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Ft Hood Tragedy

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cincibuck;1585104; said:
Losing it is not uncommon close to deployment. I was on the firing line at Ft. Lewis in 1968, doing a pre-deployment familiarization firing of the M-16, when an 18 year old lost it and put a round through his head before the safety folks could get to him.

As for what is wrong, this is a very small force, never intended as a force to fight an extended war. The 1990s planning for this force was based on the assumption ala 1935, that a small, well trained army, would turn around and train a huge draft expanded army. Political/public refusal to embrace the draft means we have to keep sending the same kids on multiple tours. It is tearing the Army and Marine Corps apart. The losses, through resignation, in NCOs and company grade officers have been staggering and these folks are the backbone of the force.
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That is only half of part of the equation. While we are a smaller force doing alot more, we also have to deal with new soldiers that just aren't up to par. I can't set back and say they are shitbags and try to chapter them out. It is my responsibility to try and bring these soldiers up to the standard. All of that focus on one or two takes away from my time to train other soldiers in the art of combat. All in all, the quality of recruits have gone way down, but with less thatn 2% of the populaton ever raising their right hand I really can't be picky.
 
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I must dissagree with you on that. Some Soldiers aren't up to par. It used to be much easier to chapter a Soldier. It can be a long drawn out process now. Most of my Soldiers are at least as good as the ones coming in 20 years ago if not better. There is a saying thrown around in the Army that 5% of your Soldiers will take up 95% of your time. By my observations that certainly seems to be the case. Nearly all of my Soldiers performed well above what was asked of them, but those few grabbed all of my attention and detracted away from all of the good that was being done. We would try to get rid of the bad ones, sometimes successfully, sometimes not. To say today's Soldiers are substandard is absolute BS.
 
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My non-military experience opinion. Soldiers in WWII served at max from 12/1941 to spring 1945. Tens to hundreds of thousands had stress/combat fatigue issues - some for life. I remember Audie Murphy's wife writing about how he almost choked her to death one night while he was having nightmares (she said he would wake up shivering and covered in sweat on a regular basis).

These guys and gals today have been under stress from two to three or four times as many weeks/months/years as those guys were in combat. The military culture that leads you to suck it up instead of going to the shrink is also a reason for not wanting be known as a head case. Advancement and performance evaluations could depend on the soldier not being seen as "weak".

We do not help our military families as much as we should. Their lives are turned upside down by deployment, and if guard or reserve, they come back to no job and unemployment, while the loss of income resulting from honoring their commitment leads to financial distress and divorce - which leads to more stress.

Sucks. Really sucks. It seems we look to the military to save us from the bad guys, and then we turn our backs on them when we are done. If we have a deficit, I would like it to be from helping the families of those who serve and for giving every damn one of them the physical and psychiatric help that they deserve.
 
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Gatorubet;1585422; said:
My non-military experience opinion. Soldiers in WWII served at max from 12/1941 to spring 1945. Tens to hundreds of thousands had stress/combat fatigue issues - some for life. I remember Audie Murphy's wife writing about how he almost choked her to death one night while he was having nightmares (she said he would wake up shivering and covered in sweat on a regular basis).

These guys and gals today have been under stress from two to three or four times as many weeks/months/years as those guys were in combat. The military culture that leads you to suck it up instead of going to the shrink is also a reason for not wanting be known as a head case. Advancement and performance evaluations could depend on the soldier not being seen as "weak".

We do not help our military families as much as we should. Their lives are turned upside down by deployment, and if guard or reserve, they come back to no job and unemployment, while the loss of income resulting from honoring their commitment leads to financial distress and divorce - which leads to more stress.

Sucks. Really sucks. It seems we look to the military to save us from the bad guys, and then we turn our backs on them when we are done. If we have a deficit, I would like it to be from helping the families of those who serve and for giving every damn one of them the physical and psychiatric help that they deserve.
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the highlighted portion of your statement is incorrect. ESGR does not allow people to be fired because of it.

Employer Resource Guide

However, an employer can stop paying the individual if their military commitment is going to be a long one.

What position is the employee entitled to upon reemployment?
As a general rule, the employee is entitled to reemployment in the job position that he or she would have attained with reasonable certainty if not for the absence due to military service. This position is known as the escalator position. The principle behind the escalator position is that, if not for the period of military service, the employee could have been principle requires that the employee be reemployed in a position that reflects with reasonable certainty the pay, benefits, seniority, and other job perquisites, that he or she would have attained if not for the period of service.
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Muck;1585174; said:
On base? Military trial.

Next stop a seat on death row next to Hasan Akbar (and likely John Russell).
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cincibuck;1585183; said:
Pretty sure this ends up in a Military Court. State and County have no jurisdiction on a government post.
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thats what i thought. thanks guys.

