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Cincinnati Bearcats (Juggalos official thread of Faygo)

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RhodeIslandBuck said:
You certainly know more than I give your experience, I have no issue defaulting here seeing as I'm basing this mostly off of my personal experience.

I would say it's more of an issue of colleges providing training at an exorbitant cost when the information is readily available for motivated folks as it is. 100 years ago, I think college made more sense for the general populace to aspire to, seeing as academic information and research were only things you could find in large libraries or around educated professors.

Now? I think it's asinine that these places charge what they do for things you can find literally anywhere with a search engine. It's not that I think colleges don't provide good training or education, it's that they're overvaluing what they provide in a modern context, hence not being as good for students as it once was. There are obvious exceptions (medical doctors, etc) but on the whole, I don't think the juice is worth the squeeze for the average person.

I believe most people's college experience is as helpful as they want it to be, to me it's always been more of about the student individually than the instruction.

I will definitely say the kids at my alma mater were definitely not the type to work 30 hours a week, mostly trust fund and prep school folks. I was a bit out of my element.
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Perfectly stated!
 
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Jaxbuck said:
I can understand making federal loans non exempt.

Protecting private lenders is just so blatantly corrupt it makes my teeth hurt. Anyone naive enough to think that big government is a good idea because they have our best interest at heart should look at this timeline and no, it isn't a party line thing. Clinton and W both oversaw parts of it.

Consumer protection act...:lol:
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Well...look at what happened 3 years later in 2008. In a lot of ways the world economy still hasn't totally recovered from that mess despite the COVID shock and aftermath to that. Politicians aren't totally to blame but they definitely share in it.
 
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DaddyBigBucks said:
I did not do this

I worked 40 hours a week and took a full load of classes

I had to just to get by. Even though my parents didn’t help me at all, my father made too much for me to get a federal grant in year one. I made too much money to get a federal grant thereafter.

Sound like an easy trap to fall into? It was. That’s why I wasn’t alone. Lots of people were in that boat. All you had to do was tell the truth on your financial aid forms. Then, while you’re walking to work on a Saturday (a car is way outside your budget), you get to hear a frat boy bragging to a sun bathing hottie that he’d just put a car stereo in his BMW with his Pell Grant

Digressions aside, I promise you that no one who was working full time while taking a full load of classes gives a single fig about the History of Art. Education for the sake of education is still an extremely elitist commodity. It’s one of the things that makes elites think they’re better than the rest of us.

Better at what? I’ve never been able to ascertain that. Unless perhaps rigging the system is considered…. They’re running the university system into the ground and pricing it to the point where it is now far more expensive than it’s worth… yeah. That’s a feature. Not a bug

As for learning things “from Google”. There are better ways of learning things from the internet, and some of those can even result in credentials, including the credentials that have made me more money than my BSEE ever did. These alternative sources of education and credentialing are starting to replace the university system, and the people at the helm of the university system have done this to themselves
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100 percent this. I was lucky because I grew up with a peer group that was in the same boat as me and we helped each other get through it. Working your way through school was easier in the 70s because tuition was dirt cheap and 4 guys could rent a house off campus and get by. Nowadays it is no longer attainable. Pay exponentially more for a worse education.
 
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BUCKYLE said:
Almost every single job in corporate America has a hard ceiling without a degree. Social work. Art history. Whatever. 20 years of experience in leadership in the industry doesn't matter a bit. You have to have a degree to prove...idk what. Not sure where im going with this. Kinda zurped out a little.
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Getting really high level here but it's like what @RhodeIslandBuck pointed out. We are what, 25 years or so into the information age?

It takes a while for old institutions to die off and the new "thing" to emerge.

Traditional higher education and it's tie-ins to the workforce are dying, they just aren't all the way dead yet. Kind of like the NCAA and NIL. They are dead institutions but the bloated corpse of their bureaucracy continues to have some inertia that makes it seem alive.
 
