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- Thread starter Buckeye Dan
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calibuck
Too soon old, too late smart
Help me out here.......I read the article on Bucknuts, and read the subsequent posts on this thread. Notwithstanding that I didn't understand half of what the article said, I left with the impression that a) OSU players were in not-so-great shape; b) they will be in better shape because of all the 'fourth quarter drills' that they are doing.
OK, maybe one of you guys who did all this stuff.......is this such a new and novel approach? It seemed that the original strength and conditioning coaches were doing a great shape....but here comes the new guy, and they did better.... and now the new guy and even better. I realize that the soon-to-be pros went to this guy up in Cleveland to get them ready for the combine, but has this field advanced so greatly in just a few years that we are behind?
It seems like some sort of hype, as 'gassers' have been around for many years. Interval training has also. Granted, strength and flexibility training (ballet for basketballers?) has had its day in the sun.
Don't ALL major programs have someone of this ilk doing the training? And PS, having Butch Reynolds as the 'speed' coach is tremendous, but it sounds like we're going to blow everyone off the planet. I hope it's true, but Texas is looming up pretty quick. Thanks to anyone who can help clear away the fog (in rereading this, it appears that I've rambled a scooch)......
But hey, :gobucks3: :gobucks4:
OK, maybe one of you guys who did all this stuff.......is this such a new and novel approach? It seemed that the original strength and conditioning coaches were doing a great shape....but here comes the new guy, and they did better.... and now the new guy and even better. I realize that the soon-to-be pros went to this guy up in Cleveland to get them ready for the combine, but has this field advanced so greatly in just a few years that we are behind?
It seems like some sort of hype, as 'gassers' have been around for many years. Interval training has also. Granted, strength and flexibility training (ballet for basketballers?) has had its day in the sun.
Don't ALL major programs have someone of this ilk doing the training? And PS, having Butch Reynolds as the 'speed' coach is tremendous, but it sounds like we're going to blow everyone off the planet. I hope it's true, but Texas is looming up pretty quick. Thanks to anyone who can help clear away the fog (in rereading this, it appears that I've rambled a scooch)......
But hey, :gobucks3: :gobucks4:
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gobucks19
JT's #1 recruit
I don't think its a matter that Lichter has come up with some new ground-breaking training technology that will revolutionize football. I think its a matter of his ability to adapt existing S&C techniques to football and specific position types on the field [ie cheetahs, lions, bears]. Eric appears to have knack for tailoring workouts to certain position players, it appears he is doing the same thing with respect to the team workouts as well [ie the gassers tailored for fourth quarter conditioning].Help me out here.......I read the article on Bucknuts, and read the subsequent posts on this thread. Notwithstanding that I didn't understand half of what the article said, I left with the impression that a) OSU players were in not-so-great shape; b) they will be in better shape because of all the 'fourth quarter drills' that they are doing.
OK, maybe one of you guys who did all this stuff.......is this such a new and novel approach? It seemed that the original strength and conditioning coaches were doing a great shape....but here comes the new guy, and they did better.... and now the new guy and even better. I realize that the soon-to-be pros went to this guy up in Cleveland to get them ready for the combine, but has this field advanced so greatly in just a few years that we are behind?
It seems like some sort of hype, as 'gassers' have been around for many years. Interval training has also. Granted, strength and flexibility training (ballet for basketballers?) has had its day in the sun.
Don't ALL major programs have someone of this ilk doing the training? And PS, having Butch Reynolds as the 'speed' coach is tremendous, but it sounds like we're going to blow everyone off the planet. I hope it's true, but Texas is looming up pretty quick. Thanks to anyone who can help clear away the fog (in rereading this, it appears that I've rambled a scooch)......
But hey, :gobucks3: :gobucks4:
To some it may sound a little hokey with the animal names and such but to me it sounds like the "next step" in conditioning for these guys. As someone pointed out earlier, Johnson may have just hit his ceiling in terms of his ability to get more out of the players with respect to strength and conditioning. That is no disrespect to Johnson its just that Eric seems to be bringing something new and fresh to program that the players truly appear to be embracing.
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timBUCK2
Tim the Enchanter... WOLVERINE SLAYER!!
It sounds like the key here is getting the kids to buy into his program and really push themselves harder than they did for Johnson.
