2018 tOSU Offense Discussion

[dragurd]

UFM isn't staying out of the way either... so that's why I think they need to expand Tates role.

What bothers me is it's a god damn crutch. Meyer doesn't learn anything by leaning on Tate to fix his problems vs you know actually devising an offense around a pocket QB. We are much more dangerous if we can do both vs just relying on Meyer's stand by all the time.

 

[bukIpower]

What bothers me is it's a god damn crutch. Meyer doesn't learn anything by leaning on Tate to fix his problems vs you know actually devising an offense around a pocket QB. We are much more dangerous if we can do both vs just relying on Meyer's stand by all the time.

For sure I agree... but if it means having success then I really think we need to see Tate a little more.

We should be focused on permanent fixes to the offense but if we aren't going to do that then we have to find a way to be successful on the ground.

 

[Hstead]

I didn't understand why Tate didn't stay in the game either. He was responsible for that TD. He gained 6 from the 7 yard line and damn near got it in. He could have finished that drive. I want to see more of him too, it opened up the run game.

Jax - the players were saying after the Corn game that the coaches didn't call a RPO the entire game. I was shocked at that. Could they have been automatics vs Sparty? Maybe just carrying out fakes like our RPO but Haskins was told to give no matter what the read was trying to simplify it for the oline? Maybe he wasn't making bad reads if that was the case? Don't know.

Regarding the fat guys bending their knees, I told my old man and son I think maybe we need to quit recruiting 6'7 and 6'8" linemen and start getting some 6'4 and 6'5" guys that can get lower and get a better push?

 

[Jaxbuck]

Jax - the players were saying after the Corn game that the coaches didn't call a RPO the entire game. I was shocked at that. Could they have been automatics vs Sparty? Maybe just carrying out fakes like our RPO but Haskins was told to give no matter what the read was trying to simplify it for the oline? Maybe he wasn't making bad reads if that was the case? Don't know.

Maybe.

Then again I showed that one where he kept it in the worst possible situation.

Hard to say for sure but there are 2-3 spots I found in the first half alone where the full opened up offense with a QB who can/is allowed to read that would have gashed the shit out of the MSU defense.

Hard to imagine coaches are willing to just give that away and tell him to always hand it off.

 

[Hstead]

Maybe.

Then again I showed that one where he kept it in the worst possible situation.

Hard to say for sure but there are 2-3 spots I found in the first half alone where the full opened up offense with a QB who can/is allowed to read that would have gashed the shit out of the MSU defense.

Hard to imagine coaches are willing to just give that away and tell him to always hand it off.

I was shocked to read they didn't call any vs Corn. There is no way in hell they called a QB run when Haskins kept it up the middle.

I understand Prince wanting to be able to anticipate where his man will be during a run etc but I hope we do not abandon the RPO.

 

[kujirakira]

The much maligned running game....look at this:

#1 pre snap, it's going to be an RPO and you have a reasonable box count

View attachment 19289


#2 Guy in black forces run hard which is exactly what you want him to do. Superior athlete is circled in red and waiting for the ball to do some damage. His blocking is in gray out in front. Haskins should be able to see what's right in front of his face, pull it out and do said damage.

View attachment 19290


#3 Haskins makes an indefensibly bad read and gives the ball to the RB (red). It plays right into what the defense did (black) and ignores the haymaker (gray).

View attachment 19291


I've seen Haskins auto-give so many times this year I want to puke. When the dust settles and we get into some good off season drain circling, Haskins inability to make reads like this shouldn't get overlooked.

As near as I can tell, the coaches put the offense in a great position to succeed here and the player fucked it up.

Without seeing at speed, this looks like a good job by the defender holding position until RB has the ball. This is how good players deal with option and seen it countless time when it clicks for OLBs and S midway through an option opponent ... they stop thinking about it anymore, figure out the spacing to run out the QB and still get the RB before they can get square and going.
Depends on that player having the athleticism to split both and make up ground with the ball in the air, though.

 

[Jaxbuck]

Without seeing at speed, this looks like a good job by the defender holding position until RB has the ball. This is how good players deal with option and seen it countless time when it clicks for OLBs and S midway through an option opponent ... they stop thinking about it anymore, figure out the spacing to run out the QB and still get the RB before they can get square and going.
Depends on that player having the athleticism to split both and make up ground with the ball in the air, though.

