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Herbie questions the system

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Bucklion you underestimate the Alumni. They provide alot of money to the university. If that stadium doesn't fill because we start losing to teams like NW then shit will hit the fan. I don't give a shit if Bear Bryant or Woody Hayes were reincarnated and starting coaching again. 2-3 years at .500 and/or no bowl game for a couple years would get them canned. With limited schollies and parity in the game you can run a program in the ground really fast just ask JoePa.

I hate to say this but i'm not gonna cry for a guy that makes 7 digits a year. I bust my ass and make a hell of alot less. The cold reality is produce or get canned. If you think he can have teams that are mediocre or worse year after year you are sadly mistaken. Personally I don't give a shit whos coach I just want to have a respectable program that can compete year after year. I know you cannot win the NC every year but we look like a shit sandwich right now and I cannot remember a worse OSU team. I think this team rivals the 87 squad as of right now.
 
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I'm not crying for him either, Brutus, trust me, and I am not sadly mistaken. And no, I don't underestimate the alumni, my parents are alumni and I've been amongst alumni my entire life. I do know a few things, based on experience:


1) People will not stop buying tickets, even if we drop games to NW. It just won't happen. There are thousands of people who would like to buy tickets that currently can't, and they would pick up the slack easily if people stopped buying them. It is true that they won't be able to gouge your eyeballs out quite as much with the prices if the team is losing, however.

2) Andy Geiger will not fire Jim Tressel...period. The last thing he wants to do is hire a new coach, and feed the "graveyard" label as I said before. Think we had a hard time getting a coach before? Try luring a gamer away from a sweet deal somewhere else with the possibility of being fired 2 years after winning the school's first title in almost 40 years.

3) The President has more to do with the coach than the alumni. Alumni were pissed for years at Cooper, who could never beat Michigan or win a Bowl game, and never won a title and never really seemed to fit in. Cooper's first few years warranted a coaching change a hell of a lot more than Tressel's, but as long as Gordon Gee was at OSU, Cooper was going nowhere. Only after Gee left did Cooper get axed, and that was at least a year after he should have. That said, Karen Holbrook cares absolutely nothing about the football team whatsoever,it is an annoyance to her. Her goal is to clean up the image of the school, fans, and team, by cracking down on tailgating and ridding the team of "bad elements". If Tressel even makes an attempt to cut out the bad seeds and graduates 60-70% of the players, she could care less what the record is.

4) Jim Tressel is from Ohio, has won a title, has beaten Michigan 2/3, and has won 2 BCS bowl games. It will take 5-7 years for him to overwrite those accomplishments and fall to the level of firability, and that is assuming that the above conditions are also met.

5) Anyone thinking we are canning Tressel anytime soo to get Urban Meyer, Bobby Petrino, Kirk Ferentz, John Gruden, or anyone else are living in fantasy land. I'm not saying Tressel is perfect, or above harsh criticizm, but these are the facts.
 
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If he has an unmitigated disaster that lasts several seasons, that is goes 5-6 or worse and drops all 3 or 4 games to Michigan over the next 3 or 4 years, you would probably see the AD make a change, especially if Geiger has retired. However, if he goes 5-6 this year, beats Michigan and wins the Motor City Bowl next year and goes 7-5, and then goes 5-6 the following year, he will not be fired. He has bought himself some considerable time, and he is in a situation right now where wins and losses don't matter as much to the people who count the most as they once did. But yes, if we ge flushed totally down the shitter, he's gone, but if we aren't, he won't.
 
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Jiminy Francisco Kyrist, how many times do I have to bring up the fact that Tressel's 1995 YSU team nosedived to 3-8 immediately after a 4-year national title game run, only to turn around and win the national title again just two years later and appear in the title game yet again two years after that? He's 3-3 this year and people are already talking about Ohio State going 4-7 or 5-6 for two or three seasons. We've had one losing season (1988) in 36 years. We haven't had two consecutive losing seasons in 80 years (1923-1924). We've had a grand total of five losing seasons in the last 79 years and eight losing seasons in the last 105 years, so even if we should end up 5-6 this year, it'll be the last losing season here for a long time. Climb back into the boat already... :roll1:
 
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Bucklion said:
However, if he goes 5-6 this year, beats Michigan and wins the Motor City Bowl next year and goes 7-5, and then goes 5-6 the following year, he will not be fired.
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I think this kind of talk is a little premature. Regardless of that though, I don't think you're right. ANY coach at OSU who runs a string of records like that over 3 years is history.
 
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brutus2002 said:
Tressel needs to realize this is not DIV 1AA.
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I think he is aware of the change of venue.

brutus2002 said:
He will adapt or he will lose his job. It's really that simple.
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Can I rephrase this to 'He will win or he will lose his job"?