Working out to get bigger and stronger is motivation in itself for some people (see Kudla, linemen). Eric's system seems to be designed to target every position (Cheetahs, Lions and Bears) and every individual player. This may help improve the motivation of skill position players, who can sometimes get away with not being stronger than their opponent.
When all of our guys see their workout routine directly translating into improving their football abilities, they're going to be hitting the weights and drills with a ferocity many of them have never had.
The reports of immediate results can probably be attributed to this increased motivation and killer instinct attitude. Also, any changes to a workout routine tend to produce better results, because the body adapts over time to any routine causing old workouts become less effective at building speed and strength.
Working out to get bigger and stronger is motivation in itself for some people (see Kudla, linemen). Eric's system seems to be designed to target every position (Cheetahs, Lions and Bears) and every individual player. This may help improve the motivation of skill position players, who can sometimes get away with not being stronger than their opponent.
When all of our guys see their workout routine directly translating into improving their football abilities, they're going to be hitting the weights and drills with a ferocity many of them have never had.
The reports of immediate results can probably be attributed to this increased motivation and killer instinct attitude. Also, any changes to a workout routine tend to produce better results, because the body adapts over time to any routine causing old workouts become less effective at building speed and strength.
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I think the only thing Lichter needs to do to motivate the players is show them a copy of Donte Whitner's contract.
Lichter has proven, time and time again, that his methods will shave 2-tenths off of a 40, a shuttle, and a cone-drill, add two inches to a players' verticle, plus a few extra reps at 225. He manages this even after the players have just completed a full season and have less than four months to prepare for the draft under Lichter's instruction.
If you look at all of Lichter's clients combined, he has made them hundreds of millions of extra dollars on draft day, whether its the NFL or NBA.
If that doesn't motivate the players, nothing will.
Lichter has proven, time and time again, that his methods will shave 2-tenths off of a 40, a shuttle, and a cone-drill, add two inches to a players' verticle, plus a few extra reps at 225. He manages this even after the players have just completed a full season and have less than four months to prepare for the draft under Lichter's instruction.
If you look at all of Lichter's clients combined, he has made them hundreds of millions of extra dollars on draft day, whether its the NFL or NBA.
If that doesn't motivate the players, nothing will.
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calibuck
Too soon old, too late smart
Agree with gobucks19 and Dryden that maybe a 'fresh' approach is needed. If we would recall, the strength coach before had all the pro-Bucks working out in the off season that Coop would love to parade in front of the bug-eyed recruits.
But new ideas are key, and LIchter seems to have the pedigree, and can get the kids to 'buy-in' to the new program.
I can't wait until it's fourth quarter, Buckeyes down by four, on our own five and see if the conditioning/training/motivation will get them over the top. I hope so, thirteen times.
Thanks, and :gobucks3: :gobucks4:
But new ideas are key, and LIchter seems to have the pedigree, and can get the kids to 'buy-in' to the new program.
I can't wait until it's fourth quarter, Buckeyes down by four, on our own five and see if the conditioning/training/motivation will get them over the top. I hope so, thirteen times.
Thanks, and :gobucks3: :gobucks4:
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When did you even see a Tressel team ever fold in the fourth quarter? As mentioned above, I think Lichter simply tweaks the workouts to an even higher level for each position.
If there was a Sentence of the Year Award...
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Dispatch
Current, former OSU players mix during workouts
Both sides get to see the benefits the others enjoy as they work up a sweat
Sunday, July 23, 2006
Josh Moss
THE COLUMBUS DISPATCH
<!--PHOTOS--> <table class="phototableright" align="right" border="0"> <!-- begin large ad code --> <tbody><tr><td> <table align="center"> <tbody><tr><td align="center">
</td></tr> <tr><td class="credit" width="200"> CHRIS RUSSELL DISPATCH </td></tr> <tr><td class="cutline" width="200">Will Allen is one of a number of former Buckeyes who return to Ohio State for workouts before NFL training camps begin. </td></tr> </tbody></table> </td></tr> </tbody> </table>
Tackling sleds rested untouched on the sideline. Orange coolers sat empty. On this recent sunny morning at the Woody Hayes Athletic Center, the only equipment being used on the football field were microphones, light stands and tripods to record former Ohio State football players Mike Doss and Will Allen for a magazine article.
OSU quarterback Troy Smith lobbed a football to Doss, which Allen intercepted. Doss then picked off a pass while covering Allen. All of it was staged. Then Doss and Allen stood shoulder to shoulder for some still photos.
