Ohio State @ Pittsburgh, Friday, Nov. 28, 7 PM, ESPN2

[Mike80]

I see us struggling to get .500 in conference

I agree. In fact, I kinda don't see them approaching .500.

Diebler may be recruiting well but it won’t matter if they make the transition to good college players. He is embarrassingly out of his league. I was in favor of hiring him but it was clearly a mistake. Bjork needs to make the tough decision after the season. OSU should be a tourney team 3 out of 4 seasons

I don't think this program is in a position to fire Diebler yet. Like it or not, Ohio State is not a destination spot and likely never will be. The state doesn't produce enough in-state talent, basketball is always going to be 2nd fiddle to football no matter how some people may wish it were otherwise, and while no one will outright say it, the NIL money just isn't there. Resetting the program, again, just digs the hole to relevancy a little deeper.

I think you almost have to give him a 3rd year at this point, given the full rebuild he faced in year 1 and all that unless the bottom completely falls out. They fired Holtmann who was winning at a rate above the program's historical average, and if Diebler somehow gets them to 20 wins, he will be somewhere north of the .612 program winning percentage as well.

As for the 3 out of 4 seasons - other than the Matta era, they've NEVER done that. The only reason they are at 22 out of 40 (this season will be 41) since the field expanded in 1984/85, is because Matta had 9 (9 out of 13 seasons) of them on his own. For the record, Holtmann is tied for 2nd place in that timespan with Jim O'Brien with 4 - both 4 appearances out of 7 season, although Holtmann was almost certainly making it in 2020 when COVID shut the world down.

 

[buckeyemania11]

I agree. In fact, I kinda don't see them approaching .500.

I don't think this program is in a position to fire Diebler yet. Like it or not, Ohio State is not a destination spot and likely never will be. The state doesn't produce enough in-state talent, basketball is always going to be 2nd fiddle to football no matter how some people may wish it were otherwise, and while no one will outright say it, the NIL money just isn't there. Resetting the program, again, just digs the hole to relevancy a little deeper.

I think you almost have to give him a 3rd year at this point, given the full rebuild he faced in year 1 and all that unless the bottom completely falls out. They fired Holtmann who was winning at a rate above the program's historical average, and if Diebler somehow gets them to 20 wins, he will be somewhere north of the .612 program winning percentage as well.

As for the 3 out of 4 seasons - other than the Matta era, they've NEVER done that. The only reason they are at 22 out of 40 (this season will be 41) since the field expanded in 1984/85, is because Matta had 9 (9 out of 13 seasons) of them on his own. For the record, Holtmann is tied for 2nd place in that timespan with Jim O'Brien with 4 - both 4 appearances out of 7 season, although Holtmann was almost certainly making it in 2020 when COVID shut the world down.

Agreed you basically have to give him a 3rd year but with the on court results looking like a carbon copy of Holtmann it's hard to get enthused even with a pretty good class coming in next year

 

[Mike80]

Agreed you basically have to give him a 3rd year but with the on court results looking like a carbon copy of Holtmann it's hard to get enthused even with a pretty good class coming in next year

Frankly a carbon copy of Holtmann would be a nice turnaround.

The dude did win at a 67% clip until the last two seasons did him in. I don't think anyone would say boo at that.

The toughness aspect hasn't been around since Craft graduated.

 

[DZ83CK]

I would say OSU has a shortage in terms of live bodies out there, big, strong, athletic guys who can mix it up and handle the physicality of a team like Pitt. Let's not downplay Pitt's player, he had a good game, obviously they have a type - strong, athletic, active players - and OSU didn't have enough of those guys to match up with them.

 

[DaveyBoy]

I agree. In fact, I kinda don't see them approaching .500.

I don't think this program is in a position to fire Diebler yet. Like it or not, Ohio State is not a destination spot and likely never will be. The state doesn't produce enough in-state talent, basketball is always going to be 2nd fiddle to football no matter how some people may wish it were otherwise, and while no one will outright say it, the NIL money just isn't there. Resetting the program, again, just digs the hole to relevancy a little deeper.

I don’t see how OSU can’t be a perennial power like Michigan, Tennessee, Texas, Florida, Miami, and USC. Something’s off and it‘s Athletics Directors who don’t care to push The program…….except Geiger

Michigan shouldn’t be a destination yet it is. Texas, Tennessee, USC….all decent to good basketball powers. I guess I’m just in the school of thought that our ADs haven’t dared to demand basketball excellence…..except Geiger and that got us Matta. Gene Smith waited too long to pull the trigger on Matta (somewhat understandable ) and Matta (absolutely late). Bjork can let is slide or find a big name.

I think you almost have to give him a 3rd year at this point, given the full rebuild he faced in year 1 and all that unless the bottom completely falls out. They fired Holtmann who was winning at a rate above the program's historical average, and if Diebler somehow gets them to 20 wins, he will be somewhere north of the .612 program winning percentage as well.

As for the 3 out of 4 seasons - other than the Matta era, they've NEVER done that. The only reason they are at 22 out of 40 (this season will be 41) since the field expanded in 1984/85, is because Matta had 9 (9 out of 13 seasons) of them on his own. For the record, Holtmann is tied for 2nd place in that timespan with Jim O'Brien with 4 - both 4 appearances out of 7 season, although Holtmann was almost certainly making it in 2020 when COVID shut the world down.

OSU is the worst BB program of all the power football schools , except ND.

 

[buckeyemania11]

Frankly a carbon copy of Holtmann would be a nice turnaround.

The dude did win at a 67% clip until the last two seasons did him in. I don't think anyone would say boo at that.

