dig it up

 

[Thump]

really? thought i had read 6 weeks ago that ventilators are seldom being used to treat patients as they found out early on ventilators were actually doing more harm than good? ill see if i can dig it up

Watch yesterday’s Ohio daily conference.

https://w3.cdn.anvato.net/player/pr...jAwIiwid2lkdGgiOjY0MCwiaGVpZ2h0IjozNjB9#amp=1

 

[Honor&Glory]

Didn’t you hear? None of this is real. The report of 1000 caregivers out sick at the Cleveland Clinic alone? Just a lot of vacations. The doctor from a rural county on tv here last week saying he had to call 11 hospitals to try and find someone with the necessary equipment to take care of a non-COVID patient after a severe heart attack? Must have just been a lot of people out making TicTok videos. Everyone saying nationwide that PPE and space aren’t the problem now, it’s staffing because caregivers weren’t sick during the initial outbreak like they are now? Just lazy and entitled people not doing their jobs.

First rule of virus denial...never talk about virus denial

or...over blow it as the plague and cowher waiting for 50% of the population. you have your side, i have mine.

 

[Bucklion]

Watch yesterday’s Ohio daily conference.

All fake new bro, you coward

 

[Honor&Glory]

Watch yesterday’s Ohio daily conference.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/some-d...ing-ventilators-to-treat-covid-19-11589103001