"(The photographer) didn’t tell me to do anything," Doss said.
"Here, do this," Allen said as he folded his arms over his chest.
Cameras click the two NFL players, Doss in his blue Indianapolis Colts mesh shorts, Allen in his gray Tampa Bay Buccaneers T-shirt that reads "Bucs Strength."
The photo shoot then ended and the camera crews dispersed. Doss and Allen were free to do what they came to do in Columbus.
"I have to get a workout in," Allen said.
Each summer before NFL training camps begin, former OSU players spend time working out and catching up with current Buckeyes players. In addition to Doss and Allen, Bobby Carpenter, A.J. Hawk, Mike Vrabel and Donte Whitner were among the returning players last week. The pros became Buckeyes again.
And it wasn’t just the pros who motivated the college athletes.
"In the NFL, you’re in a routine. Everybody is doing their own thing," Doss said. "The advantage of coming back is still seeing the hunger in the younger guys. In college, you’re not getting paid. It makes you remember where you came from."
Doss and Allen had solid careers at OSU. Doss was a three-time All-American (2000-02); Allen received the honor in 2003. And they both were members of the secondary on the Buckeyes’ 2002 national championship team.
The Colts drafted Doss in the second round of the 2003 draft; the Buccaneers chose Allen a year later in the fourth round. Both will enter their respective training camps this week as starting safeties.
"When younger guys see where (NFL players) have been and where they are now, it’s motivation," OSU strength coach Eric Lichter said. "The younger guys see them pull up in their nice cars. Some of them aspire for those things."
For others, the mere thought of becoming better college athletes is enough motivation.
As Doss and Allen entered the weight room, Vernon Gholston, a sophomore defensive lineman, was already lying on his back, reaching over his head and grabbing an 18-pound medicine ball. He crunched his abs, bounced the ball off the wall and caught it without budging from his sit-up position. Then he did it again. Crunch. Bounce. Catch. Crunch. Bounce. Catch. Gholston dripped with sweat.
"I like this weight room because there is no air conditioning in here," Lichter said. "But it’s 10 degrees cooler in here than it is in Texas. If I had it my way, I’d have it 10 degrees hotter."
Because of a construction project, the Buckeyes’ current "weight room" is a fenced-in stretch of turf inside the center, where piles of weight plates and lifting belts customarily cover the ground.
It is here where Doss and Allen return to college.
"Guys in general put a lot more intensity into their training during the college years," Lichter said. "(NFL) players associate their hard work in college with where they are today. It’s their roots."
Doss and Allen hopped on the incline bench press just like the current players. They did biceps curls and shoulder shrugs and sweated like Gholston. Doss and Allen were workout partners, but between sets they chatted with current players such as Ted Ginn Jr. and Smith about football and girls.
"Hey, let’s go!" Lichter shouted, encouraging the athletes to focus on getting stronger. "Come on now! "
They slowly got back to lifting weights. But after each set, Doss and Allen talked and laughed with the younger players. They were all teammates again, and it became difficult to distinguish the NFL players from the Buckeyes.
"I like being around my old teammates. I like the camaraderie," Allen said. "Just seeing everybody is great."
Current, former OSU players mix during workouts
Both sides get to see the benefits the others enjoy as they work up a sweat
Sunday, July 23, 2006
Josh Moss
THE COLUMBUS DISPATCH
<!--PHOTOS--> <table class="phototableright" align="right" border="0"> <!-- begin large ad code --> <tbody><tr><td> <table align="center"> <tbody><tr><td align="center">
Tackling sleds rested untouched on the sideline. Orange coolers sat empty. On this recent sunny morning at the Woody Hayes Athletic Center, the only equipment being used on the football field were microphones, light stands and tripods to record former Ohio State football players Mike Doss and Will Allen for a magazine article.
OSU quarterback Troy Smith lobbed a football to Doss, which Allen intercepted. Doss then picked off a pass while covering Allen. All of it was staged. Then Doss and Allen stood shoulder to shoulder for some still photos.
"(The photographer) didn’t tell me to do anything," Doss said.
"Here, do this," Allen said as he folded his arms over his chest.
Cameras click the two NFL players, Doss in his blue Indianapolis Colts mesh shorts, Allen in his gray Tampa Bay Buccaneers T-shirt that reads "Bucs Strength."
