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- Thread starter BB73
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You'll have to forgive them. They just joined the 20th century of night games.Bucky32;1969337; said:
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Probably.....as long as one of the following happens:
1) NW goes undefeated in conference play
2) New coach Kevin Wilson turns around a terrible Indiana team and finishes in the top 3
3) Dantonio can find a way to win @ Ohio State, vs Mich & Wisconsin, then @ Nebraska in back-to-back-to-back-to-back games
4) Bo Pelini shows up as the new kid in school and just dominates everybody
5) And of course, if Fickell is able to manage his mess and actually win the conference
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JXC
17-4 since 2001
I still think Sparty wins this division, their remaining games are Minn, Iowa, Ind, and NW. That's not a tough road at all...they may slip up cuz they are Sparty, but they are going to be big favorites in the rest of their games.
Nebraska has back to back road games @ Penn State and then @ Michigan. Going to be tough to win both of those. I hope for the Buckeyes sake they beat Penn State, and I won't root for Michigan ever, but I expect them to lose one of these, probably the Michigan game. 6-2 won't be good enough to get in unless Sparty slips up, then they would own that tie breaker.
Michigan has a hell of a road ahead with road games against Iowa and Illinois, and then home games against Nebraska and Ohio State. In the past few years they would probably lose all four of these games, and while I still think that might happen, their defense is improved enough to win the road games. As I said above, I think they beat Nebraska at home, even though Nebraska is the better team, and then they choke it away at home against the Buckeyes. 6-2.
If Sparty slips up say at Iowa or Northwestern (this is Sparty remember...choke kings of the B1G) you could have a three way tie between these teams at 6-2.
All three would be 1-1 against the other 2.
So the next tie breaker is division record. Sparty would be 3-2, Nebraska would be 4-1, and Michigan would be 4-1.
So the way the tiebreaker works is that Sparty is then eliminated and you look at head to head of the other two teams. Yep...that puts Michigan in.
And here is something that is even worse.
If Michigan does beat Nebraska...and Sparty does lose to Iowa...then Michigan will already know they win all the tiebreakers before the OSU game, so they will already be in championship game before they even play us.
We on the other hand, would likely be in a situation where if we win, we are in, but if we lose we aren't.
So we very well may be looking at the situation of knowing before we even play Michigan that we have to beat them twice in a row to win the conference. It probably won't happen, but it's not as far fetched as it seemed earlier this year.
Welcome to the new B1G
Nebraska has back to back road games @ Penn State and then @ Michigan. Going to be tough to win both of those. I hope for the Buckeyes sake they beat Penn State, and I won't root for Michigan ever, but I expect them to lose one of these, probably the Michigan game. 6-2 won't be good enough to get in unless Sparty slips up, then they would own that tie breaker.
Michigan has a hell of a road ahead with road games against Iowa and Illinois, and then home games against Nebraska and Ohio State. In the past few years they would probably lose all four of these games, and while I still think that might happen, their defense is improved enough to win the road games. As I said above, I think they beat Nebraska at home, even though Nebraska is the better team, and then they choke it away at home against the Buckeyes. 6-2.
If Sparty slips up say at Iowa or Northwestern (this is Sparty remember...choke kings of the B1G) you could have a three way tie between these teams at 6-2.
All three would be 1-1 against the other 2.
So the next tie breaker is division record. Sparty would be 3-2, Nebraska would be 4-1, and Michigan would be 4-1.
So the way the tiebreaker works is that Sparty is then eliminated and you look at head to head of the other two teams. Yep...that puts Michigan in.
And here is something that is even worse.
If Michigan does beat Nebraska...and Sparty does lose to Iowa...then Michigan will already know they win all the tiebreakers before the OSU game, so they will already be in championship game before they even play us.
We on the other hand, would likely be in a situation where if we win, we are in, but if we lose we aren't.
So we very well may be looking at the situation of knowing before we even play Michigan that we have to beat them twice in a row to win the conference. It probably won't happen, but it's not as far fetched as it seemed earlier this year.
Welcome to the new B1G
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Good stuff, JXC. Hopefully this will make it somewhat easier to track and understand:
Team......Conf..Div-Wins...........Div-Losses.....Div-Remng..........Cross-Remng
MSU.......3-1...TSUN...............NEB............Minn,@Ia,@NW.......Ind
Neb.......3-1...Minn,MSU...........----...........NW,@TSUN,IA.........@PSU
TSUN......3-1...Minn,NW............MSU............@Iowa,Neb..........@Ill,tOSU
Iowa......2-2...NW.................Minn...........TSUN,MSU,@Neb......@Purd
Conference record in all games is the first thing. B1G Tiebreakers first go to head-to-head, so 2-ways are easy, and 3-ways are easy if 1 team beat both of the others. But the 3-way tie where they each beat each other goes to the team with the fewest losses within the division. After that, it gets weird and complicated.