Semantics aside, there will be no change in JT's philosophy (i.e. strong defense and special teams with a mistake free and opportunistic offense).

The only person who will be adapting (I hope) is Bollman when he is looking for a new position.

brutus2002 said:
The alumni will not take 2 years in a row without a bowl game or three years around .500.
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Back to the future Marty!

We're not there yet.

The optimist in me says that it is still possible to win out, including our bowl game this year.

If I told you at the beginning of the year we would go 9-3, beat scUM, win our bowl game, but lose 3 conference games - would you take it?

I am of the belief that once we fix our running game woes - osugrad21's "domino theory" will reverse itself into positive mometum.

brutus2002 said:
There are alot of hot coaches out there right now. Petrino(Louisville) and Meyer(Utah) would be some guys OSU would have to at least look at. I agree that the NC bought him 2 years but the guy better wake up and realize this is OSU and losing will not be tolorated by the Alumni.
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Is JT asleep at the wheel?

There are only 2 coaches in the last 40 years in the Big Tean who have won a NC.

One of them is on our sideline.

Dumping him after his first sub-par season is like dumping Angelina Jolie b/c she had a bad hair day.
 
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Is JT asleep at the wheel?

There are only 2 coaches in the last 40 years in the Big Tean who have won a NC.

One of them is on our sideline.

Dumping him after his first sub-par season is like dumping Angelina Jolie b/c she had a bad hair day.
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you definately dont want to see what's being said over on BN then. The latest compilation in stupidity is that any season resulting in a 9-2 record or worse is a down year, and kirk barton is just a bad player because he struggled in his first ever start at times against matt roth last saturday.
 
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"We like to listen to any constructive critisicm - we'll take that to heart" !!!! What is that !!?? Who is running this team...... Seems to me, I would have something more earth shattering to say in response to being ripped by a former player than that. Especially two years removed from a National Championship. I think Tressel has some adjustments to make given the collective ability and desire of this team, but overall he has played Buckeye football since arriving here. Besides, he probably has to get a hall pass from the board of trustees to change his play book. This whole situation is just starting to become extremely annoying. What next, call him three loss Tress ??
 
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Like I said Mili I hope he does right the ship. He better start with getting rid of the O-line coach and second getting an O-coordinator.

If we cannot run the ball better than this year in the years to come our record will not be much better. You can forget a NC anytime soon with 30 yards on 30 carries.

This isn't a "call for his job post" this a "please wake the fuck up post so I don't destroy another ten remote controllers". I don't see us running the table. If we win 6 games I will be happy at this point. Can we run the table maybe. We need to change alot and treat Indiana as the first game of the year.

Can OSU win the NC next year hell yes we can. Does there need to be coaches getting a pink card hell yes. Do we need to alter the way we play(I'm not saying overhaul but at least be a little more unpredictable) hell yes. I'm sorry but everything isn't peachy and I'm not a fair weathered fan. I'm a fan thats worried as hell about my beloved buckeyes who have had the worst 4 year stretch of running the ball in the modern era of college football.

I hear people harping on that we don't have the talent and 2002 recruiting class is overrated. There are coaches in the B10 that would give their right arm for two linebackers like Hawk and Carpenter. Give Ted Ginn, Devon Lyons, Holms, Hall ,and Childress to Tiller and see what Purdues offense would look like afterwards. Talent is not the issue Coaching, attitude, and discipline are.
 
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Look when Tressel came here he put in the same offense that the Penguins ran over there at D-1AA. Since he's came here he's basically had the best defenses in the nation, and probably one of the worst offenses in the NCAA. I just don't think he's ready to give up on HIS WAYS on offense. Seriously we've sucked since he's got here on offense. Now that his left hand is gone (Dantonio) we're struggling on Defense too. Now we've done fine on defense/special teams since he's been here, and we all know he knows that. Right now we just need someone else to call the plays besides Tressel/Bolman. Fire Bollman, and spend some of that millions of dollars this team recieves to buy a damn blocking sled and teach these boys how to win it up front. Also if Snyder don't get it going even after next year (when IMO we should be the best in the nation on defense) then maybe we should look for a new D-coordinator too.

I think its too early to talk firing of tressel, but honestly I'm having a hard time looking at OSU's remaining schedule and picking out wins? I don't see a for sure win left. This team could very well lose out, and they could very well win the rest its all up to them. If tressel were to lose to Michigan this year, next years and go consecutive years at 5-6 or 6-5 he'll feel tons of pressure.

Also with tressel having bollman as coordinator really troubles me.... I plan on being a head coach sometime and it'd be like me having my best friend calling the plays of my offense. Trust me if that happened I wouldn't win a damn game.

I love Tressel and I know he can get it done, and who am I to tell him what to do, but everyone can see our offense has struggled for 4 years in his system. The players can only "NOT" execute for so long.
 
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