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BUCKYLE said:
Almost every single job in corporate America has a hard ceiling without a degree. Social work. Art history. Whatever. 20 years of experience in leadership in the industry doesn't matter a bit. You have to have a degree to prove...idk what. Not sure where im going with this. Kinda zurped out a little.
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My theory is that as a society matures it becomes more geared towards preservation of what has been achieved, particularly with respect to socio-economic status, than innovation to try to achieve, and when that happens a society becomes much more about credentials than skills. Western Europe has been like that forever, and I think the U.S. has become much more like that as it "matured" within the last 40-50 years or so. It also creates risk aversion among those who hire who, if a hire goes bad (and hiring is always somewhat of a crapshoot), would rather be able to point to a credential as an excuse for the hiring than run the risk of having taken a chance on someone who doesn't have it even if that person probably should have gotten the chance to do the job. That said, I think that's turning around, at least in some sectors of the economy, as lifelong learning and skills development, however achieved, is becoming more and more important as everything keeps changing. But it's also likely that that change is largely happening mainly once the degree threshold is reached and that those without are still largely being unjustifiably written off.
 
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Jaxbuck said:
Getting really high level here but it's like what @RhodeIslandBuck pointed out. We are what, 25 years or so into the information age?

It takes a while for old institutions to die off and the new "thing" to emerge.

Traditional higher education and it's tie-ins to the workforce are dying, they just aren't all the way dead yet. Kind of like the NCAA and NIL. They are dead institutions but the bloated corpse of their bureaucracy continues to have some inertia that makes it seem alive.
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I don't think that quite right, but I do think that we've been in an age of higher education excess and that we're going to see some culling of institutions and a lot of streamlining within institutions with a handful of elite places for the wealthy to continue much as they do now.
 
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BUCKYLE said:
Almost every single job in corporate America has a hard ceiling without a degree. Social work. Art history. Whatever. 20 years of experience in leadership in the industry doesn't matter a bit. You have to have a degree to prove...idk what. Not sure where im going with this. Kinda zurped out a little.
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See, if you had a degree in English Literature, you would have been able to come up with a more elegant ending to finish your post... With... I mean with which to finish your post.
 
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CincyInterloper said:
See, if you had a degree in English Literature, you would have been able to come up with a more elegant ending to finish your post... With... I mean with which to finish your post.
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This critique is something up with which I will not put!
 
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DaddyBigBucks said:
I did not do this

I worked 40 hours a week and took a full load of classes

I had to just to get by. Even though my parents didn’t help me at all, my father made too much for me to get a federal grant in year one. I made too much money to get a federal grant thereafter.

Sound like an easy trap to fall into? It was. That’s why I wasn’t alone. Lots of people were in that boat. All you had to do was tell the truth on your financial aid forms. Then, while you’re walking to work on a Saturday (a car is way outside your budget), you get to hear a frat boy bragging to a sun bathing hottie that he’d just put a car stereo in his BMW with his Pell Grant

Digressions aside, I promise you that no one who was working full time while taking a full load of classes gives a single fig about the History of Art. Education for the sake of education is still an extremely elitist commodity. It’s one of the things that makes elites think they’re better than the rest of us.

Better at what? I’ve never been able to ascertain that. Unless perhaps rigging the system is considered…. They’re running the university system into the ground and pricing it to the point where it is now far more expensive than it’s worth… yeah. That’s a feature. Not a bug

As for learning things “from Google”. There are better ways of learning things from the internet, and some of those can even result in credentials, including the credentials that have made me more money than my BSEE ever did. These alternative sources of education and credentialing are starting to replace the university system, and the people at the helm of the university system have done this to themselves
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Don’t know when you graduated, and I respect your determination. That said, I could work for 8 weeks in one of Dayton’s GM factories and make enough money to pay for a year - apartment, food, utilities, tuition, books. My final two years, Uncle Sam gave $50 a month for ROTC and I picked up more beer and pizza money by reffing intramural and jr hi sports. Tuition was something like 450 per quarter by 1967.
I don’t know where today’s students could work that would keep up with the cost of tuition, let alone room and board.
I understand your position on the arts, but I believe they have added to my enjoyment of life and my understanding of others.
 
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