If TSUN loses to Nebraska, TSUN is almost dead since they'd have 2 losses and lose virtually all of the tiebreakers to either MSU or Neb.
If TSUN beats Nebraska, the possibility of the complicated 3-way tie comes into play. As JXC said, if Sparty's second loss is to either Minn/Iowa/NW, they'd have 2 losses within the division and they'd lose that 3-way tie since Nebraska would only have 1 divisional loss (If TSUN's second loss is to Iowa), and they'd lose the 3-way tie to TSUN if TSUN beats Nebraska and their second loss is to tOSU or Illinois.
Team......Conf..Div-Wins...........Div-Losses.....Div-Remng..........Cross-Remng
MSU.......3-1...TSUN...............NEB............Minn,@Ia,@NW.......Ind
Neb.......3-1...Minn,MSU...........----...........NW,@TSUN,IA.........@PSU
TSUN......3-1...Minn,NW............MSU............@Iowa,Neb..........@Ill,tOSU
Iowa......2-2...NW.................Minn...........TSUN,MSU,@Neb......@Purd
Conference record in all games is the first thing. B1G Tiebreakers first go to head-to-head, so 2-ways are easy, and 3-ways are easy if 1 team beat both of the others. But the 3-way tie where they each beat each other goes to the team with the fewest losses within the division. After that, it gets weird and complicated.
If TSUN loses to Nebraska, TSUN is almost dead since they'd have 2 losses and lose virtually all of the tiebreakers to either MSU or Neb.
If TSUN beats Nebraska, the possibility of the complicated 3-way tie comes into play. As JXC said, if Sparty's second loss is to either Minn/Iowa/NW, they'd have 2 losses within the division and they'd lose that 3-way tie since Nebraska would only have 1 divisional loss (If TSUN's second loss is to Iowa), and they'd lose the 3-way tie to TSUN if TSUN beats Nebraska and their second loss is to tOSU or Illinois.
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BB73;2023883; said:
This begs a question:
Does Luke Fickell keep his job if he goes 2-0 against TSUN in his first year at the helm?
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Gatorubet;2023885; said:
Divisional play certainly has its positives and negatives. It adds excitement to the mix as more teams are in play going into November than the past. However, there are weird quirks that just don't sit right, such as the one you mention.
The other quirk that doesn't sit right with me is how a divisional champion is decided. One part of me gets why it is based upon how you perform in all of your conference games, but there is another part that thinks a divisional champion should be based only on divisional play.
I look at one possible scenario this year where Ohio State could go 5-0 in their division, yet not win it if Penn State doesn't lose another game besides Ohio State and goes 4-1 in the division. Again, part of me gets it as they would have a better conference record; but the other part of me asks if Ohio State is undefeated in the division and beats Penn State, why should their two losses against non-divisional opponents affect the division's outcome? It gets even worse when one looks at the cross-divisional opponents of the two schools: Ohio State has Nebraska (7-1), Michigan State (6-2), and Michigan (7-1); while Penn State has Nebraska (7-1), Iowa (5-3), and Northwestern (3-5). Something just doesn't sit right with such a scenario.
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knapplc
Nebraska is a Volleyball school
buckeyegrad;2024930; said:
The matchups of the first two seasons were created solely to generate TV ratings. It sucks for some of us, but it may be better for the conference overall.
Nebraska's cross-division games are Ohio State, Penn State and Bucky. You're not even remotely trying to be fair if you create that schedule for Nebraska and leave Purdue, Indiana and Illinois off, just like Ohio State isn't being remotely treated fairly with TSUN, Sparty and NU.
You just have to fall on your sword for the greater good of the Big Ten and do your best.
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knapplc;2025123; said:
Exactly the kind of comment we could have expected from Longhorn fans if Texas had joined the conference. [/sarcasm]
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Zurp
I have misplaced my pants.
DaddyBigBucks;2024343; said:
Nice!
Troy Smith was 3-0 against Michigan in 3 years.
Terrelle Pryor was 3-0 against Michigan in 3 years.
Braxton Miller MAY be 2-0 against Michigan in 1 year.
I still don't like divisional play. But 2 wins over Michigan in 2011 would help me endure this better.
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