You don't really need to see it full speed. Look at the yard lines in the still, the defender I circled is 9 yards away from the WR with his momentum going the wrong way.

No one on earth is going to change direction and cover 9+ yards faster than a good QB can throw it to that WR.

 

[kujirakira]

You don't really need to see it full speed. Look at the yard lines in the still, the defender I circled is 9 yards away from the WR with his momentum going the wrong way.

No one on earth is going to change direction and cover 9+ yards faster than a good QB can throw it to that WR.

In the 2nd shot, it's a split second after and his weight is still neutral... if anything, in good position to meet receiver before down marker with momentum (assuming he goes inside... CBs have to take boundary).
In the 3rd, RB definitively has the ball and his weight has just shifted downhill... looks like he's making 1st step

From those 2 stills it looks more like the defender is reacting to Haskins than the other way around.
Who makes the tackle? Because even if the circled defender comes downhill, we should have local superiority to the right but their DLine is getting push 1 step into the play and by the 2nd frame the 2 LBs in the box are already in good position to plug lanes while the circled OLB and opposite SS stay neutral / reacting.

 

[kujirakira]

Though I'll say I think KJ gets that 1st to the outside with how far 22 and FS were playing off.

 

[Onebuckfan]

I didn't understand why Tate didn't stay in the game either. He was responsible for that TD. He gained 6 from the 7 yard line and damn near got it in. He could have finished that drive. I want to see more of him too, it opened up the run game.

Jax - the players were saying after the Corn game that the coaches didn't call a RPO the entire game. I was shocked at that. Could they have been automatics vs Sparty? Maybe just carrying out fakes like our RPO but Haskins was told to give no matter what the read was trying to simplify it for the oline? Maybe he wasn't making bad reads if that was the case? Don't know.

Regarding the fat guys bending their knees, I told my old man and son I think maybe we need to quit recruiting 6'7 and 6'8" linemen and start getting some 6'4 and 6'5" guys that can get lower and get a better push?

Recruit real guards and centers.

 

[1926Buckeyes]

Maybe.

Then again I showed that one where he kept it in the worst possible situation.

Hard to say for sure but there are 2-3 spots I found in the first half alone where the full opened up offense with a QB who can/is allowed to read that would have gashed the shit out of the MSU defense.

Hard to imagine coaches are willing to just give that away and tell him to always hand it off.

So answer is you either the coaches are too dumb/stubborn to just run real plays without dummies oooor you have a QB would needs to live in the film room and more reps to fully operate an offense.

Tempting tempting choices

 

[Jaxbuck]

So answer is you either the coaches are too dumb/stubborn to just run real plays without dummies oooor you have a QB would needs to live in the film room and more reps to fully operate an offense.

Tempting tempting choices

I think you have a QB who is NFL level savvy at the nuances of throwing the ball (diagnosing coverage, looking off DB's, throwing receivers open etc) and just doesn't know how to do any read option.

I mean, a kid who can throw like that and can't run at all, why would he have ever done a read option in his life before he got to OSU?

 

[buckeyebri]

I think you have a QB who is NFL level savvy at the nuances of throwing the ball (diagnosing coverage, looking off DB's, throwing receivers open etc) and just doesn't know how to do any read option.

I mean, a kid who can throw like that and can't run at all, why would he have ever done a read option in his life before he got to OSU?

He did have that one nice run for a first down by the goal line that got called back. He summoned his Cardale and actually took on the defender.

 

[sparcboxbuck]

I think you have a QB who is NFL level savvy at the nuances of throwing the ball (diagnosing coverage, looking off DB's, throwing receivers open etc) and just doesn't know how to do any read option.

I mean, a kid who can throw like that and can't run at all, why would he have ever done a read option in his life before he got to OSU?

It’s puzzling. You have to guess that it’s been pointed out in film study, right? Maybe he just needs reps with the reads in real time? But I don’t know how he would be that bad... some of this has to be predetermined. Take the example with Paris in the slot ready to do damage. Is he out there to spread the D and just be a decoy? I dunno.

I long for a 6’4” 240 lb QB who can spin it like Simba, execute the read like JT and run like Brax. Where do I find me one of them?

 

[cjmik_75]

That dude plays for Bama he’s just not 6’4” 240