Grad & Frito Semantics

[osugrad21]

Some in this discussion are referring to an offer to Saddler as a 'gift' while others claim he'd sit on the bench for 5 years, as if he is totally unqualified. That's simply not true. He's a very gifted athlete. And he happens also to be an excellent student.

What is untrue is your interpretation of my usage of "gift."

Read the post again before you use my words...

If Cam earns an offer on his own merit...great.
However, offering a kid just to get another piece of the puzzle is asking for trouble...especially when the "gift" offer is the leader of the two and is very influential in the relationship.

I said if the offer was simply to get Hale, then it was bad news...the "gift" referred to that type of situation only.

Offering a guy who can score TDs off kicks and punts isn't a 'gift'..

Once again, read and comprehend before you make such a statement.

 

[FritoBandito]

What is untrue is your interpretation of my usage of "gift."

Read the post again before you use my words...

I said if the offer was simply to get Hale, then it was bad news...the "gift" referred to that type of situation only.

With all due respect, Capo [and fully aware that I am taking my life in my hands by challenging a Moderator/Administrator]...

I think I know the meaning of the word 'gift' in the English language and I think I know exactly how and why you used it.

I am simply suggesting that offering a scholarship to a guy who:
1. already holds offers from scUM, WVA and several other good programs
2. scored 20 TDs last year at an elite Pennsylvania high school
3. has sub-4.4 speed
4. ran back 7 kicks/punts for TDs
5. blocked a dozen kicks on special teams, and
6. comes pre-packaged with one of the best LBs in the country
is NOT a 'gift' ...by anyone's reasonable definition.

I think that many of us are angry over the perception that tOSU is somehow being extorted into offering Saddler. I understand that and I don't like it much myself. But getting angry is no substitute for thinking this through rationally.

The question should be: Do Hale and Saddler together make a greater contribution to the Buckeyes than the other two players we'd get if we didn't land them?

It seems pretty clear that we could get them both if we offered Saddler, but might not get either if we don't.

So who's the next best LB we know we can land simply by offering and how does he compare to Hale? And who is the player we'll land with our last scholarship and how does he compare to Saddler?

I don't know the answers to those questions, but I think that, logically, it's probably a pretty close call. As I said in my last post, I'll absolutely trust JT and staff to make the right decision. But I'm not going to oppose the package idea out-of-hand, simply out of hubris -- arriving at the decision emotionally and then trying to justify it rationally.

Capo, I am not so much arguing for Saddler as I am against making this decision emotionally. I think your use of terms like 'gift' and 'bad news' reveal more emotion than reason. With all due respect.

 

[osugrad21]

With all due respect, Capo [and fully aware that I am taking my life in my hands by challenging a Moderator/Administrator]...

I think I know the meaning of the word 'gift' in the English language and I think I know exactly how and why you used it.

I am simply suggesting that offering a scholarship to a guy who:
1. already holds offers from scUM, WVA and several other good programs
2. scored 20 TDs last year at an elite Pennsylvania high school
3. has sub-4.4 speed
4. ran back 7 kicks/punts for TDs
5. blocked a dozen kicks on special teams, and
6. comes pre-packaged with one of the best LBs in the country
is NOT a 'gift' ...by anyone's reasonable definition.

I think that many of us are angry over the perception that tOSU is somehow being extorted into offering Saddler. I understand that and I don't like it much myself. But getting angry is no substitute for thinking this through rationally.

The question should be: Do Hale and Saddler together make a greater contribution to the Buckeyes than the other two players we'd get if we didn't land them?

It seems pretty clear that we could get them both if we offered Saddler, but might not get either if we don't.

So who's the next best LB we know we can land simply by offering and how does he compare to Hale? And who is the player we'll land with our last scholarship and how does he compare to Saddler?

I don't know the answers to those questions, but I think that, logically, it's probably a pretty close call. As I said in my last post, I'll absolutely trust JT and staff to make the right decision. But I'm not going to oppose the package idea out-of-hand, simply out of hubris -- arriving at the decision emotionally and then trying to justify it rationally.

Capo, I am not so much arguing for Saddler as I am against making this decision emotionally. I think your use of terms like 'gift' and 'bad news' reveal more emotion than reason. With all due respect.

Show me where I called Saddler's offer a "gift."

I used "gift" as pertaining to a specific situation. If you look above, I also said if Cam earns his own offer, "great." I was speaking in terms of a general situation where one player is offered for the sole purpose of gaining another. The usage of the "gift" refers to Saddler in that sense only.

Don't put words in my mouth or in my post...or tell me that I am angry over a situation or letting my emotions get in the way. I think I have more than proven that is not my style after the past years in this forum.

I certainly do not need you or anyone else speaking for me or translating my posts...if I have something to say, I will certainly say it point blank while keeping the purpose of this forum at the point.

But I'm not going to oppose the package idea out-of-hand, simply out of hubris -- arriving at the decision emotionally and then trying to justify it rationally.

Capo, I am not so much arguing for Saddler as I am against making this decision emotionally. I think your use of terms like 'gift' and 'bad news' reveal more emotion than reason.

This is the portion I am directly referencing as your point of zero comprehension.

If ANY player is offered as a "gift" to get another player, it can add up to "bad news" in the locker room. I'm not sure how else to explain it to you...

One more time though, if Cameron Saddler earns an offer based on his play/performance/potential...wonderful. If he is offered to simply get Shayne Hale, I am not at all for that.

Anything further we can discuss in PMs...we've both defended our statements.