The photo shoot then ended and the camera crews dispersed. Doss and Allen were free to do what they came to do in Columbus.
"I have to get a workout in," Allen said.
Each summer before NFL training camps begin, former OSU players spend time working out and catching up with current Buckeyes players. In addition to Doss and Allen, Bobby Carpenter, A.J. Hawk, Mike Vrabel and Donte Whitner were among the returning players last week. The pros became Buckeyes again.
And it wasn’t just the pros who motivated the college athletes.
"In the NFL, you’re in a routine. Everybody is doing their own thing," Doss said. "The advantage of coming back is still seeing the hunger in the younger guys. In college, you’re not getting paid. It makes you remember where you came from."
Doss and Allen had solid careers at OSU. Doss was a three-time All-American (2000-02); Allen received the honor in 2003. And they both were members of the secondary on the Buckeyes’ 2002 national championship team.
The Colts drafted Doss in the second round of the 2003 draft; the Buccaneers chose Allen a year later in the fourth round. Both will enter their respective training camps this week as starting safeties.
"When younger guys see where (NFL players) have been and where they are now, it’s motivation," OSU strength coach Eric Lichter said. "The younger guys see them pull up in their nice cars. Some of them aspire for those things."
For others, the mere thought of becoming better college athletes is enough motivation.
As Doss and Allen entered the weight room, Vernon Gholston, a sophomore defensive lineman, was already lying on his back, reaching over his head and grabbing an 18-pound medicine ball. He crunched his abs, bounced the ball off the wall and caught it without budging from his sit-up position. Then he did it again. Crunch. Bounce. Catch. Crunch. Bounce. Catch. Gholston dripped with sweat.
"I like this weight room because there is no air conditioning in here," Lichter said. "But it’s 10 degrees cooler in here than it is in Texas. If I had it my way, I’d have it 10 degrees hotter."
Because of a construction project, the Buckeyes’ current "weight room" is a fenced-in stretch of turf inside the center, where piles of weight plates and lifting belts customarily cover the ground.
It is here where Doss and Allen return to college.
"Guys in general put a lot more intensity into their training during the college years," Lichter said. "(NFL) players associate their hard work in college with where they are today. It’s their roots."
Doss and Allen hopped on the incline bench press just like the current players. They did biceps curls and shoulder shrugs and sweated like Gholston. Doss and Allen were workout partners, but between sets they chatted with current players such as Ted Ginn Jr. and Smith about football and girls.
"Hey, let’s go!" Lichter shouted, encouraging the athletes to focus on getting stronger. "Come on now! "
They slowly got back to lifting weights. But after each set, Doss and Allen talked and laughed with the younger players. They were all teammates again, and it became difficult to distinguish the NFL players from the Buckeyes.
"I like being around my old teammates. I like the camaraderie," Allen said. "Just seeing everybody is great."
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ZachDumas
Banned
New techniques?
Lichter does not have any 'new' ideas or techniques. He simply understands the key concepts such as muscle physiology, kinesiology, etc. and how it can be used in a program that has the greatest chance to TRANSFER to on-field performance enhancement.
Think of it this way, the "old school" strength coaches were your old physical education teacher.
Lichter would be a teacher that could teach phys. ed, but probably would feel more at home in the science/physiology lab.
ALSO, great to see the pros excited about coming back to train. I hope that they are not a significant distraction to Lichter's program, i.e. timed sets, interval training.
QUESTION: Do these guys need to be grads or pursuing a degree to train at tOSU or has that rule been changed?
Lichter does not have any 'new' ideas or techniques. He simply understands the key concepts such as muscle physiology, kinesiology, etc. and how it can be used in a program that has the greatest chance to TRANSFER to on-field performance enhancement.
Think of it this way, the "old school" strength coaches were your old physical education teacher.
Lichter would be a teacher that could teach phys. ed, but probably would feel more at home in the science/physiology lab.
ALSO, great to see the pros excited about coming back to train. I hope that they are not a significant distraction to Lichter's program, i.e. timed sets, interval training.
QUESTION: Do these guys need to be grads or pursuing a degree to train at tOSU or has that rule been changed?
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ol104
RIP Neutron Man
This may have already been touched on the thread...saw a infomercial the other day selling some weight machine and it was being endorsed by a pretty big bald guy by the name of Eric Lichter. Some of the stuff he was talking about in the commercial were almost identical to some of his quotes about the players new training techniques.
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