The toughness aspect hasn't been around since Craft graduated.

The talent isn't upper end elite or anything but this roster has enough where we should probably make the tournament but more than likely we won't.

The last 2 seasons is mostly what I mean when it comes to the Holtmann carbon copy

 

[buckeyemania11]

I would say OSU has a shortage in terms of live bodies out there, big, strong, athletic guys who can mix it up and handle the physicality of a team like Pitt. Let's not downplay Pitt's player, he had a good game, obviously they have a type - strong, athletic, active players - and OSU didn't have enough of those guys to match up with them.

Pitt as a team is bad though and this team has no business losing to them. 2 games prior they got beat by a rather mediocre UCF team and low major Quinnipiac. Pitt was also without their 2nd leading scorer in this game.....there's just no way to excuse this one.

 

[DZ83CK]

Pitt as a team is bad though and this team has no business losing to them. 2 games prior they got beat by a rather mediocre UCF team and low major Quinnipiac. Pitt was also without their 2nd leading scorer in this game.....there's just no way to excuse this one.

It's definitely a bad loss, it exposed the athletic deficiencies that OSU has in the frontcourt. Just not great in that regard. Obviously OSU isn't a top-25 team or anything, no one here said they were, so every road game against a power conference team is a lose-able game no matter who the opponent has lost to.

 

[DZ83CK]

The two issues I take with Diebler in this game are 1) not playing Colin White and Gabe Cupps more in the first half when Pitt was out-hustling the Buckeyes. They got at least 10 offensive rebounds the first half. 2) in the last-second play, you have to guard the in-bounder and force the guy who catches the ball to change direction. You can't let the guy dribble straight across the court into a shot like that.

 

[Zem]

Next year's Buckeyes basketball coach, Anthony Grant, has his Flyers up on #9 BYU at the half. On espin.

 

[Mike80]

I don’t see how OSU can’t be a perennial power like Michigan, Tennessee, Texas, Florida, Miami, and USC. Something’s off and it‘s Athletics Directors who don’t care to push The program…….except Geiger

OSU is the worst BB program of all the power football schools , except ND.

Let's split these statements up.

First - they might, except the history isn't there. It's entirely about perception. The perception of Ohio State isn't that of a basketball powerhouse. That was starting to change under Matta but the more we move away from his era, the more and more he looks like a complete unicorn.

Also, Cryami and USC aren't perennial powers. Not even remotely close. Tennessee sucked forever until Bruce Pearl showed up and lucked their way into Rick Barnes when he got canned by Texas. As for Texas, they are the closest to the whole perennial power thing, but if we're talking perennial powers in basketball, Texas isn't that either.

Second - it's not even close to the worst of whatever definition of power football schools you want to use is - I could say Ole Miss, you could say TCUN (not a power in football without cheating), I could say Alabama, you could say Nate Oats to which I would counter what was Alabama during Saban's peak (which was not good and far worse than every year but 1 year in the past 20 for Ohio State) - but it's whatever you want to pick and choose to see. UGA? Florida has sucked at football since Urban left, they aren't a powerhouse anymore. Oklahoma?

It's just not going to happen here unless some sort of positive consistency is allowed to build the program up. That means both the good and the bad. Changing out coaches every 2 years isn't how you do that. Changing out coaches every 2 years - especially coaches that are winning at or above the historical norm for the program - is a surefire way to deconstruct a program entirely.

 

[Mike80]

Next year's Buckeyes basketball coach, Anthony Grant, has his Flyers up on #9 BYU at the half. On espin.

Lost by 12 to an uber-shitty Cincy team. If we're going to fire Diebler, Grant is just more of the same....

 

[Mike80]

The talent isn't upper end elite or anything but this roster has enough where we should probably make the tournament but more than likely we won't.

The last 2 seasons is mostly what I mean when it comes to the Holtmann carbon copy

I mean he is in the Holtmann tree - he was the guy everyone wanted after going 8-3 after firing Holtmann. You get what you get I guess. I think a full roster construction gets him 3 years to fix the roster issues - especially if, as I said, the NIL is restricted and I think it is.

Firing him isn't the answer. Tonight was inexcusable I agree.

 

[Fungo Squiggly]

I do know Thad Matta believed in guarding the in-bounds pass in late-game situations, and it was very rare that OSU lost with a late lead under Matta. As soon as Holtmann came in, the late-game philosophy backfired and OSU has constantly lost games in spite of late leads. The officiating definitely hurt OSU down the stretch in this game, but that being said, it was a big mistake to not guard the in-bounds pass with 3.9 seconds left. Make them take extra time off the clock having to catch the ball in the backcourt, or else throw long.

Especially when you have two 7 footers. Put one on the inbounder, please. Instead, an uncontested inbound and then he was allowed to weave all the way down the court. If you are leaving the inbounder undefended, you should have a 5-on-4 advantage and be able to throw 2 defenders at the ball handler.

 

[DZ83CK]

Especially when you have two 7 footers. Put one on the inbounder, please. Instead, an uncontested inbound and then he was allowed to weave all the way down the court. If you are leaving the inbounder undefended, you should have a 5-on-4 advantage and be able to throw 2 defenders at the ball handler.

For sure.

I should also add another one of the reasons Matta had more success in holding late leads is he coached his teams to avoid fouling. It didn't always go according to plan, the tendency is life on the road involves lots of fouls being called against you, but strategically trying not to foul is the smart move. Putting Pitt in the bonus very early in the second half hurt OSU's chances of winning this game for sure. If Pitt had been good from the foul line, they would have been the team with the lead late.