Gatorubet;1585422; said:
My non-military experience opinion. Soldiers in WWII served at max from 12/1941 to spring 1945. Tens to hundreds of thousands had stress/combat fatigue issues - some for life. I remember Audie Murphy's wife writing about how he almost choked her to death one night while he was having nightmares (she said he would wake up shivering and covered in sweat on a regular basis).

These guys and gals today have been under stress from two to three or four times as many weeks/months/years as those guys were in combat. The military culture that leads you to suck it up instead of going to the shrink is also a reason for not wanting be known as a head case. Advancement and performance evaluations could depend on the soldier not being seen as "weak".

We do not help our military families as much as we should. Their lives are turned upside down by deployment, and if guard or reserve, they come back to no job and unemployment, while the loss of income resulting from honoring their commitment leads to financial distress and divorce - which leads to more stress.

Sucks. Really sucks. It seems we look to the military to save us from the bad guys, and then we turn our backs on them when we are done. If we have a deficit, I would like it to be from helping the families of those who serve and for giving every damn one of them the physical and psychiatric help that they deserve.
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toss in the advent of the helicopter and you have much more front line/"combat" time.
 
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jimotis4heisman;1585102; said:
will he likely be tried in texas or by the mil? in texas you can pretty much already assume the death penalty, no?
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He will be tried by both military and likely civilian courts. The military will slap him with plenty of Articles, try him and convict him to a military prison. If the local PD and/or FBI is able to any incriminating evidence in his off base house, he will then also be tried by civilian courts.

Even if the incident were to happen off base, the Major would still get hit with Article's (outlayed by the UCMJ) and charges such as Conduct Unbecoming of an Officer, (possible) Treason, Disobeying the local laws, etc.

The first sentence he will serve will be in a military prison. This means he will get his ass beat on a daily basis by bigger and badder mother [censored]s.

Personally I say they throw a military fund raiser by doing a public hanging - military gets in free of course - pay per view it and viola ECONOMY STIMULATED!!!!

In seriousness, it always hurts to see fallen brothers and sisters go, hurts even more to see them leave this life in a brutal and unjustifiable way. RIP to all my fellow comrades...
 
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kippy1040;1585145; said:
This is all beginning to bother me in a very disturbing way. I am retired and enjoying the good life. I served my country to defend us from the enemy forces. I am proud of that and i thank all of my fellow servicemen for doing the same. When sirhan-sirhan gunned down RFK in 1968, i awoke and said to my wife, "My God what is this country of ours coming to".

The tables of time are ever turning in history and some say that History will repeat itself. I don't know about that. Maybe there is some good logic to it, but where is this Country of ours headed? Many fear that we will be taken over by an Islamic power in future years. I kind of wonder about that and my son is scoffing at that notion and tells me not to worry. But now this has me worried. I really enjoy the Buckeye Planet for all the good wisdom and common logic that i read out there from all of you. But should i worry here? Yes i am an old fart but i still enjoy the good life and i want to continue to its fullest. Such acts of Tragedy like this has to stop soon.
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Kippy, my point wasn't an apology for this person. It was a statement that, even if this guy yelled Allah u Akbar! before he fired (which is not confirmed by the way), he seems to be a pretty tormented guy. Every bit as sick as the Christian guy who shot those folks he worked with in Orlando yesterday.

I am afraid that these acts are not going to stop until we address the problem of the extremes of wealth and poverty in the world. With global communication allowing people sitting in tribal villages to see what the good like looks like, the fire is lit again every day.
 
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osucollegebuck;1585687; said:
When is Obama gonna get some balls and call this maniac a coward for his actions. This president is a joke!!!!!!
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Good idea. Let's insult people sitting on the edge and encourage another nut to act out.

Exactly how does the President of the United States show his courage by calling this man a coward?

Our goal is to understand and stop this kind of senseless attack on Americans. We need to understand it and then convince others to stop it.

This kind of invective is unnecessary and unproductive.
 
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sepia5;1585691; said:
Don't try to politicize this. A national tragedy like this should be above remarks like yours.
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It's going to be politicized whether you like it or not.

The left will say that the military is stretched too thinly and that we need to disengage.

The right will say this is further proof that we need to finish the job in Afghanistan and Iraq and get the hell out of there.

The funny part is both are, in their own way, right for a change. Is the military spread pretty thin? You betcha. Even with the increases in recruiting goals and record retain-ability goals being met, continued deployments suck and no one has ever said any differently. (yes I understand my link is just for the army)...

Army Cuts Re-Enlistment Goal

But the President is pretty naive if he's saying things like "We can't truly know the shooter's motives" and thinks that this is going to play well given the reported postings on the internet and what the shooter shouted when he started shooting. It's pretty clear the guy was at least emulating what he views (or viewed as I last heard he's still on a ventilator) that he believed in.
 
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